Current Known Issue (May 12) -.-

[bsphil]

Why even put the chance of -25% delay on a h2h weapon in the game, if theyre just gonna take it out?

Christ they dont think before they do half the shit they do....fuckin bizzare

Because I'm 99% sure they intended the -25% delay to affect only the weapon's delay, not the entire h2h delay. Now they realized that didn't work, and have no idea how to fix it, so they're going to go back and adjust the delays to be similar to other weapons (-5% or so).

[Kerberoz]

Wasn't it obvious that this wasn't intentional? It was basically a weapon with -delay. Had to see the fix coming...

[Yeager]

Blast you SE! I finally get some awesome weapon for my PUP....and now it gets taken away. BLAST YOU TO HELL!!!!


on a side note....


Good thing I kept my Wagh Baghnakhs. lulz

[pchan]

The augmented manoples were not better than Shenlong for PUP, but they were fo MNK.

[Narol]

Destroyers are very easy to get. Hell, all the Crit hit weapons are easy to get.

Not when KSNM doesn't put out and you see 2 Destroyers drop in about 20 successful runs out of more that are lost because idiots don't know how the battles work, the total drop rate also excepting one idiot's who zoned before lotting on his and some other MNK gets the first one actually dropping into an inventory and you're stuck with awesome MNK weapons like Subduer on all your orbs.

I'm definitely not bitter at all. Nope, not in the slightest.

Because I'm 99% sure they intended the -25% delay to affect only the weapon's delay, not the entire h2h delay.

Were any of the other -delay augments anywhere near 25%? It seems to me that a large percent like 25 was mainly intended to offset the fact that the +delay on a hand-to-hand weapon is relatively small compared to what you'd need to effect a similar delay reduction on a set-delay weapon.

[Ruuz]

That was handled in the other thread. The math is pretty bad and makes a lot of assumptions, as they did with Faith's too.

I still have not seem evidence, theoretical or parsed that Faith or these Manoples are better than Destroyers.

omfg. If you are unsatisfied with my numbers, say so. Fuck, go write up your own numbers you lazy shit. I spent a half fucking hour trying to help show you how both Faith and Manoples are better.

You want parses to show truth? I have found a new home for you.

Parses dont prove shit now that we know how the math works, seeing as the math was derived from many thousands of parses. If your parse shows that, say, one piece of gear is better than another (that should not be the case from the theoretical numbers), either your parse is wrong, or our theoretical understanding of game mechanics is wrong (credit: Pahn of Phoenix, not quoted, but from memory).

Parses show player aggressiveness before anything else. Also, when doing math for the game, due to the many different variables associated (mobVIT, mobDEF, mobEVA, mobLVL, charSTR, charATT, charACC, charLVL, weaponDELAY, weaponDMG, weaponRANK) you must make assumptions about their values (though it must also be understood by the reader in which cases these values will be the case).

Anyways, while I guess we dont know for sure that it is going to be a nerf, I think it is fair to say that there is no other way SE would do it.

Damn you SE! You only give to take away;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;

[Ruuz]

The augmented manoples were not better than Shenlong for PUP, but they were fo MNK.

Actually, I kinda wooshed myself when I said this. I had the values for Shenlong's wrong when I did them up (never posted them). I had them at a value of 10Att, not 10Acc (yeah, big fucking mistake). Shenlongs are toe-to-toe with Spharai in DoT (though somewhat less on WS dmg and frequency), and sometimes overtakes Spharai where Acc is uncapped (10 more Acc will also allow some freeing up for more Att in other gear slots)

[miokomioko]

Did other weapons with Delay-% affect dual wield delay? Namely something like Gully, did the -8% affect both hands or...

[Stumps]

Notice that there is evidence of a cap to the -Delay% of the h2h weapon, now think that on all the other weapons with -Delay%, due to the nature of every other weapon type, that -Delay% affects the entire delay of the weapon. There is no cap of "Only takes the -% away from the first 100 delay" evidenced on the other weapons like there is with the h2h -% from the first 360 delay.

