Random Complaint Thread

[Ksandra]

Don't ever tutor anything higher than about 6th grade math please.

285 int > 321 mastery.
285+X int > 321 mastery + X int

except the values were int and spirit.

my point is if I get the spirit trinket I could still gain that 285+ int. I don't want to lower my spirit value, so you'd be strictly comparying only the haste vs. mastery.

it's really not that hard.

[edit] to be specific 'cause you can't seem to understand

I have 4075 int and 1840 spirit.

if I use the mandala I can switch gems to be 4390 int and 1840 spirit, which is what I would have if I wore the hourglass anyways. So the only values that should get argued about is the haste vs. mastery. I feel that 12.5% is enough haste and don't feel I need more than that making the mastery trinket win.

[aurik]

Except that we already agreed that we weren't talking about spirit. So the values are mastery versus int, and int wins in a big way.

My point is if you can get 285 int in other places and then use the mandala then so fucking what: you should get that 285 int in other places and then use the hourglass anyway for a grand total of 570 int and a haste proc, instead of 285 int, 321 mastery, and some spirit that you don't really use.

Besides, for shorter fights (ie pretty much everything in heroic dungeons) Int actually gives you pretty much the same mana as spirit does, in addition to the spellpower & crit benefit.

if I use the mandala I can switch gems to be 4390 int and 1840 spirit, which is what I would have if I wore the hourglass anyways. So the only values that should get argued about is the haste vs. mastery. I feel that 12.5% is enough haste and don't feel I need more than that making the mastery trinket win.

Or you could switch the gems and use the hourglass anyway to be 4675 int and 1519 spirit, which gives you almost exactly the same mana, 285 more spellpower, and almost 1% more crit.

[Ksandra]

Except that we already agreed that we weren't talking about spirit. So the values are mastery versus int, and int wins in a big way.

You might of, I meant we weren't talking about spirit because of the equivalent spirit to int as I already mentioned several times.

Or you could switch the gems and use the hourglass anyway to be 4675 int and 1519 spirit, which gives you almost exactly the same mana, 285 more spellpower, and almost 1% more crit.

You have selective reading skills.

[aurik]

You might of, I meant we weren't talking about spirit because of the equivalent spirit to int as I already mentioned several times.

So how much mana do you have at the end of fights in heroic dungeons?

Also spirit and int are equivalent for mana regeneration purposes for fights ~2.5 minutes. For shorter fights (ie, most heroic dungeon bosses), int is better for mana regeneration purposes.

For throughput purposes, int is always better.

Therefore when given a choice between spirit and int, you should always take intellect unless you know you are in need of spirit because both the fight is long and you have mana problems nearing the end of the fight.

You have selective reading skills.

I have to, the amount of math failure in your posts would be too painful otherwise.

[Ksandra]

I have to, the amount of math failure in your posts would be too painful otherwise.

None of the math I gave (only two) failed, keep failing at reading comprehension though.

[aurik]

How about I make this really simple, then you tell me where you fail to follow this extremely straightforward logic:

a. Each stat has an effect on your performance in one or both of two ways: Throughput, the amount of healing done with a single cast, and Longevity, a measure of how long you can chaincast before running OOM.
b. Some stats have a beneficial effect only on your throughput (mastery, haste, crit).
c. Some stats have a beneficial effect only on your longevity (spirit).
d. Some stats have a beneficial effect on both your throughput and longevity (int).
e. Point for point, int gives you equal or more longevity than spirit in short fights, and more throughput than spirit in all fights.
f. Point for point, haste and mastery are generally similar for throughput and neither affect longevity.
g. A trinket with 285 int gives you more throughput than 321 spirit.
h. A trinket with 285 int may or may not give you more longevity than 321 spirit, but it is probably pretty close for short fights (ie, in heroic dungeons).
i. You're generally not running out of mana. A small drop in longevity isn't a big deal at this time.
j. Therefore, a trinket with 285 int is superior, as it improves your throughput and doesn't materially affect your longevity.
k. Even if you enchanted/gemmed the rest of your gear with a grand total of 285 int, a trinket with 285 int is superior, as it improves your throughput and doesn't materially affect your longevity.
l. Even if you enchanted/gemmed the rest of your gear with a grand total of X int, a trinket with 285 int is superior, as it improves your throughput and doesn't materially affect your longevity.
m. Unless you find you are running out of mana and thus decide longevity is a priority, any number between 0 and infinity can be chosen for X while keeping the above statement valid.

