Magic: The Gathering

**oldoldman** · 2012-04-16 02:15

There are commons on MTGO worth 10+ tickets. Pauper is a format.

**Norellicus** · 2012-04-16 07:15

http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/attac...6&d=1334558088

I do not understand this card at all, you aren't getting card advantage out of it so what good is it?

**Nama** · 2012-04-16 08:02

Its the make the board state stupid or silly card that usually in each set. Odd to see it in black that usually are red cards~

**Xerlic** · 2012-04-16 08:23

What are you looking for Welt? I'd gladly trade a non-foil Cradle off of you if you're willing.

**oldoldman** · 2012-04-16 09:58

Originally Posted by Norellicus

http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/attac...6&d=1334558088

I do not understand this card at all, you aren't getting card advantage out of it so what good is it?

It can easily be a very real card, it's a Smokestack variant.

**Brimah** · 2012-04-16 10:33

Originally Posted by Syntex

I've decided to sell my 40k card collection. Doing a little math with the valuable cards it's worth about 5 grand. Probably get 3k for it though since no one pays top dollar anymore.

I don't want to get rid of them but there is nothing on this side of Michigan to do with them since all the card shops closed and all my friends stopped playing(which really took the fun out of it).

Which side of Michigan if you dont mind me asking.

**miokomioko** · 2012-04-16 10:52

Originally Posted by Norellicus

I do not understand this card at all, you aren't getting card advantage out of it so what good is it?

It's obviously meant for excessive zombie tokens + Diregraf Captain + Mikaeus, the Unhallowed and/or unearth/retrace/dredge/flashback/madness/discard/dies/undying/etc. synergy. If your preexisting token generation can outlast the X effect for a number of turns, you're probably going to hose everyone's board or hands quite a bit in the process of simply losing a few tokens. The owner of Descent into Madness can sacrifice it to its own effect whenever they feel like ending it. (I do think it costs too much, though.)

**Norellicus** · 2012-04-16 12:51

Originally Posted by miokomioko

It's obviously meant for excessive zombie tokens + Diregraf Captain + Mikaeus, the Unhallowed and/or unearth/retrace/dredge/flashback/madness/discard/dies/undying/etc. synergy. If your preexisting token generation can outlast the X effect for a number of turns, you're probably going to hose everyone's board or hands quite a bit in the process of simply losing a few tokens. The owner of Descent into Madness can sacrifice it to its own effect whenever they feel like ending it. (I do think it costs too much, though.)

I can buy token overrun being a thing but all the other mechanics are irrelevant because you are exiling these permanents, not sacrificing them.

And where token overrun is concerned, by the point that you have enough tokens and token generation that you can outlast the wrecking ball that Descent Into Madness brings, you've probably won without DIM's help.

**Xerlic** · 2012-04-16 13:30

Originally Posted by miokomioko

It's obviously meant for excessive zombie tokens + Diregraf Captain + Mikaeus, the Unhallowed and/or unearth/retrace/dredge/flashback/madness/discard/dies/undying/etc. synergy. If your preexisting token generation can outlast the X effect for a number of turns, you're probably going to hose everyone's board or hands quite a bit in the process of simply losing a few tokens. The owner of Descent into Madness can sacrifice it to its own effect whenever they feel like ending it. (I do think it costs too much, though.)

The cards become exiled, not sent to the graveyard. So, no flashback/undying/exhume etc.

EDIT: Beaten by Norellicus.

Also, new land:

RW T: Target creature gets +2/+0, vigilance and haste until end of turn.

**miokomioko** · 2012-04-16 13:45

I herped when I shoulda' derped.

Also, I'm way into that land...

**Weltall** · 2012-04-16 14:13

There is a land that draws a card and discards a card. INSANELY good imo.

**Krandor** · 2012-04-16 16:05

Both the lands they've showed off for this set are awesome. I'd give the lead to the BU one solely since RW isn't a popular archetype in constructed for the most part (though that can obviously change).

In limited though, man. RW land is an insta draft even if I wasn't running those colors, I wouldn't want anyone touching that card.

And Descent into Madness is basically complete ass. If it was cheaper to play it could be useful, but considering that card will take until turn 6 to do anything (unless you're running mana ramp) and you'd be tapped out on turn 5 (dangerous proposition against a lot of decks), it's poo.

**Syntex** · 2012-04-16 19:03

Originally Posted by Brimah

Which side of Michigan if you dont mind me asking.

East side, north of Detroit around 20 mile.

As far as that card it actually is exactly what someone else said, a Smokestack variant.

You can play tokens or cheap/fast things which feed the fuel while your opponent loses all of their stuff but also when you put a counter on you can choose to exile something THEN add a counter so you always have to ditch one less thing then your opponent. Then when your finished sacing things you can ditch the enchantment itself so you have even less to exile that turn. Although if you have 5 counters on it and exile the enchantment as the first card you still have to ditch 4 other cards as the effect is simultaneous.

**Zilong** · 2012-04-17 00:45

smokestack is good because the non-symmetrical part where you'd be sacrificing less permanent than your opponent. This in the other hand doesn't really do anything until your next turn, and requires you to have a superior board presence/card advantage than your opponent to actually capitalize on, which you probably aren't getting by spending 5 fucking mana on an enchantment that does jack shit until your next turn.

**Norellicus** · 2012-04-17 07:18

Originally Posted by Zilong

smokestack is good because the non-symmetrical part where you'd be sacrificing less permanent than your opponent. This in the other hand doesn't really do anything until your next turn, and requires you to have a superior board presence/card advantage than your opponent to actually capitalize on, which you probably aren't getting by spending 5 fucking mana on an enchantment that does jack shit until your next turn.

Precisely this, if your board position is already so advantaged that you can afford to pop permanents every turn to screw your opponent's board, then it seems like you don't need this card, and if you aren't advantaged then this card is at best a net zero, but also likely a loss (functionally a dead draw if you're in a bad spot, casting cost is high especially for black, etc).

**Ghost_Wheel22** · 2012-04-17 08:05

Originally Posted by oldoldman

It can easily be a very real card, it's a Smokestack variant.

Only Smokestack is colorless, controllable, and doesn't exile. Stax was a retardedly good platform, this is just a pisspoor shadow.

**Norellicus** · 2012-04-17 08:22

Holy shit.

Spoiler: show

**Diamicles** · 2012-04-17 08:22

Originally Posted by Weltall

There is a land that draws a card and discards a card. INSANELY good imo.

When I saw it I first thought of the Compulsion cycle in odyssey block, thinking this could be the first of some sort of land cycle, but I doubt they would put that many specialty lands in a 3rd set.

**Ghost_Wheel22** · 2012-04-17 08:42

Originally Posted by Norellicus

Holy shit.

Spoiler: show

http://static.fjcdn.com/comments/Swe...02fd01e629.jpg

**Weltall** · 2012-04-17 09:08

Yeah, that is pretty damn good @_@

That land changes Legacy/Modern almost on the level of Mental Misstep.

In Standard, Humans can play turn 2 Thalia with this land and any control deck might as well just scoop and forfeit.

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