Guns in our society.

[guartz]

Isn't the whole point of gun control to prevent or reduce the number of (illegal) shootings?

The primary function gun-control serves is to make official government enforcement agencies relevant. Government needs to regulate arms production and distribution. This is evident since all governments worth their weight do that.

As far as actually linking gun restrictions to reduced violence is a different topic altogether. I assume it varies from culture to culture, and what role weapons play in it. As I mentioned, making guns illegal do not remove them from society, so actually banning guns altogether is first of all, very expensive and secondly not very effective.

Somebody brought up U.K as an example. Obviously the weapon culture their is different then in U.S.A. Another thing to consider, is that buying a gun anywhere in E.U is probably cheaper then in America, regardless of restrictions. Huge smuggling efforts, even by members of the military, since the profits are so high.

In America, a different approach is taken. Instead of highly regulating the gun-market, the gun makers are distributors are in fact, almost bribed to follow certain rules through incentives.

[spd]

out of every box of 50 bullets, 25 should be duds, this should help.

[Dimmauk]

http://www.cbc.ca/gfx/photos/rock_chris_cp_4908228.jpg
"Everybody is talking about gun control. Got to control the guns. Fuck, that, I like guns. If you've got a gun, you don't need to work out! Cause, I ain't working out. I ain't jogging. No, I think we need some bullet control. I think every bullet should cost five thousand dollars. Five thousand dollars for a bullet. Know why? Cos if a bullet cost five thousand dollars, there'd be no more innocent by-standers. That'd be it. Some guy'd be shot you'd be all 'Damn, he must've done something, he's got fifty thousand dollars worth of bullets in his ass!' And people'd think before they shot someone 'Man I will blow your fucking head off, if I could afford it. I'm gonna get me a second job, start saving up, and you a dead man. You'd better hope I don't get no bullets on lay-away!' And even if you get shot you wouldn't need to go to the emergency room. Whoever shot you'd take their bullet back. 'I believe you got my property?"

[guartz]

Dimmauk. If that ever happened, I would learn how to make bullets and start selling them for cheaper.

[Melchiah]

Did you know that the components for black powder can all be purchased at the grocery store?

If you break it down to it's constituent components, a firearm is nothing in the world but a mechanical device that focuses the energy from a chemical reaction into a linear direction.

Weapons never become obsolete, only tactics do. In the event of a total firearm ban, homemade weapons will proliferate. A trip to the hardware store and the grocery store will yield ready made components to manufacture at the least a single-shot weapon that could be reasonably well concealed. The know-how is out there, so the ultra-liberals can ban guns all they want but they'll never get rid of them. It'd be a hollow gesture at best; meaningless words on paper at worst.

[Senoska]

NationMaster - Murders with firearms (per capita) (most recent) by country

Would be a better statistic for this discussion

Also, do you have any idea how accurate a home made gun would be? And I mean like black powder type home made gun? IE: Not everyone is a gun smith....

If guns are hard to get, there are no rage killings, no anger shit, only people who are SERIOUSLY fucking set on the cause. That would lower murder rates.. You can't half ass gun control because then the people that are saying the bad guys are in power are right. It's all or bust. All guns are illegal or all guns are legal. No mix between them.

[FNH]

This thread is just a can of worms.

Can anyone here honestly tell me what they need an assault rifle for? Or any automatic weapon for that matter?

the assault rifle design is very good for varmint hunting as part of a conservation effort, such as the outbreak of wild hog and coyote populations

The problem is that there isn't enough regulation. I can order a damn gun from craigslist, for crying out loud.

only within your state(or neighboring state for long guns) and the seller is supposed to only sell to someone who can legally purchase

[Devek]

Here in OKC a guy filled a truck full of fertilizer and blew it up killing 168 people without firing a single shot.

[MF Perm tha Fineass]

Did you know that the components for black powder can all be purchased at the grocery store?

If you break it down to it's constituent components, a firearm is nothing in the world but a mechanical device that focuses the energy from a chemical reaction into a linear direction.

Weapons never become obsolete, only tactics do. In the event of a total firearm ban, homemade weapons will proliferate. A trip to the hardware store and the grocery store will yield ready made components to manufacture at the least a single-shot weapon that could be reasonably well concealed. The know-how is out there, so the ultra-liberals can ban guns all they want but they'll never get rid of them. It'd be a hollow gesture at best; meaningless words on paper at worst.

I don't see 25 person massacres with a homemade potato gun. And to go back to points made earlier between us on previous threads: countries that do have bans in place don't have situations with homemade firearms running rampant and people dying to cannon blasts.

I understand your passion believe me. If someone said to ban black people, I'd totally be like; Hey man, I love black people. I use them all the time. You can play with black people for fun and not be violent. Anyways, if you ban black people, people will just get tans and also smuggle tanning lotion.

I feel you but, bad NRA argument is bad.

