Few Kirin Questions

[setzor]

Kirin with 8, that's awesome. I was going to ask about possibilities of low-manning him. So the answer is lots of summoners? =b

[Ratatapa]

Summoner is the only hope of spira

but you need the final Aeon!




oh wait wrong game

[sruon]

Kirin with 8, that's awesome. I was going to ask about possibilities of low-manning him. So the answer is lots of summoners? =b

Did it with 10 yesterday, PLD/NIN WAR WAR SAM SAM WHM RDM RDM/NIN and BRD+THF mules.

RDM/NIN + WHM kited Kirin, rest took care of minis, only got 3-4 deaths on Suzaku.

Didn't take very long... less than an hour.

[Thorny]

Kirin with 8, that's awesome. I was going to ask about possibilities of low-manning him. So the answer is lots of summoners? =b

BLMs would most likely work better on adds, though their damage is much less consistant on Kirin and they would need to be capable of kiting when they got hate. I believe the setup I listed is the lowest man ever done, as well as the most reliable setup(well, besides the silly BRD/NIN THF/WHM thing.. though, as said, it allowed all of our DD to get refresh instead of one of them losing out to assist kiter). The people dead are because I stood still at the end for BLM to manafont and got stonegaed like a tool ;x

[Snprphnx]

good job. my lowest was 15 ppl, bunch of random jobs whiffing for 2.5 hrs, lol

[Gergall]

If you intentionally (or unintentionally) wipe and all the mobs start resetting back to the ???, do the mobs that reach the ??? first also despawn first?

You know where I'm headed with this. Could the pets despawn before Kirin, and then you reclaim Kirin? Obviously, anyone could steal during this window but lets set that aside for a moment.

[sruon]

If you intentionally (or unintentionally) wipe and all the mobs start resetting back to the ???, do the mobs that reach the ??? first also despawn first?

You know where I'm headed with this. Could the pets despawn before Kirin, and then you reclaim Kirin? Obviously, anyone could steal during this window but lets set that aside for a moment.

Fairly sure they depop all together and aggro all together.

[ryanjh13]

If you are really intent on having the bard sac. byakko, you could have the add party in the corner opposite the porter. That would give the bard a longer kite path which would buy more time on the runback (provided they can make it as far as the porter). I would seriously, seriously doubt there was any chance of depopping it even from the porter. You would either link it to Kirin with the kiting or it would just make it back to the ??? before a depop. Might be worth a try sometime though, just for kicks. It might very well be possible to depop genbu.

[Stellar]

If you wipe and lose hate but have killed a summon does he summon the same god again? Or will he only summon 3 upon re-aggro?

[Rasantath]

If you wipe and lose hate but have killed a summon does he summon the same god again? Or will he only summon 3 upon re-aggro?

they will stay up if you didnt kill them, and no he will not resummon

[Leroy]

It's easy to get setups that can 6 man kirin, the problem is it would require a damn near flawless performance.

PLD
WHM
RDM
BRD
WAR
WAR

RDM can hold 2 gods easily for the duration of weakness in the event melee get weakened. I've personally held lolgenbu, Seiryu and Suzaku while the melee killed Byakko in one of our low man runs (10 people, 2 fell sleep further in).

A competent RDM can land bind and gravity on all of them, except seiryu which has a higher resistance, most likely immunity, to Gravity than Suzaku has to bind.

Just keep DoTs on and straight tank him. If you start to get low on mp, take off running and don't stop till mp is set. We keep Baraero up. Kirin seems to favor Great Whirlwind whenever we fight him... Our tank even asks for Wind Carol and Ballad from the brd whenever we fight it.

Any job can run away from kirin quite easily. Even sleepga shouldn't be a problem unless you're extremely unlucky or plain out suck. He constantly tries to use tp and the charge up time is long enough that if you're already running when he starts, he can't hit you. Same goes for Sleepga. If you stay moving when you have hate and catch him up on the pillars, he'll never touch you at all. I can kite him for hours on RDM/WHM, I think a DD should be able to do it till the tank reestablishes hate.

Alternatively, could use RNGs instead of WARs and just Kite and shoot. Much safer, just makes the petsa little harder.

[Thorny]

It's easy to get setups that can 6 man kirin, the problem is it would require a damn near flawless performance.

PLD
WHM
RDM
BRD
WAR
WAR

RDM can hold 2 gods easily for the duration of weakness in the event melee get weakened. I've personally held lolgenbu, Seiryu and Suzaku while the melee killed Byakko in one of our low man runs (10 people, 2 fell sleep further in).

A competent RDM can land bind and gravity on all of them, except seiryu which has a higher resistance, most likely immunity, to Gravity than Suzaku has to bind.

Just keep DoTs on and straight tank him. If you start to get low on mp, take off running and don't stop till mp is set. We keep Baraero up. Kirin seems to favor Great Whirlwind whenever we fight him... Our tank even asks for Wind Carol and Ballad from the brd whenever we fight it.

