Magic: The Gathering

[miokomioko]

I sure think it is. Most of them cost a bit too much to activate.

[Deftscythe]

I know this is a noob question but I never had to deal with the original Clone, just his new limited cousin, Jwari Shapeshifter. If that comes into play and I remove the card it's copying from play in response, does it come into play as 0/0 or does it still get to copy?

[Solidmoose]

Worldwake


Also, are vampire decks viable at all in competition? I feel like there's just too much synergy with all the vampires in this block to pass up... Not to mention you can easily use Abyssal Persecutor when you pair it with a timed Anowon, the Ruin Sage. If so, what would you splash to avoid Marsh Threaders, Devout Lightcasters, and other bull?

vampires is a very strong deck that i run myself, although Abyssal Persecutor doesnt run too well with the deck, i tested it out at a few tournaments after i got my set to see how it would go and it didnt bode well for me, Vampires is good but its prolly best to just stick Vampires only for the creature base

[Tricen]

I know this is a noob question but I never had to deal with the original Clone, just his new limited cousin, Jwari Shapeshifter. If that comes into play and I remove the card it's copying from play in response, does it come into play as 0/0 or does it still get to copy?

Since Clone/Jwari says "AS this comes into play ....." they can't respond to which you chose since Clone/Jwari has already resolved, and they do not retain priority. They can kill something in response to you playing either of the two, but you chose as it resolved, so if they kill your only thing in play, then yeah you're SoL, but if you have more things then they can't do much.

[Deftscythe]

Since Clone/Jwari says "AS this comes into play ....." they can't respond to which you chose since Clone/Jwari has already resolved, and they do not retain priority. They can kill something in response to you playing either of the two, but you chose as it resolved, so if they kill your only thing in play, then yeah you're SoL, but if you have more things then they can't do much.

Yeah, this was the answer I got elsewhere a while after I asked here. Thanks.

I was actually hoping to get a twofer with one removal spell against my friend's ally deck.

[miokomioko]

Jesus, I opened that damn "Planeswalker" promo bullshit set of cards on Magic Online, now I don't know how to avoid looking at all these useless gold-bordered cards when I'm building my decks since I can't mix them with non-gold-bordered... I'm just trying to build casual "freeform" decks so I can't really tell it to only show my a certain format... Anyone know what to do about this crap?

[Tomiko]

I sure think it is. Most of them cost a bit too much to activate.

I like the RG one since it keeps getting bigger and bigger.


Played in a Legacy tournament yesterday and went 2-2 with a slightly updated version of Fires. Didn't expect to win, but I had fun which was my goal.

[oldoldman]

I like the RG one since it keeps getting bigger and bigger.


Played in a Legacy tournament yesterday and went 2-2 with a slightly updated version of Fires. Didn't expect to win, but I had fun which was my goal.

I wish the WG one blocked baneslayer. That would be so cash.

[Arew]

Celestial Collonade is a pretty good alt-finisher for UW control and UWR control. I'm currently building the UWR control deck, have everything but Jace 2.0's, but those things cost way to damn much. >.>

[Tricen]

Celestial Collonade is a pretty good

All you needed to say really :3

[miokomioko]

I'm just not quite seeing the greatness of the repeated-cost Serra's Angel + Tundra thing that Celestial Collonade is.

I just love that Creeping Tar Pit is usually a "3 mana = 3 dmg" Even if it's not Lightning Bolt-proof during that short time, as well as being a Bayou. It just resonates nicely with my Bloodchief Ascensions.

Also, I forget, do creature-auras fall off when man-lands revert at the end of the turn?

edit: my luckywhore girlfriend just opened her second Jace. chaching...

[Arew]

I'm just not quite seeing the greatness of the repeated-cost Serra's Angel + Tundra thing that Celestial Collonade is.

I just love that Creeping Tar Pit is usually a "3 mana = 3 dmg" Even if it's not Lightning Bolt-proof during that short time, as well as being a Bayou. It just resonates nicely with my Bloodchief Ascensions.

Also, I forget, do creature-auras fall off when man-lands revert at the end of the turn?

edit: my luckywhore girlfriend just opened her second Jace. chaching...

Because it also doubles as a strictly better Sejiri Refuge. The ability to at times block/do damage and then tap it for mana helps speed along matches when otherwise your only other big finisher would be Sphinx of Jwar Isle.