Am I the only one who sees the possibility of this currently known issue being that the cap imposed on the -% is erroneous and makes the augment act differently on h2h versus any other weapon with this available augment? Seems to me that there's a possibility of them fixing the inequality and making it so the augment acts the same on all weapons, canceling out the cap and making the -% take away from the total delay as it does on all other weapons.




I KNOW I KNOW, LET ME DREAM ;-;

[midguardian]

It amazes me how people delude themselves. And then cry about it afterwards.

[Ruuz]

I dont really think there was reason to feel deluded. These are not game breaking, they are just one step above Destroyers, but lower than the ultra rare relic or shenlongs. There is a small amount of hope left in me that they are actually going to lower the delay further (OH GOD PLEASE!), but this is SE we are talking about, so.....

[Malacite]

Square-Enix, cock-blocking all your fun since 2003.

[pchan]

I dont really think there was reason to feel deluded. These are not game breaking, they are just one step above Destroyers, but lower than the ultra rare relic or shenlongs. There is a small amount of hope left in me that they are actually going to lower the delay further (OH GOD PLEASE!), but this is SE we are talking about, so.....

With 330 ish delay yes they are slightly better than destroyers, but not with less delay. Last I checked there was no evidence that the delay was not 316 since the only way to determine it would be to time the attack rounds. Shenlongs are not too far from destroyers either (like +8%+ when uncapped acc, 6% capped acc).

[ringthree]

omfg. If you are unsatisfied with my numbers, say so. Fuck, go write up your own numbers you lazy shit. I spent a half fucking hour trying to help show you how both Faith and Manoples are better.

You want parses to show truth? I have found a new home for you.

Parses dont prove shit now that we know how the math works, seeing as the math was derived from many thousands of parses. If your parse shows that, say, one piece of gear is better than another (that should not be the case from the theoretical numbers), either your parse is wrong, or our theoretical understanding of game mechanics is wrong (credit: Pahn of Phoenix, not quoted, but from memory).

Parses show player aggressiveness before anything else. Also, when doing math for the game, due to the many different variables associated (mobVIT, mobDEF, mobEVA, mobLVL, charSTR, charATT, charACC, charLVL, weaponDELAY, weaponDMG, weaponRANK) you must make assumptions about their values (though it must also be understood by the reader in which cases these values will be the case).

Anyways, while I guess we dont know for sure that it is going to be a nerf, I think it is fair to say that there is no other way SE would do it.

Damn you SE! You only give to take away;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;

Gone over this already. Your math was wrong. The difference was non-existent. If the delay is really lower the Manoples could be better than Destroyers. Until we know what the case is and if they are going to nerf them, I will stay with the status quo, thanks.

[The Stig]

maintenance tonight!

incoming fix. takes 2 hours to fix!

[ringthree]

Not when KSNM doesn't put out and you see 2 Destroyers drop in about 20 successful runs out of more that are lost because idiots don't know how the battles work, the total drop rate also excepting one idiot's who zoned before lotting on his and some other MNK gets the first one actually dropping into an inventory and you're stuck with awesome MNK weapons like Subduer on all your orbs.

I'm definitely not bitter at all. Nope, not in the slightest.

Double Dragonian is very easy. I did it pick up with 5 friends, and the drop rate is fine.

Are the people doing the fight idiots for not knowing how the BC works, or are you an idiot for not telling them when you want the item from the fight?

So many leeches with insane expectations in this game. Check that, in all MMO's. Well, check that again, in life.

[Drace]

Royal Ramble = 5 minute battle, 100% Oric. Ingot, and Crit weapons out the ass (Destroyers included) ... grab a few AH SAMs, a couple of competent healers and enjoy.

[Tempyst]

Wait, people have trouble getting destroyers? It would've been nice if the standard end game weapons for my jobs were essentially free and that easy to obtain.

[ringthree]

Royal Ramble = 5 minute battle, 100% Oric. Ingot, and Crit weapons out the ass (Destroyers included) ... grab a few AH SAMs, a couple of competent healers and enjoy.

I totally forgot that Royale Ramble drops them too. Royale Ramble is so easy and it actually has a guaranteed decent drop.

[Cream Soda]

And even if you don't have any seals you can set up a pt with 5 ppl who do that don't care about destroyers and would let you have them.