Couple Ordered to Stop Holding Bible Study at Home Without Permit

[Ziero]

I still dont want my entire apartment complex's parking lot filled every week by people that dont live there.

It's a good thing this WAS NOT AN APARTMENT COMPLEX. It was a house, a home, a place with a front and back yard, and direct access to the street. And on top of that, it wasn't even a neighbor who called up the cops, it was a VISITOR to a neighbor's home who got their car dinged and got pissed who called up the County.

If it was just about the cars, then they can just car-pool it and not need a permit. But it's more then that, and the original cease and desist order the County gave these guys specifically cited the religious gathering as the issue, and demanded they stop or get a permit.

I'll agree that if it was 15 cars a week filling the streets it would be an issue worth complaining about (I have to deal with that myself near daily since there's frequent meetings near my home with 20+ people attending) but that's not what was cited on the original paper work or mentioned as being the main issue.

Counties can get bitchy and easily try to hammer people any time they see a chance at making money. If this issue was solely about a traffic violation, simple tickets and specifically stating that as the reason for the citation would have been enough. But that's not what happened and the County specifically demanded a cease and desist of the religious gathering without a permit. Someone got their car dinged, called the county, the county saw an opportunity for money and jumped on it. But because they chose their words poorly, it blew up in their face.

edit: This has been going on for the past 5 years and only NOW is an issue? Yea, the county has no leg to stand on.

[Seraph]

They never explained why the car got dinged. If the reason was because cars were being parked too close together because of this new influx of traffic, I can totally see the police deciding "This is causing a problem now" and stepping in.

I'm moderately religious, and I don't really see this as discrimination or Bible hating at all. Besides, I always thought Bible Study type things were creepy anyways. Who goes to other people's houses to discuss (argue) about the Bible? That's what BG General is for. Keep the house parties reserved for cards and football.

[Stiker]

edit: This has been going on for the past 5 years and only NOW is an issue? Yea, the county has no leg to stand on.

Uh...I wouldn't say that...see my example about ND and off campus student parties. I'm pretty sure those had been going on for a few years before the city dicked everyone over.

[Ziero]

Look at the video, there isn't space for five cars in that lot.

edit: for what it's worth, I think the big story here is the priest is obviously the neighborhood jerk.

Between the guy's driveway, the front of his street and that lot? Yes, there's plenty of room. What I want to know is how you got the assumption that this guy is the neighborhood jerk when it wasn't even his neighbors who called the cops.

...after 5 years of this going on.

They never explained why the car got dinged. If the reason was because cars were being parked too close together because of this new influx of traffic, I can totally see the police deciding "This is causing a problem now" and stepping in.

I'm moderately religious, and I don't really see this as discrimination or Bible hating at all. Besides, I always thought Bible Study type things were creepy anyways. Who goes to other people's houses to discuss (argue) about the Bible? That's what BG General is for. Keep the house parties reserved for cards and football.

If people focus on the ding then they'll see the real reason why this issue even came up (someone getting pissed and the County being asshats). And the reason this is a religious issue is because the County specifically mentioned they have to stop their religious gathering or get a permit for it. Specifically targeting the type of gathering is where the issue lies.

Also, how would obtaining a permit make doing this more safe?

[Seraph]

Also, how would obtaining a permit make doing this more safe?

It wouldn't. My assumption is that the town probably wants them to just stop doing it there, and asking them to 'get the right permit' is the easiest way to just get them to hold the meetings at a more appropriate location. They definitely aren't rubbing one out because of the money generated by a few parking tickets or a permit fee.

[Ziero]

Uh...I wouldn't say that...see my example about ND and off campus student parties. I'm pretty sure those had been going on for a few years before the city dicked everyone over.

Changes in leadership and a long line of complaints may have attributed to that new ruling, but in this case it's not a new law that was passed. It was the County being called and reacting to something they could get paid for.

Matching anecdote to anecdote, about 13 years ago my family moved into a new house, which at the time was about 90 years old. For the vast majority of the time that house has been there, it has always had a fence. In the years we were there we fixed up the house a *lot*, including replacing the old, rotting log fence with a newer plastic picket fence, using the same fence posts but just covering them over with new plastic posts. A few years back, the town started repaving the roads, including ours. However they screwed up and any time it rained, there was a MASSIVE (good 5" deep) puddle that would accumulate at the edge of our driveway in front of the fence. In the winter that puddle would turn to ice.

Now our house is right off a major road, and is frequently used as free parking for the stores down the road as well as the small business (and previously mentioned meetings) near us. So worried that people might slip and fall and hurt themselves in the winter on this massive chunk of ice, my mother called the town and asked them to fix it. A guy came out, surveyed the area, and then cited us for building a fence. They demanded we take it down and pay back fines because it's blocking pedestrian traffic...despite there never being a walkway there, and the fact the fence has been there almost 100 years. My mother took them to court, and fought and won, because the judge involved lived in the town, knew of the area and agreed that the fence was not impeding anything.