So what part don't you follow?

[aurik]

Also you failed at math when you added in 285 int from the rest of your gear without considering the cost of what you otherwise would have had in those slots/enchants in the world where you can't both gem/enchant int and use an int trinket.

Oh and also when you said you desire a balance of stats instead of stacking your best stat until the marginal value diminishes below the marginal value of another stat.

It's like, if I told you that you can have 10 coins in any assortment of nickles and dimes, and your goal is to maximize how much money you have, you would have to be a retard to choose anything but 10 dimes. I don't care how many nickles and dimes you already have in your pocket, you still do best by choosing 10 dimes, you don't say "well I already have 4 dimes and 6 nickles, so I'll take 6 more dimes and 4 nickles so that I have 10 of each". That's just retarded.

Now substitute spirit for nickles and int for dimes. Stack int is the optimal strategy, at least until the next balance patch.

[Tajin]

Ozruk, hunter, fail healers.

[Ksandra]

Also you failed at math when you added in 285 int from the rest of your gear without considering the cost of what you otherwise would have had in those slots/enchants in the world where you can't both gem/enchant int and use an int trinket.

so basically, you still didn't read it.

[Falisa]

Zzzzz how about we fight about this in PMs if it matters so much instead of taking up how many pages now?

[Arvin]

facepalm

ksandra, come on now. it's really simple and easy to understand :\

[Ksandra]

facepalm

ksandra, come on now. it's really simple and easy to understand :\

no I'm not denying that there are stat weights, but I pointed something out that he is completely ignoring like he has most of the argument, and has constantly insisted I think/say things I never thought/said and is basically arguing against things I am not arguing about.

[aurik]

Sorry for being right again.

[Krye]

Aurik, it's really not that hard to understand. The one point you're missing is that any content Ksandra is capable of clearing can be done without enchanting or gemming your gear and you wouldn't even have to wear trinkets.

[Ksandra]

Aurik, it's really not that hard to understand. The one point you're missing is that any content Ksandra is capable of clearing can be done without enchanting or gemming your gear and you wouldn't even have to wear trinkets.

hey now he might be onto something!

[aurik]

Just because you could do the content in green gear doesn't make that trinket magically better than hourglass.

And I already mentioned the "I like it because it's shiny / took time to acquire" angle several times. It's ok to like it because it's shiny and you spent a long time getting it. But once again it doesn't make the trinket magically better than hourglass.

[Ksandra]

Just because you could do the content in green gear doesn't make that trinket magically better than hourglass.

And I already mentioned the "I like it because it's shiny / took time to acquire" angle several times. It's ok to like it because it's shiny and you spent a long time getting it. But once again it doesn't make the trinket magically better than hourglass.

this just happened in a response to a krye comment. think about it.

[altwight]

ksandra plays wow? /facepalm. inc infraction.

[aurik]

Summary: trinket is ok, but not great. Aside from the sentimental/gearscore aspect, it's inferior to the heroic healer int trinkets. But hey, if you're not doing raiding who cares about min/maxing, so whatever floats your boat.

[Ksandra]

Summary: trinket is ok, but not great. Aside from the sentimental/gearscore aspect, it's inferior to the heroic healer int trinkets. But hey, if you're not doing raiding who cares about min/maxing, so whatever floats your boat.

let me put it into real krye words so you can better understand what he was saying:

"OMFG PUGS SUCK IN HEROICS HOW CAN YOU PLAY THIS GAME FOR 8 YEARS AND NOT KNOW HOW TO DODGE A FUCKING HURRICANE. IT IS SO FUCKING HUGE AND RIGHT HERE. BLIZ KILLED THIS GAME ONLY CASUALS CAN PLAY AND IT RUINED IT FOR US HARDCORE PLAYERS THAT ACTUALLY KNOW WHAT'S GOING ON. HEALING NERF? YA LETS JUST LET THE HEALERS LET THE IDIOTS DIE I MEAN IT'S OBVIOUS BLIZ ONLY WANTS CASUAL KIDDIES TO PLAY BECAUSE IF KSANDRA CAN ACTUALLY FINISH A HEROIC WITHOUT GETTING KICKED THAN THAT MUST MEAN THIS GAME IS COMPLETE SHIT AND NO STAT MATTERS AND BLIZ IS JUST CATERING TO THE NUBS. THIS GAME IS NO LONGER ABOUT WHO IS THE BEST IT'S FOR WHO IS THE MOST RETARDED."