More Blues for the GOP: Sen. Arlen Specter leaves party, becomes a Democrat

[Kyreth]

It's been a very long time since I've called myself a republican. If most dems can't see that the Tea Party is not the GOP, then they are going to loose a ton of elections.

Or possibly, that the Tea Party may end up hijacking the Republicans.

We haven't really had a political shift since the mid 1850's in America- it's been more or less Dems and Republicans since the Civil War, though you've had brief sputters like the Populists, or minor-though-notable blips like the Greens or Libertarians.

For me, it's like watching a fault line build up pressure. Stuff like the Tea Party may just be a minor tremor bleeding off some of that, but eventually there's going to be a major shake-up and the political landscape is going to be altered for decades to come.

[Olo401]

Egon, the problem isn't that the Tea Party isn't the GOP..

It's that the Tea Party is letting the GOP dictate what the Tea Party is, and therefore not only is the GOP is the Tea Party in the eyes of the media, but they're in control of the movement itself.

[Demosthenes11]

Or possibly, that the Tea Party may end up hijacking the Republicans.

We haven't really had a political shift since the mid 1850's in America- it's been more or less Dems and Republicans since the Civil War, though you've had brief sputters like the Populists, or minor-though-notable blips like the Greens or Libertarians.

For me, it's like watching a fault line build up pressure. Stuff like the Tea Party may just be a minor tremor bleeding off some of that, but eventually there's going to be a major shake-up and the political landscape is going to be altered for decades to come.

you need to stop posting

[Egon]

Egon, the problem isn't that the Tea Party isn't the GOP..

It's that the Tea Party is letting the GOP dictate what the Tea Party is, and therefore not only is the GOP is the Tea Party in the eyes of the media, but they're in control of the movement itself.

That is not true at all. Rand Paul was not backed by the GOP at all and he won here in Kentucky. As the primaries continue, we will see more and more results like this.

Edit: I think the most confusing thing about the Tea Party is that there is no real leadership, it is 100% grass roots. It's more like the Borg, which is awesome.

[Conrad]

And you don't think he's going to have to adapt his ideology to be more palatable to the general public who is not nearly as extremist in their views? The Democrats are relishing this opportunity, since the longer he spouts the Tea Party ethos, the deeper they believe he is going to dig his grave.

[Kuya]

I didn't know 100% grass roots was synonymous with astroturf.

[Cephius]

If you want a shining example of what happens when a right-wing "NO MORE SPENDING EVAR" dolt gets elected, take a look at New Jersey and governor Chris Christie. He has cut education and state spending so much that many schools are having to cut programs, lay off teachers, and come up with emergency strategies to find funding to keep schools open. Police departments everywhere in the state are laying off police officers to cope with a tremendously slashed budget. Public transportation fares have risen 25%. Christie now has a robust sub-20% approval rating, a few months after getting elected. He's been universally blasted by just about everyone.

I'm sure Tea Party nuts think that the whole movement is tons of fun, what with acting all patriotic and pretending like government spending is the devil in disguise. It's a rude awakening when, after regurgitating lines about "taking government back" and "helping main street, not wall street" you realize that it's YOUR local community that suffers so that the wealthy can keep their tax cuts. Have fun with that, Kentucky. Jersey's already having a blast.

[archibaldcrane]

No but seriously guys. We are projected by the CBO to maintain a yearly deficit higher than any single year (inflation adjusted or not) for 10 straight years right now.

We can say "oh we have to deficit-spend to ward off economic crisis" but...3 years from now we're planning on still being on the brink of crisis? 5 years from now? 8? That's either wildly pessimistic or we aren't just massively deficit spending just to keep the economy up.

[Purrrfect]

It's more like the Borg, which is awesome.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but weren't they the bad guys?

[Demosthenes11]

If you want a shining example of what happens when a right-wing "NO MORE SPENDING EVAR" dolt gets elected, take a look at New Jersey and governor Chris Christie. He has cut education and state spending so much that many schools are having to cut programs, lay off teachers, and come up with emergency strategies to find funding to keep schools open. Police departments everywhere in the state are laying off police officers to cope with a tremendously slashed budget. Public transportation fares have risen 25%. Christie now has a robust sub-20% approval rating, a few months after getting elected. He's been universally blasted by just about everyone.

I'm sure Tea Party nuts think that the whole movement is tons of fun, what with acting all patriotic and pretending like government spending is the devil in disguise. It's a rude awakening when, after regurgitating lines about "taking government back" and "helping main street, not wall street" you realize that it's YOUR local community that suffers so that the wealthy can keep their tax cuts. Have fun with that, Kentucky. Jersey's already having a blast.

where would you find money to fix a state's financial troubles? when you are in debt, you cut back in spending or find another job. governments dont have the luxury of the latter outside of raising taxes

[Conrad]

What's wrong with paying more taxes if they're going towards government programs and removing one's self from debt? Cutting taxes isn't going to restore an economy if everyone is saving money, paying off personal debt, or spending it on foreign goods.

I live in New Jersey too, and my district was one of the few places that passed the school budgets last month. Paying slightly higher property taxes is okay with me since the money is going towards education programs at both the public and college levels.

[Yabby]

I'm sorry this guys is a joke.

interview where rand paul gets his ass handed too him trying to avoid showing how racist he is.

3:25 is where his interview starts that is gong to make this shit storm in the 1st video, the second video is just fun to watch him dodge the same question for 10 mins.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qmT3W...ayer_embedded#!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K7EJ2...ayer_embedded#!