Long story short, zoning issues aren't always right, and county officials can be dicks when they see a chance to make money.

[Egon]

Having 7-15 additional cars on the street makes it harder for everyone else in the neighborhood. I'm sure there are fire regulations (I forget the apropriate term if that is incorrect) on private residences and not being able to have someone over to your house because people have parked in front of it can be a pain in the ass.

Bullshit. If this was a car problem they'd be giving fucking parking tickets. That's what should have started the county getting their panties in a wad.

Seems to me, the county skipped a couple of steps.

[Neosutra]

It's a good thing this WAS NOT AN APARTMENT COMPLEX. It was a house, a home, a place with a front and back yard, and direct access to the street. And on top of that, it wasn't even a neighbor who called up the cops, it was a VISITOR to a neighbor's home who got their car dinged and got pissed who called up the County.

If it was just about the cars, then they can just car-pool it and not need a permit. But it's more then that, and the original cease and desist order the County gave these guys specifically cited the religious gathering as the issue, and demanded they stop or get a permit.

I'll agree that if it was 15 cars a week filling the streets it would be an issue worth complaining about (I have to deal with that myself near daily since there's frequent meetings near my home with 20+ people attending) but that's not what was cited on the original paper work or mentioned as being the main issue.

Counties can get bitchy and easily try to hammer people any time they see a chance at making money. If this issue was solely about a traffic violation, simple tickets and specifically stating that as the reason for the citation would have been enough. But that's not what happened and the County specifically demanded a cease and desist of the religious gathering without a permit. Someone got their car dinged, called the county, the county saw an opportunity for money and jumped on it. But because they chose their words poorly, it blew up in their face.

edit: This has been going on for the past 5 years and only NOW is an issue? Yea, the county has no leg to stand on.

Actually, it was an apartment complex. This isnt the county trying to get some free money out of helpless christians, this is the county attempting to influence these people to NOT be rude fuckwads and take up all the parking (and damaging other vehicles) in a place where there is limited parking already designated to the people that PAY RENT there.

It's funny it actually took someone's property to be damaged before the city would do anything. Im sure the neighbors have complained a few times if it has been going on for this long.

Being inconsiderate fucks doesnt get excused if you say you are doing it in the name of god.

[Senoska]

Bullshit. If this was a car problem they'd be giving fucking parking tickets. That's what should have started the county getting their panties in a wad.

Seems to me, the county skipped a couple of steps.

No sorry. They went right were they were told to. It increased traffic beyond the allowed rate in a residential zone and therefor was not allowed. Stop talking about it..

[Egon]

No sorry. They went right were they were told to. It increased traffic beyond the allowed rate in a residential zone and therefor was not allowed. Stop talking about it..

What harm would it have done to start passing out tickets? If there was a problem, there would have been tickets. No tickets? No problem!

Pieces of paper saying that they are allowed to do this doesn't change a mother fucking thing and you fucking know it.

[Neosutra]

What harm would it have done to start passing out tickets? If there was a problem, there would have been tickets. No tickets? No problem!

Pieces of paper saying that are allowed to do this doesn't change a mother fucking thing and you fucking know it.

Because it isnt against the law to park in a street or lot where parking is allowed and thus tickets cant be authorized, however it is against the law to purposefully and repeatively congest areas where others live w/o a permit?

Hello?

[Bingbong]

15 people is a fucking birthday party, you don't see any zoning violations going out for those.

If I was the "Pastor" you bet your ass I'd be on the phone with the cops and the zoning board just before kickoff on every Sunday in the fall. If those cars are really causing major traffic issues, and not some fat ass having to walk a block back to the complex then I can see the problem. However, if it's people bitching because they feel enabled to bitch, I would return the favor around all the holidays, special occasions and cookouts I could.

Whiny pricks, all of em.

[Seraph]

Because it isnt against the law to park in a street or lot where parking is allowed and thus tickets cant be authorized, however it is against the law to purposefully and repeatively congest areas where others live w/o a permit?

Hello?

Bingo. However, I bet noone was willing to actually take action, or the city wasn't willing to act on complaints until a car got damaged because of the increased traffic. I really don't see what is so hard to understand about this.

[Day]

Brb getting permit for my superbowl party

[Neosutra]

Brb getting permit for my superbowl party

Gonna hold that superbowl party every week? At an apartement complex?

[Day]

Sure why not?

[Senoska]

The problem isn't the people visiting as much as it is the owner of the household. You can't do what they were doing without a permit. Stop making up stupid things to add to this. It is what it is.

[Day]

Laws are laws can't challenge them or change them or anything okie dokes.

[Seraph]

Laws are laws can't challenge them or change them or anything okie dokes.

They were fine until they broke the most important low: 'Don't be a dick.'

[Senoska]

Theres no reason this particular law should be challenged or changed. you can't run a business or extend your business into your home when it causes safety hazards and increases traffic in a residential zoned area.