Woman Raped in Washington Park as Hundreds Watched

[Kohan]

I like how we're portraying going to the park to get wasted as not stupid...as long as we didn't intend to do it with homeless people.

Boggles my mind.

How does it? This is more so a difference of opinion on the responsibility of the individual, I'd suppose.

I don't believe that an individual's having decided to get drunk equals their being an irresponsible person. It's indulging in a pleasure. Likewise, one could hope that people would know their limits and be capable of enjoying the world outside of their home and/or bar without endangering others. Constantly expecting the worst of the inebriated, homeless, what have you, is to not have faith in humanity, and/or to be paranoid. You're expected to be cautious, but how far does this take you? How much do you avoid?

Undeniably, taking in a lot of liquor -- though we also have no idea how much was consumed in this case -- is going to alter someone's ability to reason. Does that mean they should have never done it? Is safe always better than sorry? Is the unsympathetic reaction largely due to the negative stigma associated with drunkenness?

Again, it's more so a difference on the opinion of individual responsibility -- that and one's perception of the world, and how they choose to interact with it.

Kohan: So, I'm walking down the street of my neighborhood, and decide it's a nice day, so I take a walk in the park. I'm feeling like a drink is in order, and some fabulous homeless fellow offers to share some of his elixir with me. So, after a little bit, my judgment is impaired. And the fact that the majority of homeless are mentally neglected totally doesn't register in my mind. It's like that other poster said, taking candy from a stranger.

Drinking with someone doesn't mean you're literally sharing your beverage with them. You don't know if she brought the booze with her (though I'd be very surprised if that weren't the case), you don't know if she sat down first and the homeless men wandered over later, you don't know, well, practically anything that would validate the semi-sarcastic statement you've just made.

You're slandering someone and questioning their being a victim at all when you don't even know the entire situation. At the same time, if you believe faith in humanity equals hoping people will "do the right thing," you would logically be more sympathetic toward her since all of the people around didn't do the right thing -- but you're not.

For someone who knocks other people on their thought process, do you even think your own commentary through, or do you just enjoy standing in multiple places at once?

Getting back to the whole "boggles my mind" thing, it amazes me when people can't possibly consider both sides of an issue, or multiple ones, if they apply -- that it's either vilification or idolizing, no matter how thoroughly one wishes to discuss things. Whatever happened to being the "Devil's Advocate"?

I suppose this is the internet, though.

[Jodwahh]

http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e1...tivational.jpg

[TacoTaru]

After the first few comments this was the only thing that came to mind.

YouTube - The Life and Times of Tim- Bum Raped

[Kiro]

If that shit happened in Seattle that guy would've died before the cops got there.

[0ni0n]

You guys know if the girl changes her mind during intercourse and if you don't stop immediately, it's rape right? There's also ground for litigation if she felt ambivalent during the course of love making even though she didn't insist that you stop. You don't get to finish off, Kiro.

[Correction]

You're expected to be cautious, but how far does this take you? How much do you avoid?

Well clearly we can put 'going to the park and going off alone with a homeless guy to get drunk' on the list of things to avoid now.

themoreyouknow.jpg

Every risk has consequences when you lose on said gamble. It's stupid to take demonstrably bad gambles. Hence, folks are questioning her judgement. I see the other side of it but really, it's not a side that I view as realistic, growing up in ANY city with a sizeable homeless population.

[Darus Grey]

How does it? This is more so a difference of opinion on the responsibility of the individual, I'd suppose.

I don't believe that an individual's having decided to get drunk equals their being an irresponsible person. It's indulging in a pleasure. Likewise, one could hope that people would know their limits and be capable of enjoying the world outside of their home and/or bar without endangering others. Constantly expecting the worst of the inebriated, homeless, what have you, is to not have faith in humanity, and/or to be paranoid. You're expected to be cautious, but how far does this take you? How much do you avoid?

