2009 MLB season discussion*

[Cephius]

I feel bad for the Maris family, after all they went through that year and seeing Mac kiss the bat and all that shit, what an insult.

[Hex]

You act like drugs weren't used back in the 60's in baseball. It may not have been steroids but they had their own drug problems. I don't care what people say, I still firmly believe Steroids aren't going to help your hand eye coordination.

I'm just glad he admitted it. Everyone knew it, no reason to hide it. I'm sure it was embarrassing to come clean.

[*Shinzon*]

If more teams don't start showing an interest in him, Damon's going to have to take that paycut if he wants to play any baseball next year.

He's going to take a cut period. At least half of what he earned in his last two years with the yanks. The problem is most clubs don't want to pay even that. I'd expect him to earn no more than 6~m based on what the other DH players got so far.

You act like drugs weren't used back in the 60's in baseball. It may not have been steroids but they had their own drug problems. I don't care what people say, I still firmly believe Steroids aren't going to help your hand eye coordination.

I'm just glad he admitted it. Everyone knew it, no reason to hide it. I'm sure it was embarrassing to come clean.

It's not a matter of coordination. He could hit. The question is, could he have hit for power as consistently as needed to break that record without the extra strength provided by the roids.

[Cephius]

You act like drugs weren't used back in the 60's in baseball. It may not have been steroids but they had their own drug problems. I don't care what people say, I still firmly believe Steroids aren't going to help your hand eye coordination.

I'm just glad he admitted it. Everyone knew it, no reason to hide it. I'm sure it was embarrassing to come clean.

Are you really suggesting that steroids don't help someone hit home runs? Or that roids had nothing to do with Bonds/McGwire/Sosa/etc hit a billion home runs? I sure hope not.

Steroids' effect on a baseball player is a LOT different than shooting up coke or being a heavy drinker, I think that'd be obvious.

[Eticket]

Hopefully now they can come to some resolution on the 'steroids era' in relation to the Hall.

I can't believe they'd keep Bonds, Rodriguez and McGwire out... or Pettite or Clemens even now that I think about it.

The sad thing is that eventually they'll probably all get in while Rose and Jackson still sit out on the curb despite having a much less negative impact on the game.

[Cephius]

People don't like liars. McGwire in, A-rod in, Clemens out, Bonds out until they come clean. Pettitte isn't a hall of famer in my opinion anyway.

[Akiyama]

Pettite, in my opinion, is not a hall of famer. He's never consistently dominated any period of time. He's always been second/third fiddle to better pitchers in his era.

What I'm curious of is if Pedro did roids. I know it's not fair to ask, but then again.. who can you really trust?

[Orph]

Pettite, in my opinion, is not a hall of famer. He's never consistently dominated any period of time. He's always been second/third fiddle to better pitchers in his era.

What I'm curious of is if Pedro did roids. I know it's not fair to ask, but then again.. who can you really trust?

I don't think its fair to keep anyone out that deserves to be in if they never failed a drug test.

[Cephius]

Even if he did roids, Pedro's numbers are so digusting you can't keep him out. Especially considering that he did it in the AL east, in a small park, and in the middle of the roids era

[Akiyama]

Eh? Who are you referring to? I'm talking about keeping Pettite out due ot his numbers, not the HGH he admitted to. And even still, he admitted to HGH, did he not? I'd keep him out for that too.

As far as Pedro, I'm not saying he did obviously. I'm just curious if he did. The hitters during that era did, after all, so what stops him from evening himself with the hitters so he could still be dominant? I like Pedro too, so he's one of the guys I hope didn't use.

[Cephius]

I hate Pedro's guts and wish he'd take a long walk off a short pier but he was still the most dominant pitcher I've ever seen

[Moss]

Andy Pettite in the HoF is a joke.

As far as hitters in the steroid era like Big Mac/Sosa/Bonds, I think they should be voted in, just include in their little HoF bio "Suspected of steroid use" or "Admitted to use of HGH." Just like I agree with Bill Simmons that Pete Rose should be in the Hall, just put "Cheated on baseball" on his plaque or whatever. I think it's kind fo stupid to just ignore a whole era of baseball, just acknlowledge the accomplishments with a disclaimer that steroid use was widespread.

Akiyama have you read anything to lead you to believe Pedro used performance enhancers or are you just speculating since he was so good?

[Akiyama]

No. Bonds sure, but Sosa/McGwire? For what? Hitting somewhat average and a shit ton of homers? I don't think they deserve to get in. What else did they even do? :/

[Moss]

Was trying to say they shouldn't be discounted because they used steroids.

Upon looking at their stats I think they both deserve to get in. Sosa hit 609 HR - from '98-'01 he hit 66, 63, 50, and 64 HRs with BAs of .308, .288, .320, and .328 - his OPS was also over 1.000 each year - that's a pretty dominant stretch. McGwire had a career OPS of .982 over 16 seasons. If you don't think they should get in from the 'roid use that's fine, but they definitely had the stats.

[Dense]

I hate Pedro's guts and wish he'd take a long walk off a short pier but he was still the most dominant pitcher I've ever seen

Nolan Ryan
The Rocket
Randy Johnson

At least all as dominant as Pedro.

As for the roids, I think it's a tough call. I lived near Wrigley field in 98, the year when Sosa and McGuire were doing the home-run derby. I think all of this admission of steroids really taints that era. It suddenly steals the thunder from all of those moments and feelings that fans of the game were having for such a year.

[Moss]

Nolan Ryan
The Rocket
Randy Johnson

At least all as dominant as Pedro.

Strikeout wise yeah, but Pedro's 2000 season was insane: 1.74 ERA 284 Ks .737 WHIP. Pedro from '99-'03 might be the most dominant stretch of all time.

[Akiyama]

It's comparable to Sandy Koufax's 61-64 seasons, really. Even a little better due to the time Pedro pitched in. Still, even with the steroid era, I think Koufax's 1963 season was fucking absurd.

[Moss]

Yeah, definitely have to consider rule changes(mound height) and other era differences.

[Akiyama]

Yeah, definitely have to consider rule changes(mound height) and other era differences.

Yeah, but Koufax had over 300 K's, 20 complete games.. 11 shut outs, etc. Just fucking crazy, but yeah.. rules and what not.

[Melena]

No. Bonds sure, but Sosa/McGwire? For what? Hitting somewhat average and a shit ton of homers? I don't think they deserve to get in. What else did they even do? :/

Only saved baseball from dying a horrible slow death due to shitty attendance cause owners and unions are a bunch of fucking retards and can't agree on anything that does not benefit them 100% and will shit on the fans to get there way. Attendance was way down and people were MLB who when asked about baseball. Ratings down, attendance down, all of a sudden the most hallowed record is about to be broken not by 1, but two people and all of a sudden everyone was tuning into any game that was cardinals or cubs.

Homeruns sell tickets to the casual fans, not 1-0, 2-1 pitching masterpieces.