Any job can run away from kirin quite easily. Even sleepga shouldn't be a problem unless you're extremely unlucky or plain out suck. He constantly tries to use tp and the charge up time is long enough that if you're already running when he starts, he can't hit you. Same goes for Sleepga. If you stay moving when you have hate and catch him up on the pillars, he'll never touch you at all. I can kite him for hours on RDM/WHM, I think a DD should be able to do it till the tank reestablishes hate.

Alternatively, could use RNGs instead of WARs and just Kite and shoot. Much safer, just makes the petsa little harder.

Kirin has ridiculous run speed, and gets as close as 3' when using physical moves, sleepga can and will go off on occasion no matter how idealistic you're being. While 6-man is surely possible, I don't see that setup as what will pull it off.. claiming you can hold Seiryu/Suzy/Genbu for any decent period of time is pure bullshit, as perfect gear doesn't get grav above 70-80% stick rate on suzy and it still builds resistance extremely quickly. Seiryu and Genbu are easy to hold, of course. Prove me wrong and do it! It'd be great to see Kirin killed with one party

[Darkdoom]

Kirin has ridiculous run speed, and gets as close as 3' when using physical moves, sleepga can and will go off on occasion no matter how idealistic you're being. While 6-man is surely possible, I don't see that setup as what will pull it off.. claiming you can hold Seiryu/Suzy/Genbu for any decent period of time is pure bullshit, as perfect gear doesn't get grav above 70-80% stick rate on suzy and it still builds resistance extremely quickly. Seiryu and Genbu are easy to hold, of course. Prove me wrong and do it! It'd be great to see Kirin killed with one party

This. I've held Seiryu and Genbu before as well, can even hold them weakened, but there's no way you're holding Suzaku as well for any period of time.

[Leroy]

The Suzaku pet is easy to hold, gravity is pretty reliable, and it can be bound easily, but hen I was holding him, I relied on Bind for Seiryu, just outran slow ass genbu, and grav'd suzaku. He stopped to cast usually when he finally got in range, so it was seriously no problem. I was easily able to hold them for the duration of the Byakko fight. Especially when Suzaku starts casting flare, it's a joke. Seiryu is so easy to bind you can hold him weakened on BLM, and he stops every 15-20 seonds to use his evasion buff if you're too far away when he gets tp. Genbu is friggen genbu. If you're /NIN it's even easier. SS, Phalanx, Pro/Shell IV, Taco, and Ichi and Ni give you enough of a barrier if you shank a bind/grav, and if they start casting a Tier IV or AM, even better as you don't have to outrun it.

It's really not hard at all to hold them because they're so weak to debuffs compared to the real ones.

[drwaffles]

I'm sure it is possible to hold all three for a couple of minutes if you get lucky with Gravity/Bind duration and wearing times, Fang Rush, Dread Shriek, Firaga III, Aeroga III, Poisonga II and, of course, melee hits, but proposing that as the cornerstone of a low-man strategy? lolno

[Thorny]

Seiryu is so easy to bind you can hold him weakened on BLM

Bind recast is 80 seconds on weakened blm, maybe 70 if you have /rdm and fast cast gear.. bind duration doesn't even get that long on rdm, you're full of shit. Aside from that, even genbu can fuck you up if you're kiting and he poisongas with suzy or seiryu close to you. In ideal circumstances, if bind and gravity NEVER resist during the time you're holding the mobs, and they never wear within 5 seconds of each other, and you never get -gaed immediately after a bind or gravity before you can get out of range, it's possible to hold 3 for a very short period of time but claiming you can do it with any consistancy is complete and total bullshit.

[Sekundes]

Kiting Kirin on Rdm/nin is fairly easy most of the time but it's still very easy to mess up. Keeping poison pots up is vital as you can't outrun sleepga much of the time and he generally wakes you up with his binding tail attack. Followed by insta death deadly hold. Depending on how he wakes you up you can live but he's usually pretty dirty with the binds so unless you happen to have panacea's I'd keep poison up full time.

Composure helps much with this fight keeping phanlax and bar aero helps with whirlwind spam which most of the time is the only thing that actually hits you. Whirlwind has a longer range than sandstorm. Heat breath rarely gets off and Stonega is dangerous but due to the cast time it's rarely ever an issue. I would idle in as much MDT and MDB gear as you can and keeping SS up makes sure he rarely ever damages you. Just have to cancel SS very fast if you get slept.

Gravity works well on Kirin for me it lands about 70% of the time but he does gain resistance so occasionally it'll resist, duration almost always lasts for recast so keeping it up full time is actually pretty easy. Bind also works but it works so rarely don't bother casting it thinking it's gunna save you, I do it mainly for the lulz.

I don't really have any experience low manning the mini's. I'm always solo or duo kiting kirin while the other group takes care of them. I do know if you leave byakko on the kirin kiter for more than a few seconds say good bye to your run... I usually save chainspell for if they don't get him off me quickly.

[Leroy]

Not once did I say you should base the entire strategy on it, I said it was possible, and it's a good fall back.