Undeniably, taking in a lot of liquor -- though we also have no idea how much was consumed in this case -- is going to alter someone's ability to reason. Does that mean they should have never done it? Is safe always better than sorry? Is the unsympathetic reaction largely due to the negative stigma associated with drunkenness?

Again, it's more so a difference on the opinion of individual responsibility -- that and one's perception of the world, and how they choose to interact with it.



Drinking with someone doesn't mean you're literally sharing your beverage with them. You don't know if she brought the booze with her (though I'd be very surprised if that weren't the case), you don't know if she sat down first and the homeless men wandered over later, you don't know, well, practically anything that would validate the semi-sarcastic statement you've just made.

You're slandering someone and questioning their being a victim at all when you don't even know the entire situation. At the same time, if you believe faith in humanity equals hoping people will "do the right thing," you would logically be more sympathetic toward her since all of the people around didn't do the right thing -- but you're not.

For someone who knocks other people on their thought process, do you even think your own commentary through, or do you just enjoy standing in multiple places at once?

Getting back to the whole "boggles my mind" thing, it amazes me when people can't possibly consider both sides of an issue, or multiple ones, if they apply -- that it's either vilification or idolizing, no matter how thoroughly one wishes to discuss things. Whatever happened to being the "Devil's Advocate"?

I suppose this is the internet, though.

tl:dr(ok I lied...I did), the person who's ultimately responsible for everything that happens to them, is themselves. Some choices are better than others.

Anytime you purposely impair your own judgement, you are acting in an irrational and irresponsible manner, because you are purposely impeding your own ability to survive. When you choose to do so for whatever reasons, you should be prepared to accept the consequences of such action. To do otherwise is a victim mentality, an innately flawed conceptual model in which all/most personal consequence is a result of external stimuli(pretty common in the US!).

People individually weigh the benefits of such actions, which is rationalization, not rationality.

tl:dr version: Might makes right.

[Kohan]

tl:dr(ok I lied...I did), the person who's ultimately responsible for everything that happens to them, is themselves. Some choices are better than others.

Anytime you purposely impair your own judgement, you are acting in an irrational and irresponsible manner, because you are purposely impeding your own ability to survive.

I have to say that I strongly disagree with this part of the statement, as while I understand it perfectly from the way you've worded it, I do in fact believe that a responsible individual can deliberately alter their way of thinking and be no less responsible for it. Perhaps in the simplified terms you've mentioned regarding survival and nothing else, but in terms of the "big picture" -- overall life and thought process, desire to be opened to new experiences, exploring every aspect of life including those dangerous -- I would not agree.

Interestingly, and as aforementioned, I would agree with the naysayers 100% if it were determined that the woman deliberately set out to get drunk with homeless people, with no regard for her safety whatsoever. I believe this has been missed or ignored since I've argued her side nonetheless, as I'd rather not convict her without additional information on the situation.

Correction mentioned his own experience in a metropolis, and because of mine, including being approached, groped (and I don't just mean a little grab), and so on, I am willing to believe in the accused and their perception of the homeless as potentially all right people until given reason not to.

Considering the widespread stigma against drunkenness in public and the homeless as well, I doubt anyone will care to publish any additional details, though.

[thetruepandagod]

A girl went to the park to drink. = Illegal

A girl went to the park and hung out alone with homeless people. = dangerous

A girl went to the park and got drunk alone with a homeless man and got raped.

Homeless people are generally crazy with drug abuse problems and not uncommon for them to be violent. (some even going so far as to commit crimes in some cities just so they can go to jail and get food) This has nothing to do with looking for the bright side of life and having faith in humanity, it does however have everything to do with being smart enough to not put yourself in a dangerous situation and i don't know how anyone could possibly argue the victim's total innocence in this case.

[Darus Grey]

@Kohan That's an example of rationalizing an irrational behavior. Part of what separates us from the animals is our ability to recognize something is stupid...and do it anyways. "Spice of Life" etc. That's a choice everyone weighs in a different manner, and in many ways is a society wide enablement of moral hazard that we encourage.

