ZULU Linkshell of Fenrir

[trinironnie]

i want sigs like them

[altwight]

Which HNM are you guys camping now, when your on BG it's because your bored as fuck camping something for 30 minutes waiting for that 60 second window

people still think there's windows inside windows? Given a few stray NMs yea but not HNMs.

[tom]

Devek is in denial ,he knows what's going on ,but he trying to defend Exodu's honor .Problem is they have none ,they actualy havent had any since HP broke ,back then they were cool people ,but i guess this Merc bussiness they are into know has changed most of them.

The server is pretty broke ,how many Ixi capes u have in storage to sell?Cant Sellem huh?
how long will it take to replace 15+ relics and a Burtang ,how long will it take to replace all the members that left for Velefor ,or the ones that split before the banhammer that came from Fenrir?

All you haveto show is that you can pull Faffhog ,wow congradulations,by pulling some kings you will replace everything you lost.I laugh @ that and @ you.
I'm just waiting for round 2 of the banning to start lets see how many toons you can buy ,how much money will it take to stay ion this game to claim faf lololol.

[Devek]

I think stating that you recruited a Galka BLM who fulltime uses Rune Chopper states more about the status of your LS than anything. Also, Devek's answer screams "Yes we sold gil to purchase a high dollar bot for the LS, but the gil/dollar amounts and the name of the bot you said are wrong".

Narse, all I expect is for people to be consistent with their accusations.

If they really believe we have a superbot or something, why would they bother to camp against us and lose? Why don't they find something else to do, leave the server, or just quit?

SE isn't going to start banning people based off of accusation alone. Next thing you know LB will create an online petition to get us banned and try to get people to sign it, that will work for sure.

[Issac]

Damn their sigs are the sex.

[tom]

Cause we do what we want and laugh at you while were doing it.

[Narse]

Narse, all I expect is for people to be consistent with their accusations.

If they really believe we have a superbot or something, why would they bother to camp against us and lose? Why don't they find something else to do, leave the server, or just quit?

SE isn't going to start banning people based off of accusation alone. Next thing you know LB will create an online petition to get us banned and try to get people to sign it, that will work for sure.

Well, personally I believe your LS purchased such a bot, but it won't stop our LS from camping against you. All the 'super bots' do is link together and spread out claim times. Great for effectively covering the spread of the possible claim delay, but far from unbeatable. And of course they're not gonna ban people on accusations alone. I don't expect to see people getting banned from botting any time soon, if they're smart about it.

However, the fellow who stirred up this pot does have a valid point (in my opinion at least) in the potential for your previously banned members to just be banned again. Even if they use different payment info, I'm quite sure SE is smart enough to look at a STF report of (banned character) playing (current character) now, and look into where that character is being logged in from in comparison to the one who was banned, and at what times these logins started occuring regularly.

[Devek]

All the 'super bots' do is link together and spread out claim times. Great for effectively covering the spread of the possible claim delay, but far from unbeatable.

App already links together and spreads out claims times with linked camping enabled for $19.95.

Why would that fuzz sell two different products that do the same thing? Why would people pay $2500, $3500, or even $6500(according to some) for something they already had? Would would people be reporting any success? I highly doubt the other linkshells are too dumb to figure out how to spread out their times (manually or with linked camping).

I'm quite sure SE is smart enough to look at a STF report of (banned character) playing (current character) now, and look into where that character is being logged in from in comparison to the one who was banned

You have to remember that CSI was just a television show. There is no visual basic script that will give you a person's home address with just an IP(which changes over time). SE is not the FBI so they can't subpoena or ask ISPs to find out who was using which IP address at what time. Even if they started using the courts to find out that information, would it be a breach of the TOS for me to play FFXI on my laptop from the home of someone that was banned? What about married people, roommates, or people who play in game rooms?

The best they could do is start banning people who used the same ISP as people who were banned and all that would do is ban a lot of innocent people. My home ISP is Cox, my work ISP is Verizon, and my best friend has AT&T. If I had been banned in "round 1", that means that SE would have to ban everyone in Oklahoma that used Cox, Verizon, or AT&T in "round 2".

[didgist]

Can we get a Zulu Maat's Cap count? Ho-check, NASA can't get you that.

Nowhere near half as epic as old Nora hacking threads :/

Throw out these pussies and their sigs and bring back Dark Knights who solo Jailers and LS's who hack shit people haven't even done legitimately yet. If Nora was still around they would have Fenrirs' first Pandy kill months ago. They would be stupid enough to hack it with 18 people and then come here bragging, and you'd all be sitting around with your dicks in one hand and your lame ass bot drama in the other.

