Completed Relic/Mythic weapons list

[Fake]

Do you know what "subpar" means, and how absolutely oxymoronic it is to say that the weapon is 10% ahead of something but below average?

His overuse of subpar is likely a combination of english not being his first language and also trying to drum up a reaction to everything he posts, which you can't really blame him for since he always gets one. Whilst I don't really feel any sympathy for the way Pchan gets treated (read, he deserves every bit of it and worse) he is often the only person providing any sort of figures to back himself up in these little catfights.

What he means to say is that his dps numbers don't take into account how much dps you lose by getting and maintaining AM3 and that koga won't actually have the highest dps in capped attack/high buff situations.

[Darkmagi]

It's the other way around, koga only wins to a normal DD by ~10% when buffs are super high. Considering you can never afford to get AM3 without losing DPS, including from intial WS, it's about as subpar as other mythics.

Never afford to get AM3 without losing DPS? Clearly starting with 300tp, or meditating while running around is a dps loss. Unless you're talking about losing that incredibly insignificant amount by doing a rana instead of shoha.

[Fiendishone]

It's pchan. He's french. Do i REALLY have to say more?

[Prothescar]

Not to mention the net gain in DPS by activating AM3. Any loss from activating it is irrelevant, you're gaining far more than you're losing, and having it activated only makes it easier to maintain thereafter.

[Jem]

I think people are overestimating Koga somewhat though. It is a very good weapon but if it was as godly as everyone said, our Koga wouldn't have felt the need to do another DD weapon in order to keep up for certain events. That's not me pulling shit from my ass either, he stated several times that was his sole reasoning and that he was sadface his Koga couldn't keep up.

EDIT: High buffs favor other weapons because they diminish Koga's aftermath effect and reduce the large difference in WS numbers. Koga's melee damage isn't as hot as other weapons and you're reducing it's advantage in WS output by adding in more JA delay and increasing the likelihood of TP overflow under high buffs. As well as increasing other weapons WS damage by more than Koga's.

[Fake]

Not to mention the net gain in DPS by activating AM3. Any loss from activating it is irrelevant, you're gaining far more than you're losing, and having it activated only makes it easier to maintain thereafter.

I don't understand this statement at all. Obviously you are gaining massively from having AM3 up vs not, however the dps numbers from spreadsheets don't account for the maintaining of AM3. Exactly how much dps it actually reduces the figure by depends on whether the fight lasts longer than the duration of 1 AM3. Also mythics are more susceptible to DPS loss through player error.

Koga is undoubtedly a very strong option however the gap between actual dps and theoretical dps is larger with a mythic than emps/relics, it is not the end all weapon its being made out to be.

[Prothescar]

I misread what he said as I usually do, at first it seemed as though he was saying AM3 was a DPS loss to me, but in reality he was just referencing spreadsheets.

[pchan]

Not to mention the net gain in DPS by activating AM3. Any loss from activating it is irrelevant, you're gaining far more than you're losing, and having it activated only makes it easier to maintain thereafter.

No, the number listed are what you get during AM3, and only koga beats an Ukkon war (by a ridicuous 10%). It's not enough to compete with a weapon that doesn't even require AM3 nor using a fail WS. The only ways koga is interseting is if you can lock AM3 with a ??? or magian spectales and if fights are spaced enough for meditate to help building it. So basically it's only interesting on zergs. It would be interesting to build dps numbers with the SS accounting for the time to build 300 TP and the initial WS damage, and you would get numbers largely inferior to those listed. You can see the numbers I gave as a dps on zergs or the maximum DPS a mythic can output.

[EjinCaitsith]

I think people are overestimating Koga somewhat though. It is a very good weapon but if it was as godly as everyone said, our Koga wouldn't have felt the need to do another DD weapon in order to keep up for certain events. That's not me pulling shit from my ass either, he stated several times that was his sole reasoning and that he was sadface his Koga couldn't keep up.

EDIT: High buffs favor other weapons because they diminish Koga's aftermath effect and reduce the large difference in WS numbers. Koga's melee damage isn't as hot as other weapons and you're reducing it's advantage in WS output by adding in more JA delay and increasing the likelihood of TP overflow under high buffs. As well as increasing other weapons WS damage by more than Koga's.

