RDM Group 2 Merits.

[Grym]

Dia III is an awesome spell to have.

Yes anything can be killed with just Dia II, but then by that logic you don't really need any group 2 spells either, you can still kill DL with Slow I and such. What the group 2 is for is to makes it easier and make the group that little bit better, and Dia III does that by further reducing the mob's defence by 5%.

And for the argument that Angon is enough, news flash: they stacks.

[Seraph]

Meriting Dia III is like casting extra Dia I, there is no reason to waste group II merit on it. Name me a situation that your alliance absolutely must have the extra Dia I to pull of a meleezerg.

Unless, you know, you want an extra 5% defense down. Name me a situation where you absolutely would not want 15% defense down instead of just 10% defense down. You don't get bonus points for making something harder than it has to be.

[FailureMidgard]

Unless, you know, you want an extra 5% defense down. Name me a situation where you absolutely would not want 15% defense down instead of just 10% defense down. You don't get bonus points for making something harder than it has to be.

Farming Leaping Lizzy.


It's basically like giving all your melee between 40 and 60 attack, depending on the level of the mob you're fighting.

In other words, Haste + Dia3 is better for melee than Dia2+Minuet4+March2. Dia3 over Dia2 is literally the difference of Minuet4. Tell me why it's not worth giving your melee minuet.

[Ahlah]

It's stupid to compare Haste + Dia III against Dia II + March + Minuet. You can't expect 2nd group to keep up without Haste. Also you have to take into consideration of mp cost of Dia III in merit party. In meleezerg situation the effect of extra 5% defense down is even less significant since melee already have soulvoice buffs.

Bio III is a huge upgarde compared to Bio II. Not only it lasts longer (5/5) than Bio II, it also deals significant more damage over time. Shorter fight means less chance for solo RDM to make deadly mistake and less TP feeding to NM.

Same principle applies to Slow II, you can never put enough slow on NM/HNM. Not having Dia III probably means zerg fight lasts few second longer. Not having Slow II and Bio III can simply lead to full wipe.

Dia III only has huge impact on the outcome if the fight actually last longer than 2 mins, which does not apply to endgame situation. Meleezerg works because large amount of damage is dealt while target mob is temporarily disabled by CS stun or before it unleash enough TP moves to kill all melee. If your alliance fail meleezerg without the extra Dia I may be it's time for your melee to get better gear.

IMO, all RDM should get 5/5 Slow II, and 5/5 BioIII if they play solo RDM, Dia III will be the last option to consider.

[Seraph]

Same principle applies to Slow II, you can never put enough slow on NM/HNM. Not having Dia III probably means zerg fight lasts few second longer. Not having Slow II and Bio III can simply lead to full wipe.

Uh....

Fpic Eail?

[Ahlah]

Try solo Cactrot Rapido without Slow II.

Bio III is referrring to solo RDM.

[Tulun]

Bio III? *doesn't compute*.

I agree with the slow II thing, though; Yes, Elegy is potent, but making it easier on your tanks is a kindness you can afford them (even the best tanks make mistakes, and this will offer more room to error). It also reduces hate loss overall; blood taken or shadow taken, enmity is lost (not *huge* amounts with shadows, but some is still lost), so reducing enemy melee swings does improve the tanks hate.

[Enedin]

Slow II 5/5
Dia III 4/5
Phalanx II 1/5

It's personal choice, really.

[Hanyoko]

5/5 Dia III is great for Salvage
Zone bosses and most of the 35 piece NMs can have their fight times reduced nicely from this. Lets not forget a long DoT for those Madame.

5/5 Phalanx II with Protect IV, the monk can counterstance tank for 0s on 1F.

[Ahlah]

Really don't think it's worth the extra 5% defense down when most salvage group typically only have 2-3 melee on megaboss plus any experienced salvage group will be able to clear zone with Dia II only.

Phalanx II is really overrated in salvage. Only benefits party until BRD unlock magic i.e. there should be enough mp to keep melee going with storm fife ballad.

[Drex]

Name me a situation where you will full wipe if you don't have 5% more slow from 5/5 Slow II vs. 1/5 Slow II. Elegy just makes it more obvious how unimportant it is.

It's not about what you can't live without (people lived without all of these spells before they were added), it's about what makes you a better RDM for the situations you use RDM in. If you solo a lot, sure, Bio III+Slow II. If you do group activities a lot, slow 2 should at least be unlocked. If you do a lot of CS+Stun zerging, at least go 1 in Dia III.

If you don't wanna Dia 3 every colibri in a merit party...don't? If you run low on MP when convert isn't ready and para2 drops...cast para 1? If you're soloing, para 1 is fine too. Just because you merit a spell doesn't mean you lose the lower tier versions when you absolutely cannot afford to cast the merited one anymore.

[drwaffles]

Any FFXI-related argument that contains something along the lines of "anything you can do with <x> you can do with <x-1>" is automatic fail, stop it.

[Thorny]

I've soloed everything soloable except seiryu without Bio III and I only use slow2 on vivian and rapido(and am pretty sure they're doable without it to be entirely honest). I had para2 for a while but found myself casting para1 more often anyway while soloing so I just deleted it.. Dia III makes the most difference in the situations where it's used. If your tanks are going to die without slow2, you need better tanks. If your tanks are going to die without para2, you need better tanks. If you have melee on a mob, dia 3 will significantly reduce your kill time. I'm not saying slow 2 isn't useful, as I full meritted it myself, but having at least one person with dia3 is more important than having one with slow2..

[drwaffles]

Pretty sure you need powerful and accurate Slow II to solo Suzaku!

[Seraph]

Try solo Cactrot Rapido without Slow II.

Bio III is referrring to solo RDM.

My bad. I don't think 'full wipe' when I think 'soloing'.

[pchan]

5/5 Phalanx II with Protect IV, the monk can counterstance tank for 0s on 1F.

Yes but protect4 won't help during counterstance And as i've said 5/5 is not needed for 1F salvage only, with 3/5 you are good and most of the damage will come from aoe dot (silversea for instance). And if you use whm, regen III will be as much efficient/better since it actually cures you.

[Thorny]

Pretty sure you need powerful and accurate Slow II to solo Suzaku!

i'm assuming this is a jab at rog, but at the risk of whooshing you can't stick it well enough to be worth the mp cost.. spam slow 1 if anything

[Shin Volcano]

Holy shit lol, why do these topics always end up with 2-3 pages of battles over diffrences of opinion..thx to the 1st page.. i can make my decision based on what i'll use it for in the future...but this may never end it seems..

[Thorny]

One more point I forgot about entirely, even though it goes against what i've said before

lvl 1 para 2 stops that guy from overwriting your para 1.. you all know who i mean too.. that rdm in your shell with dalm and dchap that never takes them off and casts para 2 with +10 mnd, yea him, every shell has one

[Celebrindor]

So far I have slow2/dia3, working on other job merits before pumping potency into slow2, and contemplating the other spells at the moment myself.

I will say this: if you're gonna merit Dia3, do so at least twice. This gives a 1 minute duration (same duration as chainspell, so pairs well for its primary purpose of zerg assistance) and makes it MP viable. 30 second duration is a serious ripoff for 45 MP.

That being said- I love it. Einherjar it is great. You may say its only a small amount better than Dia 2, but those small amounts add up.

As for others, its all been said. I just wanted to emphasize that Dia 3 is great, however only really great with at least a 1 min duration.