RNG stuff, couple questions.

[Rikura]

Monk: 2 swings/5.8 seconds base * 1/(1-.51) * 1.075 * 1.05 = 4.61 swings/5.8 seconds = .96 swings/sec
Dragoon: 1 swing/8.2 seconds base * 1/(1-.45) * 1.09 = 1.98 swings/8.2 seconds = .24 swings/sec
Samurai: 1 swing/7.5 seconds base * 1/(1-.45) * 1.17 = 2.13 swings/7.5 seconds = .28 swings/sec

Now onto the Subtle Blow Part:
Monk: .96 swings/sec * 7.9 TP/swing * .65 = 4.93 TP/sec with 35% Subtle Blow (3.70 TP/sec with 35% Subtle Blow + Penance up [that's assuming Penance bypasses the SB cap, and is multiplicative], 3.79 TP/sec with 50% Subtle Blow)
Dragoon: .24 swings/sec * 16.3 TP/swing = 3.91 TP/sec with 0% Subtle Blow (3.72 TP/sec with 5% Subtle Blow)
Samurai: .28 swings/sec * 14.5 = 4.06 TP/sec with 0% Subtle Blow (3.86 TP/sec with 5% Subtle Blow, 3.65 TP/sec with 10% Subtle Blow)

Hmm, for the MNK part, wouldn't 4.61 swings/5.8 seconds be ~.795 swings/second? If so, that would result in 4.08TP/sec--fairly close to the Samurai with no subtle blow.

However, I don't see many SAMs without Rajas Ring. Regardless, these calculations already favor MNK but the results make it pretty evident that MNK does feed more TP

[FailureMidgard]

Hmm, for the MNK part, wouldn't 4.61 swings/5.8 seconds be ~.795 swings/second? If so, that would result in 4.08TP/sec--fairly close to the Samurai with no subtle blow.

However, I don't see many SAMs without Rajas Ring. Regardless, these calculations already favor MNK but the results make it pretty evident that MNK does feed more TP

Yea, not sure what I did...hit something wrong on the calculator I guess...I should prob read over what I post!

[matix]

Nooooooooo, Scout's Belt ftw. Agi helps boost the slugshot modifier and raise damage cap, Ranged Accuracy cancels out (Same on both belts) and i'll take the +7 Ranged attack over the -emn since I can easily get -enm on Novia earring, but there isn't a +7 ranged attack earring. Plus, when using meat, you generally get +Str modifiers on that.

what are you going on about >_>, you shouldn't ever put AGI as the reason, most especially if ure gunna bring up "ws mods", AGI is nothing but give u a (very) little extra base dmg, almost all AGI piece are junk except the skote, and still, STR is roughly equivalent to a 60% ws mod (larger than the 30% agi mod on slug) and has additional benefits such as free r.atk. raise the damage cap? what damage cap? ive never seen one. people arent confused on which belt to use since they are torn between 7r.atk and -4enmity, people are torn between the 2 cause 4str and 7r.atk, dont even bother to bring the agi up unless your trying to count its extra 2.5 r.acc, and honestly who would use a novia outside of stealthy shot/pure enm- build, pretty out there if u ask me D:

tldr; scouts if you dont have high r.atk vs mob def, bucc otherwise (ive heard some ppl throw out 7-800r.atk or higher and bucc will outperform scout in dmg, course this depends what your fighting, dont hold me to that exact number btw :s )

think about it 7.ratk or 4str (4str GIVES 2 r.atk) so it comes down to even 4str vs 5.ratk, you could almost say its like a skadi/rutters or af boots, yes the af boots rock the fuckin shit outta most things, but in any zerg situation, or decently buffed situation with high pdif, STR is king

[Ultimagi]

who would use a novia

Not enough people realize how useful this is.

[matix]

i didn't say its useless, i even provided the situations it is useful in, and those situation kinda require a relic ws, and lots of other -enmity gear, which is pretty limited to af2+1, sniper collar, and the other -enm earring from ein(delta?), (ive wanted to run a pure enmity build for a long, just don't have all the pieces for it) else why use -7 enm when u throw it off with a 1500side? my point is really, u need alot, a REAL lot of -enmity gear to make it worthwhile, i think i did an item set before and u can get about -32 enmity, while still in decent shottnig gear, w/o sacrificing much ranged stats,

sure novia isnt useless, but how many rng do u think know how to put it to good use? probably few, say u pull hate after side with the earring on, then it did nothing at all. and after all that, why not die when u get hate > hate reset. there is no penalty for being single weak for RNG, i do that all the time, takes maybe 30sec to be shotting again

[Rilu]

i didn't say its useless, i even provided the situations it is useful in, and those situation kinda require a relic ws, and lots of other -enmity gear, which is pretty limited to af2+1, sniper collar, and the other -enm earring from ein(delta?), (ive wanted to run a pure enmity build for a long, just don't have all the pieces for it) else why use -7 enm when u throw it off with a 1500side? my point is really, u need alot, a REAL lot of -enmity gear to make it worthwhile, i think i did an item set before and u can get about -32 enmity, while still in decent shottnig gear, w/o sacrificing much ranged stats,

sure novia isnt useless, but how many rng do u think know how to put it to good use? probably few, say u pull hate after side with the earring on, then it did nothing at all. and after all that, why not die when u get hate > hate reset. there is no penalty for being single weak for RNG, i do that all the time, takes maybe 30sec to be shotting again

Hey, if you don't mind dying over and over again, or having to sub nin all the time, then by all means DON'T use one.