I believe the certain events you're citing is ADL, correct? SAM in general isn't too great for ADL. Between the short nature of the fight, the impossibility of staying in front for overwhelm and the fact that a SAM using shoha is probably hundreds of attack over the cap due to the massive attack buffs, all add up to hurt SAM. With that said, SAM(Koga) is probably the best job by far for everything before ADL. If you parsed the entire 2hr event, I wouldn't be surprised if Koga was winning.

[S N K]

No, the number listed are what you get during AM3, and only koga beats an Ukkon war (by a ridicuous 10%). It's not enough to compete with a weapon that doesn't even require AM3 nor using a fail WS. The only ways koga is interseting is if you can lock AM3 with a ??? or magian spectales and if fights are spaced enough for meditate to help building it. So basically it's only interesting on zergs. It would be interesting to build dps numbers with the SS accounting for the time to build 300 TP and the initial WS damage, and you would get numbers largely inferior to those listed. You can see the numbers I gave as a dps on zergs or the maximum DPS a mythic can output.

Shouldn't you be shitting all over the official forums still?

[Kyte]

I believe the certain events you're citing is ADL, correct? SAM in general isn't too great for ADL. Between the short nature of the fight, the impossibility of staying in front for overwhelm and the fact that a SAM using shoha is probably hundreds of attack over the cap due to the massive attack buffs, all add up to hurt SAM. With that said, SAM(Koga) is probably the best job by far for everything before ADL. If you parsed the entire 2hr event, I wouldn't be surprised if Koga was winning.

Warding Circle doesn't hurt, either.

[pchan]

It's not a demon lol.

[Martel]

ADL certainly isn't a demon. But just about everything else in dynamis xarc is. And considering the quoted post made reference to "the entire 2 hour event" those other mobs are probably what kyte was directing the warding comment at.

[Aramaic]

I'll just assume hes overusing the term subpar for now. And honestly it takes a bit more cognitive ability to keep up AM3 on Ryu when I do a dynamis run. But it can be done without sacrificing relatively too much dps, granted our jump tp bonus is broken as fuck with AM3 on.

[macross]

I try to use koga for everything besides legion, where I use a ragnarok and war has tomahawk. If I'm on war I'll use ukon mostly as well, ragna for some bosses where the -crit is meh, unless I'm there to MS of course hehe.

300% rana does pretty good dmg, I wouldn't say it's a waste of dps. Embrava, rolls, marches etc all lessen the gap, but without that nothing comes close. I can ws faster than the time it takes to pop a wing in VW for example, pretty much back to back to back ws. The more you constantly fight, like in VW the better koga is. It's when you stop to buff or rebuff, and you're wasting your AM that kills it.

As for ADL, I only rana then hold tp and sekkanoki till it splits. Killing demons farming for horn blood and crap it excels by far too, since you're likely not mega buffed. All you need are 2 marches to be able to chain ws.

[pchan]

You fall behind pup whenever you don't have you pocket BRD or SCH.

[Aurara]

You fall behind pup whenever you don't have you pocket BRD or SCH.

How often is that seriously going to be though, Pchan?

[Darkmagi]

Ballista obviously, SAM is going to be shit tier dps in there!

[macross]

Sam's never gonna be better soloer than pup hehe. But you gonna make a 600m gil weapon just to solo farm with?

[Jem]

I believe the certain events you're citing is ADL, correct? SAM in general isn't too great for ADL. Between the short nature of the fight, the impossibility of staying in front for overwhelm and the fact that a SAM using shoha is probably hundreds of attack over the cap due to the massive attack buffs, all add up to hurt SAM. With that said, SAM(Koga) is probably the best job by far for everything before ADL. If you parsed the entire 2hr event, I wouldn't be surprised if Koga was winning.

Legion. Although he no longer comes to ADL as SAM but I'm not sure if that's due to damage of because new shiny to play with. We never parse ADL because there isn't any point really. ADL isn't about doing the most damage anyway, it's about efficient damage. Like I'm sure I would parse terribly on it as I don't WS or pop buffs pre-split.