Killapocalypse!

[Rhinox]

But... We need guns to hunt! I mean how else are we suppose to eat without guns to kill the food we eat.. In a perfect world we would have a central martketplace where food is readily availible or a resturant in every town. But you see this is far from a perfect world!

[Maxxthepenguin]

To sum up the fucking hilariously slanted poll that was posted, here's a quote

Why are gun owners so hostile about "reasonable gun control"?

For most gun owners, personal liberty is as much an ethos as Christianity or Judaism, and people who'd confiscate and burn their Bibles/rifles/Torahs elicit a strong emotional response.

[Tristam]

To sum up the fucking hilariously slanted poll that was posted, here's a quote

lol, I saw that quote too and seriously wondered if it was a parody site.

[shidobu]

Guns for citizens are a luxury item that makes you feel safe.

lol that could be said about religion and insurance. I do not personaly own a gun but i know if some shit ever went down in my house i know where 1 is. I like to treat guns like condoms. Better to have it and not need it, then to need it and not have it.

My friend who just got his concealed carry license when i asked him why he got it he said. "So if some day im ever just minding my own fucking buisness and some random fuck whos had a bad life decides to take it out on everyone else, instead of 20 dead people i have a chance to end it at 1".

In theory i agree with him but, unless ur a trained soldier. Your chances of living through a fucking fun fight with a random idiot are fucking slim.

[0ni0n]

We should ban all guns, otherwise America below will suffer.

http://img259.imageshack.us/img259/5636/america.jpg

[Dimmauk]

We should ban all guns, otherwise America below will suffer.

http://img259.imageshack.us/img259/5636/america.jpg

You do know a 1 1/2 year old was killed and 6 month old baby was shot?

[0ni0n]

You do know a 1 1/2 year old was killed and 6 month old baby was shot?

And we wouldn't want that to happen again, that's my point.

[Devek]

If we had more guns, they could have shot the guy before he shot the baby.

[Dimmauk]

People would get "accidently shot alot more if everyone had guns.

Phone rings, guy reaches in his jacket pocket, and gets blown away. Retard with a gun says, "I thought he had a gun"

[Devek]

When it comes to practical matters, people are not as stupid as you would believe.

People have guns all of the place here, and that never happens. Well, the police do it.. but I think that is a more after the fact explanation for murder...

[FNH]

But regardless, there's still a massive difference between telling someone what they can do to themselves and giving someone the opportunity to have an object that was made with the intent to harm another, self defense or no.

So if you are against all forms of killing, and you abhor all things created for the sole purpose of harming someone else, how do you feel about abortion?

[Meian]

Eh, just what exactly is Finesse's stance on "gun control" exactly? Ban guns?

It was a while back but I think it is about 1 police officer per 2000 people. Did a debate last year on gun control so this is a pretty interesting topic even if it is sort of derailing from op.

I like to treat guns like condoms. Better to have it and not need it, then to need it and not have it.

lol'd but true.

[MF Perm tha Fineass]

When it comes to practical matters, people are not as stupid as you would believe.

People have guns all of the place here, and that never happens. Well, the police do it.. but I think that is a more after the fact explanation for murder...

Hey this was all the way back on page 2, let me repost this for you:

Justifiable homicide

A study of 743 gunshot deaths by Dr. Arthur Kellermann and Dr. Donald Reay published in The New England Journal of Medicine found that 84% of these homicides occurred during altercations in the home. Only 2 of the 743 gunshot deaths occurring in the home involved an intruder killed during an attempted entry, and only 9 of the deaths were determined by police/courts to be justified (FE Zimring, Firearms, violence, and public policy, Scientific American, vol. 265, 1991, p. 48). The evidence revealed in the Kellermann study is consistent with data reported by the FBI. In 1993, there were 24,526 people murdered, 13,980 with handguns, yet only 251 justifiable homicides by civilians using handguns. (FBI, Crime in the United States: Uniform Crime Reports 1994, 1995).

@Meian: My stance is really strict gun control to the point that it's not a profitable business via pawn shops, corner stores, and flea markets. I think they shouldn't be nearly as accessible as they are now.

I also think people should only be able to hunt with bolt-action single shot rifles and have a revolver as a handgun. I'm entirely against the personal use of assault rifles and semi-automatic pistols.

My interpretation of the 2nd amendment is that it is already fulfilled via our military, national guard, and police force. I'm not opposed to a non-federal citizens militia that has access to a secure cache of weapons in times of crisis ( zombies, alien invasion etc ), but there are several flaws with that idea and it would have to be regulated fairly well.

[MF Perm tha Fineass]

So if you are against all forms of killing, and you abhor all things created for the sole purpose of harming someone else, how do you feel about abortion?

That's a loaded question but it's lunchtime and I'm hungry.

Seeing as how it all depends on your concept of when "life" begins, or if a life is at stake the answer can change case to case for me. Personally I would prefer someone to not have an abortion if there is an acceptable, healthy alternative. However in the case of rape, incest, health of the mother or age of the mother I think it is the woman's decision and hers alone and I fully support that decision in those cases.



No one "supports" abortion, even us pussy liberals. We just support the right to choice and have a different view on when "life" begins.

[FNH]

That's a loaded question but it's lunchtime and I'm hungry.