As for the 80 second recast on Bind: Bind lasts for a good duration on the pet seiryu with little effort. A resist is just rare, and the area is so large that you can bind seiryu and run extremely far away, barring bind wearing extremely fast, you can bind Seiryu at the north end of the room, run your ass to the tunnel, and wait the ~70 seconds till its up again. While running to where you are, he'll also stop several times to use wind wall thanks to his regain, and he will use it several times because it's the only move he'll use if you're out of range. Also, you have stun as BLM, again a stalling tactic, and if you stun and run fast enough you can buy even more time when he tries to use a tp attack and you outdistance it. He's also a caster so there's also the chance he'll stop to cast a tier IV or AM Nuke upon entering range, or lolchoke. The only dangerous thing about seiryu is fluke resists on Bind, Blink, and Radiant breath going off when he comes near. All but the bind resist can be worked around though for the most part. Also, I'm not advocating that you rely on a weakened BLM holding a seiryu pet, I'm just saying it's possible, and not really all that hard if I can do it.

The only danger to a well geared RDM/NIN, aside from a resist, is a poorly timed Poisonga from genbu followed IMMEDIATELY by a move capable of one-shotting you.

Poisonga > Ni.

Unless they ready a strong tp attack, or radiant breath, they can't interrupt Ni, unless they break through a 350 SS with Taco/Pro IV, Phalanx, and ~30% damage reduction.

Not to mention there's so much room to work with it the area you can completely avoid genbu at damn near all times. The reason that holding 3 of them consistently is possible, is because they're casters and often stop to do retarded shit like AM, Tier IVs, Tier III ga spells, and elemental debuffs, none of which you should be in any danger ofdying from.

I'm willing to bet any decent RDM/NIN with solo experience can consistently hold those three for periods of 5-10 minutes at a time. Long enough to kill Byakko, and long enough to let tanks/DD/etc to unweaken.

[Thorny]

Not once did I say you should base the entire strategy on it, I said it was possible, and it's a good fall back.

As for the 80 second recast on Bind: Bind lasts for a good duration on the pet seiryu with little effort. A resist is just rare, and the area is so large that you can bind seiryu and run extremely far away, barring bind wearing extremely fast, you can bind Seiryu at the north end of the room, run your ass to the tunnel, and wait the ~70 seconds till its up again. While running to where you are, he'll also stop several times to use wind wall thanks to his regain, and he will use it several times because it's the only move he'll use if you're out of range. Also, you have stun as BLM, again a stalling tactic, and if you stun and run fast enough you can buy even more time when he tries to use a tp attack and you outdistance it.

it takes seiryu >20 seconds to run all the way across the room and you won't reliably bind for more than 30, not saying seiryu is hard to hold but claiming a weakened blm can is complete bullshit

He's also a caster so there's also the chance he'll stop to cast a tier IV or AM Nuke upon entering range, or lolchoke.

or -ga 3 immediately after you bind, which doesn't give y ou sufficient time to outrun it

The only danger to a well geared RDM/NIN, aside from a resist, is a poorly timed Poisonga from genbu followed IMMEDIATELY by a move capable of one-shotting you.

Poisonga > Ni.

seiryu unbinds or suzy ungravs or both while you're casting ni, gl

Unless they ready a strong tp attack, or radiant breath, they can't interrupt Ni, unless they break through a 350 SS with Taco/Pro IV, Phalanx, and ~30% damage reduction.

a double attack in all of that still breaks SS, just fyi, and their DA rate isn't that low(again, barring 2 on you at once).. one dread shriek and you're done(just fyi, seiryu can get within range to use dread shriek/dispelling wind from 20' during binds casttime so unless you're somehow binding it from more than max casting range..) and dispelling wind is likely to end you too, especially if your grav wears on suzy

Not to mention there's so much room to work with it the area you can completely avoid genbu at damn near all times. The reason that holding 3 of them consistently is possible, is because they're casters and often stop to do retarded shit like AM, Tier IVs, Tier III ga spells, and elemental debuffs, none of which you should be in any danger ofdying from.

you can easily get -ga 3ed if you're in close range when it starts, and you can't keep a reliable distance on them while holding both

I'm willing to bet any decent RDM/NIN with solo experience can consistently hold those three for periods of 5-10 minutes at a time. Long enough to kill Byakko, and long enough to let tanks/DD/etc to unweaken.

I've soloed everything soloable, I have what I'd consider good gear and capped merits, and I think you're full of shit. It's possible to hold them for several minutes, but not with any reliability. You're still ignoring the fact that you're not going to get gravity stick rate above 80% on suzaku and the first resist there will have suzaku meleeing you during your seiryu rebinds..

[Darus Grey]

Fairly sure they depop all together and aggro all together.

Unless this is changed in the last year since I last fought him, this isn't correct.

In an old LS, we did it with 5-6 people and part of the strategy was to have him summon all the gods and let them de-pop.

I *think* it was simply if the cardinal gods got back to spawn point first, they'd de-pop first. Also if I remember correctly they don't assist Kirin if he's far enough away.

Ex:

If you pull Kirin to the portal, and have another person pull the gods to the opposite end, and every-one dies, the people in the portal can RR and tag kirin without the gods assisting, at which point they'll wander to their spawn point in the middle of the big room and depop.

I'm not sure if I'm remembering this correctly, but it's definitely doable somehow, because we did it several times, it was only way we could kill at the time with such a small group.