I find it really useful to throw it on and then be able to pour out a TON of damage and not have to worry about pulling hate constantly.

Also, yes, Agi does factor into WS damage, and YES, there is a cap to your damage, especially on WS's with ones current gear setup, a cap wherein you will not do anymore damage due to more Attack (ie. getting ~50 more damage per slug on G. Colibri when swapping out Crimson for Sieryu Kote on WS's as a specific example). Hitting 3191 as your highest slugshot damage on like 100 colibri would kinda act like a "Cap", so you can say you've reached your "Attack" cap, and any other modifiers are going to be due to other stats you happen to throw on top of those. As an Elf, i'll take the +5 agi over the +4 str anyday (especially with my STR merits).


If you play your ranger one way, fine, I play my ranger a different way. Your opinion is yours and doesn't make mine wrong, nor does mine make yours wrong. This thread only offers different points of view and people can take from it whatever they please.

[matix]

i can assure you i dont go "dying left and right" like you might think, i never sub nin except for krakening, it is easy to manage hate, then quickly die to reset, saving mages mp from curbombing me to shit. i dont cry about losing exp i can make back in 2mins, when i only die about once per fight(longer fight, like khim for example, hate reset before fulm mode)

i agree in the end about to each his own, but saying things like you would take 5agi over 4str, is pretty lolworthy, and then to justify it cause u have str merits? that's not justification, that's missing out on 4STR.

you say it like you novia lets you rip 3k sides for 0 hate, 7 enmity alone isnt gunna make a difference unless you have a build dedicated to -enmity, which usualy doesnt happen since ppl ws in ws gear not enmity gear, also your going to probably have capped hate after a certain period of time no matter what you subbed and what u wear anyways. in which case you were probably better off using your normal stuff,

sure earring is a pretty moot spot when its not nighttime, but thats almost a base dmg on just the earring, since my tanks know how to hold hate up until the point ive capped it too, i dont see a point in trying to prolong the effect of having the mob draw u in/run around after you/having mages curebomb you, when you could simply die, and start over, thus helping the overall control of the fight, 7 enmity isnt saving you in any HNM fight

if ure favoring AGI gear over STR cause of some "cap" you claim to hit(you do not have 3.0 pdif, i can guarantee it), maybe if u equipped more STR you'd realize theirs plenty of room for more dmg, probably get some better buffs/debuffs, juse because your damage isnt going up, or its hitting the same number each time, doesnt mean youve capped

like you said to each his own, i definitely don't agree with your style, but i have been playing rng forever, and will always play rng, for every event possible exceptions for wyrms and bones, i can tell you there is no cap, atleast that your hitting, the only type of cap i can think of would be when your pdif reaches 3.0, then it comes a matter of fSTR which your DEFINITELY not capping that, let alone reaching 3.0pdif on anything that isnt twtbw

tldr; 7 enmity isnt saving you in any HNM fight, and STR > AGI always

[FailureMidgard]

You would need to be fSTR -and- attack capped (or just have low accuracy) to make that a good tradeoff...

[Ruuz]

I think the Scout's Belt v. Buccaneer's belt, you got the comparative stats somewhat off. You forgot to include the RAcc from the 5AGI, as well as factoring in that the 5AGI will increase base damage on WS by 1, thus being equivalent to 2STR (or fSTR2+1). On WS (not TP) the difference is:

2-3 RAcc, 5 RAttk v. fSTR2+1

Personally, I think it is possibly best if you are capping fSTR2 elsewhere. Still, if you have a lot of support (high Acc and Attk) and uncapped fSTR2, Buccaneer's is obvious choice.

[Tsuko_Asura]

Hey, if you don't mind dying over and over again, or having to sub nin all the time, then by all means DON'T use one.

I find it really useful to throw it on and then be able to pour out a TON of damage and not have to worry about pulling hate constantly.

Also, yes, Agi does factor into WS damage, and YES, there is a cap to your damage, especially on WS's with ones current gear setup, a cap wherein you will not do anymore damage due to more Attack (ie. getting ~50 more damage per slug on G. Colibri when swapping out Crimson for Sieryu Kote on WS's as a specific example). Hitting 3191 as your highest slugshot damage on like 100 colibri would kinda act like a "Cap", so you can say you've reached your "Attack" cap, and any other modifiers are going to be due to other stats you happen to throw on top of those. As an Elf, i'll take the +5 agi over the +4 str anyday (especially with my STR merits).


If you play your ranger one way, fine, I play my ranger a different way. Your opinion is yours and doesn't make mine wrong, nor does mine make yours wrong. This thread only offers different points of view and people can take from it whatever they please.

Refuting the formulae in power really does make you wrong. Sorry.

[Gadritan]

If you're showing up to Faf/Nid as RNG, you need to level a different job.

What if you're the guy who's always on WHM and BRD that gets to go on his DeeDee job to a NQ onry faf >.>!?

[Shinryuu]

If you play your ranger one way, fine, I play my ranger a different way. Your opinion is yours and doesn't make mine wrong, nor does mine make yours wrong. This thread only offers different points of view and people can take from it whatever they please.

No, no, no, no. I hate this mindset. FFXI isn't some magical shiny unicorn paradise, it's built on formulae and algorithms that we can at this point predict very well.