But that does not make it responsible rational behavior...it just makes it fun!(except when you get raped).

[Kohan]

@Kohan That's an example of rationalizing an irrational behavior. Part of what separates us from the animals is our ability to recognize something is stupid...and do it anyways. "Spice of Life" etc. That's a choice everyone weighs in a different manner, and in many ways is a society wide enablement of moral hazard that we encourage.

But that does not make it responsible rational behavior...it just makes it fun!(except when you get raped).

I can't tell whether you're in support of these deliberately "irresponsible" decisions you've mentioned (and labeled as the "spice of life," which on its own doesn't sound like a derogatory designation), as I understand completely what you're trying to say, though I can't believe anyone would want to live that way. I would think that strictly abiding by logic would be as uninteresting or even foolish as forever acting ignorant to dangers.

[Darus Grey]

Does it actually matter if I personally support it? My stance is simply that we live in a might makes right world, and ultimately the only common factor in our lives...is us, and as such we are responsible for ensuring our own survival by having the power to shape our lives(and by extension, anything that impairs that ability is innately irresponsible).

On a personal level...well you're talking to someone who lives by the motto "All I have to lose is my life, and I got that for free". I just don't pretend that risk-taking where there is no clear tangible benefit(being drunk in the park) is logical behavior.
I just do it anyways cause it's fun, and in the bizarre conflicting world of human cognitive function, I somehow value that more than my life(as do a lot of people).

tl:dr Humans are stupid.

[FNH]

I would think that strictly abiding by logic would be as uninteresting or even foolish as forever acting ignorant to dangers.

doesn't get you raped in a park.

[Kohan]

doesn't get you raped in a park.

You're very good at ignoring the nuances of a discussion.

Does it actually matter if I personally support it?

I would say so.

When I'm in a debate with an individual, I am usually interested in their personal belief system. Namely, I like to see what makes them tick, and whether they are able to argue in favor of things potentially against their personal beliefs -- if they can be the "Devil's Advocate." It is to see if they're able to debate all sides of an issue even if their personal feelings would seemingly denote that they don't at all agree with some of them.

In simpler words, it's to find out how comprehensive someone is truly being.

My stance is simply that we live in a might makes right world, and ultimately the only common factor in our lives...is us, and as such we are responsible for ensuring our own survival by having the power to shape our lives(and by extension, anything that impairs that ability is innately irresponsible).

On a personal level...well you're talking to someone who lives by the motto "All I have to lose is my life, and I got that for free". I just don't pretend that risk-taking where there is no clear tangible benefit(being drunk in the park) is logical behavior.
I just do it anyways cause it's fun, and in the bizarre conflicting world of human cognitive function, I somehow value that more than my life(as do a lot of people).

tl:dr Humans are stupid.

Now that I understand your perspective completely, I can agree with you.

[Darus Grey]

Arguing to reach mutual agreement?

I think this is an internet first.

[Kohan]

Arguing to reach mutual agreement?

I think this is an internet first.

Is a high five in order?

[Darus Grey]

http://www.valorite.biz/internet.jpg

[Shiroikage]

Clearly, rape is alright if the homeless do it.

[Gulkeeva]

Maybe she looked good enough... for people just to stare... needs pic of her!

[MF Perm tha Fineass]

Clearly, rape is alright if the homeless do it.

You know those videos where some retard jumps in the bear den at the zoo and gets mauled, but the bear still gets shot?

You put a person out on the street and they bring their humanity down to the level of instinct in most situations. What does the bum have to lose? Now he has a bed and a hot 3 meals daily.

You can tell by the girls age she was naive. You could tell by her decision to drink in the park in broad daylight as immature. You could tell by her decision to hang with transients that she was ignorant.

This isn't a case of some hot girl dressed all slutty 'deserving to get raped', this is a stupid person that willfully put herself in a compromising situation. She could have been stabbed and mugged and left for dead, being forced upon like she was is probably the least expected action but it happened.

It's a good thing you've paid enough attention to the argument to sum it up so well in one line.