[Deftscythe]

I'm just not quite seeing the greatness of the repeated-cost Serra's Angel + Tundra thing that Celestial Collonade is.

I just love that Creeping Tar Pit is usually a "3 mana = 3 dmg" Even if it's not Lightning Bolt-proof during that short time, as well as being a Bayou. It just resonates nicely with my Bloodchief Ascensions.

Also, I forget, do creature-auras fall off when man-lands revert at the end of the turn?

edit: my luckywhore girlfriend just opened her second Jace. chaching...

Yes, the aura falls off.

[Tricen]

But counters do not.

[miokomioko]

I guess counters don't require a type to initially be valid other than the spell/effect they come from specifying a target and, even so, they don't checks their owner's status past that.

Auras, however, constantly check if they're valid at every single step, similar to a creature having toughness larger than 0... apparently. I may have been out of it, but I feel like this is something that never really came up until they finally printed a man-land that put power/toughness-altering counters on itself and Wizards actually felt like they needed to confirm this rule recently in their preview week article revealing Raging Ravine.

Though I'm not complaining, I feel it's somewhat inconsistent. I wish all the Shadowmoor block stuff specified "permanents" instead of "creatures" when dealing with all the +1/+1 mechanics.

I'm really looking forward to whatever they might do with Rise of the Eldrazi. I was hoping they would make use of that interesting Ghostfire mechanic they teased in Future Sight, which apparently even referenced the Eye of Ugrin. Here's to hoping Ob gets his spark back in card-form (though he probably wouldn't since it would then be possible to have both a Demon version and Planeswalker version of the same person), Sorin goes multicolored since he has to work alongside Nissa, or Cosi is revealed to be someone awesome and possibly U/R.

[oldoldman]

I guess counters don't require a type to initially be valid other than the spell/effect they come from specifying a target and, even so, they don't checks their owner's status past that.

Auras, however, constantly check if they're valid at every single step, similar to a creature having toughness larger than 0... apparently. I may have been out of it, but I feel like this is something that never really came up until they finally printed a man-land that put power/toughness-altering counters on itself and Wizards actually felt like they needed to confirm this rule recently in their preview week article revealing Raging Ravine.

Though I'm not complaining, I feel it's somewhat inconsistent. I wish all the Shadowmoor block stuff specified "permanents" instead of "creatures" when dealing with all the +1/+1 mechanics.

I'm really looking forward to whatever they might do with Rise of the Eldrazi. I was hoping they would make use of that interesting Ghostfire mechanic they teased in Future Sight, which apparently even referenced the Eye of Ugrin. Here's to hoping Ob gets his spark back in card-form (though he probably wouldn't since it would then be possible to have both a Demon version and Planeswalker version of the same person), Sorin goes multicolored since he has to work alongside Nissa, or Cosi is revealed to be someone awesome and possibly U/R.

I think Cosi is an Eldrazi, so it will be colorless./wildspeculation

[Tricen]

Nah, it's been known for a long time that lands retain counters. Ever since Mirrodin. Ravager + Blinkmouth Nexus. There's also that land with graft in that once set I can't remember.

[oldoldman]

Nah, it's been known for a long time that lands retain counters. Ever since Mirrodin. Ravager + Blinkmouth Nexus. There's also that land with graft in that once set I can't remember.

Dissension

[miokomioko]

Well, I'm more complaining about the inconsistency in things like auras and equipment constantly checking if their target is valid/applicable at every single step, where power/toughness-affecting counters can sit on a permanent that has no power-toughness. As far as I know there aren't any effects/spells that can even initially place +1/+1s or -1/-1s on any permanents that aren't creatures. Gilder Bairn comes to mind, but it just doubles whatever counters are already on a specific permanent.


On that note... what happens if, for example:

My opponent pays for and converts their Celestial Collonade into its 4/4 flying vigilance creature mode on my turn.

I cast Spitting Image to make a token copy of target creature and I choose Celestial Collonade.

Do I get a permanent copy of the creature-version of Celestial Collonade or do I get a copy of the land in its entirety and it reverts back into a white/blue land at the end of my turn?

[oldoldman]

You get a copy of the land but it will not be a creature, you would have to still activate it. I could be completely wrong about that fyi.