Fenrir used to give BG quality flame thread fodder and now all we can come up with is this shit? Cap demands real hacks, and real sigs too. Fucking-A they are boring, I really hope the "dope sigs" posts are sarcasm. Are people really that retarded about shiny things?

OP says yes.


Thank you BG for not censoring/deleting anything even if it's fucking retarded.

[Narse]

App already links together and spreads out claims times with linked camping enabled for $19.95.

Why would that fuzz sell two different products that do the same thing? Why would people pay $2500, $3500, or even $6500(according to some) for something they already had? Would would people be reporting any success? I highly doubt the other linkshells are too dumb to figure out how to spread out their times (manually or with linked camping).



You have to remember that CSI was just a television show. There is no visual basic script that will give you a person's home address with just an IP(which changes over time). SE is not the FBI so they can't subpoena or ask ISPs to find out who was using which IP address at what time. Even if they started using the courts to find out that information, would it be a breach of the TOS for me to play FFXI on my laptop from the home of someone that was banned? What about married people, roommates, or people who play in game rooms?

The best they could do is start banning people who used the same ISP as people who were banned and all that would do is ban a lot of innocent people. My home ISP is Cox, my work ISP is Verizon, and my best friend has AT&T. If I had been banned in "round 1", that means that SE would have to ban everyone in Oklahoma that used Cox, Verizon, or AT&T in "round 2".

Wow Devek, you must think I'm a fuckin' moron. This isn't CSI shit, and yeah I know IPs are generally dynamic, but you don't need to be a god damned detective to reverse-trace IPs backwards to a certain extent. Hell, even my LS forums can do it. If you think SE has no knowledge about where in the world you're logging on from you're a god damned idiot. Do you REALLY think they don't have the ability to look into a GM call made about, let's say Daonlytruazn being banned, and then coming back on Topinzaghi, and check where and when Topinzaghi has been logging in and compare it to Daonlytruazn? I mean, REALLY? Do you think you need a god damn subpoena to do this?

I'm not saying they're gonna go into all this and be able to definitively draw the conclusion that Daonlytruazn = Topinzaghi, but you also have to keep in mind this isn't a legal case. They don't have to prove 'beyond a reasonable doubt' that the characters are the same. Fact is that neither of us know the criteria for them to come to the conclusion, and to say so confidently that they won't be able to figure this out is retarded on your part. Combine that with the fact that people may be referring to a banned member by their old name (Linkshell chat shows Daonlytruazn responds to Dao and now all of the sudden Topinzaghi responds to Dao whereas he wasn't ever called this name before Jan 22nd)... I mean... really Devek...

As far as the super bot thing goes, I dunno, my LS doesn't have a super bot, and while I would never say that our LS doesn't have people that bot in it (as we neither encourage nor discourage it), I'd venture to say that the majority of our linkshell doesn't use bots. I've talked to someone from another server who was in a linkshell with a 'super bot' and this was pretty much the main feature of what he said it did, and yes, he did say that it was available on the $20 version of app, but something about the super bot version was better. Maybe you can tell me what exactly your bot does that $20 app doesn't.

[Mafai]

NASA
automatically coordinates delays.

goes based off when the first person detects pop (instead of your client detecting pop)

freezes game so that the interval in which the packet is sent is percise (instead of the next outgoing packet)

sends claim using packets instead of windowhelper to just input /ma "Stun" <t>

FFXI-App
uses windowhelper to input claim method - this is the main difference

fires based off client detecting pop (maybe linked camping does it based off first person too, not sure)

[Tagus]

You're clearly one of the people that think dupers didn't deserve their punishment, because how can you honestly say duping and botting can even compare to each other?

Duping = manipulation that gets RECORDED.
Botting = Memory/packet messing around that rarely gets recorded if what has been said in this thread is true, because this said bot won't even leave traces so even GMs wouldn't be able to catch it by just sitting there especially when you have some people sitting there spamming abilities and stuff that kind of stuff gets recorded to the server as well even if it doesn't go off because it has to tell you that you can't use the ability or you can use it.

I didn't realize that you wrote this until just now. Sorry about that! I would have responded sooner. Let me just say that I'm not one of the people that thinks dupers didn't deserve their punishment. In fact, I was laughing my proverbial ass off the day of the bannings. If you had taken the time to research any of the things I wrote immediately following the bannings you would have seen that, although I'm guessing from the idiocy of your response that this would be asking too much. Here's the thing that really does bother me about what you said though. Botting and duping are activities that compare directly with each other because they are both forms of cheating. To say that two in-game activities that are against the ToS have no comparison is to nitpick. I do regret mentioning the bannings because they've been discussed too much, though. To get back on-topic, anyone who would spend 2k on a bot is seriously lacking in sound judgement. It's too bad that nobody loves you enough irl to care about the fact that you would throw that kind of cash at a bot. My family and friends would be starting interventions.