[Senoska]

Here in OKC a guy filled a truck full of fertilizer and blew it up killing 168 people without firing a single shot.

If guns only killed 168 people there wouldn't be such outrage.

[guartz]

Right, obviously if say, magically there is a political will and funds to do so, to successful ban all firearms, the "rage" or impulse murders would most likely be highly reduced. That makes a lot of sense, actually.

Hey! Come to think of it, doesn't this work for alcohol too? How many people die from car accidents because of drunk drivers? I'm certain banning alcohol would severely reduce drunk drivers deaths.

>.>

You ban guns, and you cause more problems then you solve.

[BIGSTIC]

Also, do you have any idea how accurate a home made gun would be? And I mean like black powder type home made gun? IE: Not everyone is a gun smith....

CNCGUNSMITHING - www.cncguns.com - Downloads

Check it out. All you need is a CNC machine and a little knowledge and you can mill any piece of spec grade weapon you want. And trust me you dont need to be a gun smith to build a fairly accurate rifle.

The reason I know this is because sitting on my Governors desk is a law that would allow the Manufacturing and purchase of any gun(not full auto) that stays within the state to NOT be regulated by the ATF. Right now you can not legally build a gun unless you are licensed by the ATF but soon who knows. Might just sell all my guns and buy a CNC and Lathe and have some fun building my own.

[Senoska]

CNCGUNSMITHING - www.cncguns.com - Downloads

Check it out. All you need is a CNC machine and a little knowledge and you can mill any piece of spec grade weapon you want. And trust me you dont need to be a gun smith to build a fairly accurate rifle.

The reason I know this is because sitting on my Governors desk is a law that would allow the Manufacturing and purchase of any gun(not full auto) that stays within the state to NOT be regulated by the ATF. Right now you can not legally build a gun unless you are licensed by the ATF but soon who knows. Might just sell all my guns and buy a CNC and Lathe and have some fun building my own.

So all you need is a several thousand dollar machine with complex 3d renders, vectors and machine code

WHO WOULD HAVE THOUGHT! NOW I GET IT!

[guartz]

yea, it's like if we closed down all the breweries, people are not gonna buy expensive equipment to brew good beer for themselves and they certainly won't sell them in basements. heh, fucking silly aint it?

[Devek]

So all you need is a several thousand dollar machine with complex 3d renders, vectors and machine code

WHO WOULD HAVE THOUGHT! NOW I GET IT!

There are machine shops all over the place.

You don't need to own the machine, you can simply access one if you have friends. I borrowed time on one to make my custom waveguide wifi antenna.

Oh, and have you seen the amount of money people spend to grow good marijuana?

[Senoska]

yea, it's like if we closed down all the breweries, people are not gonna buy expensive equipment to brew good beer for themselves and they certainly won't sell them in basements. heh, fucking silly aint it?

Comparing a gun to brewing alcohol is fucking retarded.

And your silly hypothetical is not backed up by statistics. Higher gun control = lower murder rates.

Shut the fuck up with the hypothetical maybes. This is the way it is and honestly you're fucking retarded for trying to fight this.

[guartz]

Comparing a gun to brewing alcohol is fucking retarded.

And your silly hypothetical is not backed up by statistics. Higher gun control = lower murder rates.

Shut the fuck up with the hypothetical maybes. This is the way it is and honestly you're fucking retarded for trying to fight this.

Hey genius, did you happen to look at the murder rates pre-ban? Or are you just assuming they went down?!

[bombard]

http://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c2...guns-shirt.jpg

People are gonna kill people. Make guns illegal, make them a crackerjack toy, doesn't matter. brb running over some kids playing street hockey with my motorized riding cooler while drinking a fifth of jack.

[guartz]

Here's an interesting article

Ministers 'covered up' gun crime - Times Online

"The Home Office figures - which exclude crimes involving air weapons - show the number of deaths and injuries caused by gun attacks in England and Wales soared from 864 in 1998-99 to 3,821 in 2005-06. That means that more than 10 people are injured or killed in a gun attack every day. "

"The Home Office has repeatedly denied gun crime is rising. Last week it pointed to the latest annual crime statistics, which appeared to show that overall gun crime was 13% down on the previous year.

But in his letter to Smith, released today, Davis said these claims were contradicted by figures “buried” in a Home Office statistical bulletin, published ear-lier this year. “[Here] we find the most revealing indication of the true gun-re-lated violence sweeping Britain. Gun-related killings and injuries (excluding air weapons) have increased over fourfold since 1998,” he wrote. "

[Kuya]

I'll just leave this here.

Penn and Teller: Bullshit! Gun Control Part 1
Penn and Teller: Bullshit! Gun Control Part 2
Penn and Teller: Bullshit! Gun Control Part 3

The part about guns defending our freedom really spoke to me. Or angered me, i'm not sure which. I guess i must still be cynical from the whole spying on Americans and the lack of REVOLT, that happened, or didn't happen.