Seeing as how it all depends on your concept of when "life" begins, or if a life is at stake the answer can change case to case for me. Personally I would prefer someone to not have an abortion if there is an acceptable, healthy alternative. However in the case of rape, incest, health of the mother or age of the mother I think it is the woman's decision and hers alone and I fully support that decision in those cases.



No one "supports" abortion, even us pussy liberals. We just support the right to choice and have a different view on when "life" begins.

agreement there.

Shouldn't others have a right to choice? People who have guns don't support the senseless killing of other people, I own guns and hope I never have to use them, as well as everyone I sell to, hell I'll deny someone if they say otherwise(as federal law allows me too).

[Tristam]

When it comes to practical matters, people are not as stupid as you would believe.

When it comes to anything, people continue to surprise me with their stupidity.

[Wintermute]

When it comes to anything, people continue to surprise me with their stupidity.

It's like Limbo dancing, no matter how low the bar is set someone always manages to scoot under it.

[FNH]

I also think people should only be able to hunt with bolt-action single shot rifles and have a revolver as a handgun. I'm entirely against the personal use of assault rifles and semi-automatic pistols.

I hate to be the destroyer of my own side, but a lot of murders are done with the above. Texas bell tower was using a remington 700, Oswald used a Carcano, Ray used a Pump 760 woodsmaster, Sirhan(sic) used a .22 revolver, though this one did lead to banning of importing saturday night specials.

I'm assuming you meant bolt actions in their present state of having a magazine and not limiting the bolt action to holding only one round, because go ahead and take those out for cheaper break open single shots.

You'd likely put a great many firearms manufacturers out of business by removing sales to citizens, I don't think they could stay in business solely on fed orders, while it might remain profitable for a short time they aren't making continuous orders. same with ammunition makers, if they can't sell to citizens they wouldn't be able to keep the factory running to make the auto cartridges that only the police can have. A great many companies livelihood revolves around their civvie business.

[MF Perm tha Fineass]

agreement there.

Shouldn't others have a right to choice? People who have guns don't support the senseless killing of other people, I own guns and hope I never have to use them, as well as everyone I sell to, hell I'll deny someone if they say otherwise(as federal law allows me too).

I'm basically in agreement with the Thomas Jefferson quote I believe someone posted early, in that you either trust man to handle it, or don't trust them to handle it. People in general are a variable in the equation, guns are a constant. If someone flips shit and murders 10 people the only preventative measure I see is the firearm. Remove firearm from the equation but keep person that lost their shit and what do you have? 1 or 2 people being stabbed? A fistfight?

"Rights" are nothing more than a term to interpret. They can be given and taken at will, without cause or precedence. Just like abortion my choice of the lesser evil is no guns to the citizens in the name of defense over more guns to the citizens in the name of defense.
I don't trust people to handle guns in ordinary circumstances.


I hate to be the destroyer of my own side, but a lot of murders are done with the above. Texas bell tower was using a remington 700, Oswald used a Carcano, Ray used a Pump 760 woodsmaster, Sirhan(sic) used a .22 revolver, though this one did lead to banning of importing saturday night specials.

I'm assuming you meant bolt actions in their present state of having a magazine and not limiting the bolt action to holding only one round, because go ahead and take those out for cheaper break open single shots.

You'd likely put a great many firearms manufacturers out of business by removing sales to citizens, I don't think they could stay in business solely on fed orders, while it might remain profitable for a short time they aren't making continuous orders. same with ammunition makers, if they can't sell to citizens they wouldn't be able to keep the factory running to make the auto cartridges that only the police can have. A great many companies livelihood revolves around their civvie business.

You're telling this to a socialist lol. During this crisis a job is a job and people in work help the economy so I'll agree with your point of factories shutting down.

However, I would prefer a state run research and supply facility. More people with government jobs and healthcare to start, and by taking profit out of the equation you have less a chance of little Johnny Shithead obtaining a highly regulated weapon created and restricted through government and robbing the Circle K.

Nearly every weapon used to commit a crime in this country was originally obtained legally, and then was stolen, sold illegally, traded etc, and then used in a crime. Devek up there said if every person had a gun then less gun crimes would occur because "the bad guy would be taken out faster."

Replace gun with nukes and person with country. It's the same exact thing.




By the way, while I passionately disagree with your position I respect it entirely. Me and a good libertarian friend have this debate often and we always come to the conclusion that, like I said early about Mr. Jefferson's quote, I distrust people to have guns while he trusts them - which is indicative of our views on humanity.

[Araelus]

By the way, while I passionately disagree with your position I respect it entirely. Me and a good libertarian friend have this debate often and we always come to the conclusion that, like I said early about Mr. Jefferson's quote, while I distrust people to have guns he trusts them - which is indicative of our views on humanity.

Thanks for saying this, by the way. I think this is one of the most important and constructive things to be mentioned herein. How people view humanity itself is expressed in their views on other topics, and those other views are much better understood if the backdrop is made clear.

While I agree with your libertarian friend's notion that the average human can be trusted with lethal force, I agree with you (or both of you) that we should simultaneously passionately support what we believe to be true and deeply respect the fact that not everyone will agree.

Unfortunately, as the recent killings show (not to mention the ongoing troubles in the world), not everyone has that kind of respect for others.