[Devek]

I don't think you're a moron Narse, I think am just bad at communicating my point.

The people that access your site would be a fraction of a percentage of the amount of people that play ffxi, and no one cares if you ban the wrong person. SE does a pretty good job of not banning the wrong people by ignoring mere innuendo. For them to change their policy and do that, to a JP account no less, would be a pretty big deal.

Finally, if you're not coordinating your times Narse, you're wasting your time at camps. I find it hard to believe that you guys would camp KB with nothing more than a prayer that the people botting are not overlapping each other's times. It would be really stupid for you guys not to coordinate that stuff through either vent, linked camping, or some other means.

NASA
automatically coordinates delays.

Linked camping does this.

goes based off when the first person detects pop (instead of your client detecting pop)

Linked camping does this. If someone screws up and hits structure, everyone's bot will go off.

[Narse]

...if you're not coordinating your times Narse, you're wasting your time at camps. I find it hard to believe that you guys would camp KB with nothing more than a prayer that the people botting are not overlapping each other's times. It would be really stupid for you guys not to coordinate that stuff through either vent, linked camping, or some other means.

I guess it depends on how you view it. You have 20 people spreading their claiming delays over the whole frame, and we may have 20 people firing off their stuff in the first 3 seconds. Overall you have a better spread, but if the random claim delay is in that first 3 seconds, we very possibly have a better shot at claiming it than you do.

[fndragon]

NASA...
freezes game so that the interval in which the packet is sent is percise (instead of the next outgoing packet)

I think this is the relevant technical detail that linkshells are RMT'ing gil to money to afford this bot.

Timeline of a RMT linkshell:

1) Linkshell is frustrated at not being able to outclaim competition, NASA is tested and deemed acceptable for full-time use.

2) Seed money is procured for iiFuzz's "NASA" app. (what is NASA short for anyways?) This is gained by a combination of selling the linkshell bank to RMT, and contribution from the members. Quite a nice racket on iiFuzz's part, as he has a monopoly on this market.

3) Linkshell goes on a claiming spree, getting all HNM drops they can muster enough people for, and selling Rare/Ex and non-Rare/Ex drops for gil. Linkshell then RMT's gil to pay back the cost of the app.

4) People in the linkshell get stupid-wealthy and start being able to afford relics, mythics, and Sonic Belt +1's.

Honestly, if it weren't blatantly illegal and morally wrong, I'd invest in these schemes. You know, if it weren't OBVIOUS that this is going to get banhammered soon.

[Okan]

Honestly, if it weren't blatantly illegal and morally wrong, I'd invest in these schemes. You know, if it weren't OBVIOUS that this is going to get banhammered soon.

ROFL. We were thinking that 5 years ago when the bots were just starting to show up.

[fndragon]

ROFL. We were thinking that 5 years ago when the bots were just starting to show up.

Yep. Although I think the merging of RMT into the mix might change things up a bit.

[Tagus]

Yep. Although I think the merging of RMT into the mix might change things up a bit.

RMT have been involved in this the whole time. As long as SE's policy is to avoid using external sources to determine who's botting because of possible manipulation of data outside of their control, botting is going to be a tough crime for them to target. Unless, of course, they monitor outside sources and actually pursue the information they find in game through GM's, STF, or some various tool....

[Okan]

5 years ago, I wanted to be a Holy Crusader like you, fndragon, and strike down all those who used bots and stand for good and fight the evil. Unfortunately today, (or at least pre-Einherjar), you could never get any of those abjurations or some items unless you did use it. In no way am I trying to justify using it. I screamed and shouted, pointed fingers at one-time friends and even quit the game because of bots... As long as someone is gaining an advantage, they'll be used.

It's the sad truth and it killed this game for me.

[fndragon]

5 years ago, I wanted to be a Holy Crusader like you, fndragon, and strike down all those who used bots and stand for good and fight the evil. Unfortunately today, (or at least pre-Einherjar), you could never get any of those abjurations or some items unless you did use it. In no way am I trying to justify using it. I screamed and shouted, pointed fingers at one-time friends and even quit the game because of bots... As long as someone is gaining an advantage, they'll be used.

It's the sad truth and it killed this game for me.

It's nothing personal for me. I've just seen this cycle before. SE will implement some Punk-Buster thing soon enough, people will whine and bitch and moan about "my privacy my precious privacy", botters will be caught, and new apps will be created that circumvent the Warden/Punkbuster thing. Ultimately, though, people get too attached to their characters, and when they get caught they bitch, moan, move to WoW, or reroll a new character and level to 75 PLD in a week using the SMN burn method. Me? I just want to fiddle while Rome burns.

In a related thread (the circle is now complete!): aka NASA - FFXI-App