[Cephius]

where would you find money to fix a state's financial troubles? when you are in debt, you cut back in spending or find another job. governments dont have the luxury of the latter outside of raising taxes

So the first step is cutting all state aid for education and municipal police departments? And pulling all funding for NJ Transit, forcing carriers to spike their fares? So instead of the state being in financial crisis, you're crippling the already struggling middle class. He SHOULD have started by putting a freeze on new government spending, cut back on non-essential services like the parks department, DMV, etc. And then, if things are desperate enough, you start cutting back on things like education. Maybe you start by reducing aid by half, showing that he's at least sensitive to the fact that BoEs would need time to adjust. Instead, most school districts went from receiving millions of dollars in state aid to getting absolutely nothing. I'm sorry, but even if financial times are drastically bad, you don't go ahead and destroy the public school system without warning.

And yeah, you maybe raise taxes a bit. But hey, that would piss off Christie's rich Republican buddies who live in NJ, and that's unacceptable.

[ozz]

No but seriously guys. We are projected by the CBO to maintain a yearly deficit higher than any single year (inflation adjusted or not) for 10 straight years right now.

We can say "oh we have to deficit-spend to ward off economic crisis" but...3 years from now we're planning on still being on the brink of crisis? 5 years from now? 8? That's either wildly pessimistic or we aren't just massively deficit spending just to keep the economy up.

archi, you turnin into a conspiracy theorist

What's interesting to me is that the "federal reserve" "fiat currency" "central banking" conspiracy theorists finally get to have their put-up-or-shut-up moment. Here it is, fiat banking at its most extreme - printing money to pay debts, inflate supply for lending, etc. etc. - both in the U.S. and the EU now. Are both economies doomed to collapse? Will inflation run out of control and currency not be worth the paper it's printed on? Or do we get out of this ok and prove that having the fiat currency leeway to do this sort of thing is advantageous?

what happened man?
sorry for the pole ride btw



also, here's another .1 trillion to throw into the deficit http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalpu...-assessed.html

[Yabby]

One way that i liked was to raise sales tax. You can even take it to an extreme by raising the % based on the cost of the item.

0 - 5,000 = 7%

5,000 - 20,000 = 7.5%

20,000 - 80,000 = 8 to 8.5 %

80,000 - 200,000 = 8.5% to 9%

200,000 - 1,000,000 = 9% - 9.5%

1,000,000 + = 9.5 to 10% sales tax

Edit: The above is a little high i know, just trying to show what i mean.

The main reason i like this type of tax to be raised is that the super rice do not have loop holes. They can't write of massive amounts of money so they are paying little to nothing every year. It really makes me sick when i see someone that makes 20 million a year paying as much taxes as someone who makes 1 million a year because they use all the loop holes in the system.

[ozz]

One way that i liked was to raise sales tax. You can even take it to an extreme by raising the % based on the cost of the item.

0 - 5,000 = 7%

5,000 - 20,000 = 7.5%

20,000 - 80,000 = 8 to 8.5 %

80,000 - 200,000 = 8.5% to 9%

200,000 - 1,000,000 = 9% - 9.5%

1,000,000 + = 9.5 to 10% sales tax

Edit: The above is a little high i know, just trying to show what i mean.

The main reason i like this type of tax to be raised is that the super rice do not have loop holes. They can't write of massive amounts of money so they are paying little to nothing every year. It really makes me sick when i see someone that makes 20 million a year paying as much taxes as someone who makes 1 million a year because they use all the loop holes in the system.

See: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luxury_tax

Then: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/819936/posts

Yacht retailers reported a 77 percent drop in sales that year, while boat builders estimated layoffs at 25,000

[Yabby]

That was because they went right to a 10% luxury tax, which is TOO HIGH for something like that. The Norway thing was way off the mark considering they were taxing things like foods that they considered "Luxury" because it wasn't needed. Even poor people buy chocolate. Notice i said that 10% was high for even the 1,000,000 mark, but to start that % at only 100k is way extreme.

I still stand by my statement, i would rather them do without Yachts then be able to buy one and still write off more money then they spent on said yacht in taxes because it was a "business expense".

Also even the middle class (The ones with jobs) buy 30k cars and i don't considered that a luxury. Those 200k cars, tax the shit out of them. Most are not made in the US anyways.

[pohibaba]

If you want a shining example of what happens when a right-wing "NO MORE SPENDING EVAR" dolt gets elected, take a look at New Jersey and governor Chris Christie. He has cut education and state spending so much that many schools are having to cut programs, lay off teachers, and come up with emergency strategies to find funding to keep schools open. Police departments everywhere in the state are laying off police officers to cope with a tremendously slashed budget.

This sounds exactly like California, and we don't even have a right-wing Governor.

[Kuya]

where would you find money to fix a state's financial troubles? when you are in debt, you cut back in spending or find another job. governments dont have the luxury of the latter outside of raising taxes

Debts don't work the same way for a single person as they do for a sovereign nation. If a State is in debt, all it has to do is try to spend to increase productivity by increasing employment which makes it easier for a sovereign government to pay off its debt, but we're not talking about a sovereign government, we're talking about a State under a federal system that is dealing with a budget deficit and not a foreign debt. Meaning, it can get the money from the federal government to do its stimulus spending. The problem really isn't the budget deficit.

[Cephius]

This sounds exactly like California, and we don't even have a right-wing Governor.

While Arnold is more moderate, he still leans to the right on many issues.