Oh Texas... (72 year old ninja subdued)

[Konohamaru]

i miss you so bad i just might let you

EDIT: If i remember right you live right near me

on topic i've been tazered before. And police are wayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy to jumpy to do that shit. Police are garbage nation wide.

[Darus Grey]

Tasers are not replacements for guns. Never used in a situation that doesn't reqeire a gun...psh...When was the last time you saw a police shootout and saw the police pull out a taser instead of a gun?

There are plenty of situtations where a taser should be used in a situation that does not require a gun. Terrible wording is terrible.

Lethal Force is Lethal Force. Tasers have an alarmingly high chance to kill you compared to how "safe" they're billed as, and as such are lethal force. If the situation doesn't warrant a gun, there is no reason to use a taser.

Tasers were originally invented and marketed as replacements to guns, and if you even do a damn basic google search you're going to find situations where a police officer used one in a gunfight or against armed criminals with success. This is an appropriate use.

Lethal force against people for traffic violations is not.

[Elvis]

What Would Judge Dredd Do?

[MarkM.]

I don't know if I agree or disagree with the cop using his tazer in this situation, but these articles are sometimes misleading. The voltage of a tazer is not how the strength is truly measured. My best friend is a police officer and he often corrects people when they say stuff about the voltage. It is more the Ohm and not the voltage that determines how potent a tazer is.

In addition to that, the lady was on the side of a busy highway resisting arrest. It doesn't matter if you are 1 or 100, resisting arrest is resisting arrest. He probably wouldn't have tazed her if it would have been in a safer area, but it wasn't.

Finally, the police (in Texas I'm 100% sure of this maybe different in other states) can use their tazers the same way they can use pepper spray. However, they are not allowed to use their batons unless the accused is armed with a non-firearm or knife weapon.

[jmc]

The old woman refused to sign the ticket, and the officer proceeded to read her rights, and ask her to step out of the vehicle so that he could place her under arrest.

She exits the vehicle where she then wants to sign the ticket and avoid going to jail, but since she has already missed her chance, the officer tells her that she cannot go back on her decision and proceeds to attempt to arrest her.

She then attempts to go back to her vehicle, when the officer pushes her out of the way the first time, saving her from being hit by a large pickup truck, (Dualy or whatever the fuck it is) He then tells her to calm down, and to stop refusing his orders. The officer proceeds to attempt to calm her down, while keeping her out of harms way of traffic. after the 9th time of issuing the order to comply, he tazes her, and she then becomes compliant.

In the process, the officer saved her life, the life of other motorists, and then prevented injury to himself and her though the use of the tazer.

She was doing 65 in a 45 work zone area.

Bitch deserved the tazing, and quite frankly, if you're gonna act like a man, be prepared for the consequences.

Also, the best line from the dashboard cam: "I will taze you if need be" "Well fucking taze me, You wouldn't dare taze an old lady, you don't have the guts"

Beat me to it... but well said.

[jmc]

Never justified. Tasers are replacements for guns. They should never be used in any situation that doesn't warrant a gun. They have a small but sizeable chance of killing or seriously injuring people, and the way they're used is criminally negligent.

~400ish have died from police use of a taser.

No, a taser is not a replacement for a firearm.

If someone is pulling a gun on me, i'm not gonna use a fucking taser on him.... so they are no way intended to replace duty firearms.

They are another option in a arsenal of "non"-lethal tatics.

[zoobernut]

I don't know if I agree or disagree with the cop using his tazer in this situation, but these articles are sometimes misleading. The voltage of a tazer is not how the strength is truly measured. My best friend is a police officer and he often corrects people when they say stuff about the voltage. It is more the Ohm and not the voltage that determines how potent a tazer is.

I just thought I would point out that a tasers create an open circuit and send out a set amount of current. The tasers strength is going to be based on how much amperage they produce. The pain or voltage that a person feels is going to be related to the resistance their body has to the electrical current or Ohm's and the amount of amps that the taser is producing. V = IR

Volts are what produce pain, Amps are what cause heart attacks and death and disrupt muscle function. Ohm's represent the natural resistance of the human body.

[Kuya]

I've already made my case before against tasers, but as a related note:


Man dies after police Taser incident - ABC 4.com - Salt Lake City, Utah News

HURRICANE, Utah (ABC 4 News) - The Washington County sheriff's office says a man died Tuesday afternoon after being hit with a Taser during an incident with police near Hurricane.

A sheriff spokesperson said the Taser was deployed by a Hurricane City police officer on state Route
59 in southern Utah.

Police used the Taser on the man after they say he became agitated and could not be subdued.

After being hit by the Taser, police say the man lost consciousness.

Paramedics treated 32-year-old Brian Cardall, but he was later pronounced dead at a St. George hospital.

These things have been happening pretty consistently to start raising alarms.

[Dimmauk]

I've already made my case before against tasers, but as a related note:


Man dies after police Taser incident - ABC 4.com - Salt Lake City, Utah News

These things have been happening pretty consistently to start raising alarms.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v6...eRickJames.jpg


Hey! I have an idea! How about staying calm, talking to the Cop like a normal person, and following orders. Hopefully, you won't get a dickhead cop, and they will treat you like a normal person too.

[Kuya]

I like to be flippant to, but when people die, things do require serious consideration.

[Tomk]

It is more the Ohm and not the voltage that determines how potent a tazer is.

I'm not getting into a tazer argument again but this is incorrect. Even if it was, Ohms are the resistance to the current which in this case is the person's body. So saying that the specific target decides how lethal a tazer is is not a proper defense for tazing an old lady.

[Eticket]

At first glance I felt horrible for the old lady. After reading the transcript of the tape, she had it coming. I agree that he could have tried to hold her down or something but who's to say they don't struggle and one of them goes into traffic? In fact he tried to grab her and she twisted away or pushed him.

From the video transcript...

“Give me the [expletive] thing and I’ll sign it,” she tells Bieze, but the officer has already told her she is being arrested. When Winkfein strays close to the traffic lane, the officer pushes her onto the shoulder.

“You’re gonna shove a 72-year-old woman?” Winkfein yells at him.

“If you don’t step back, you’re gonna be Tased,” Bieze says.

That’s when Winkfein said, “Go ahead. Tase me.”

Even then, Bieze did not use the Taser he had out and ready. He attempted to grab her, but Winkfein twisted away.

“Step back or you’re gonna be Tased, ma’am,” Bieze says again.

“I dare you,” she said.

Winkfein then decided she was leaving and tried to walk back to her truck.

“I’m getting back in my car,” she said.

“You’re gonna be Tased,” Bieze said, blocking her path.

“I’m getting back in my car,” she insists.

“No, ma’am,” he says.

That’s when he finally fired the Taser and Winkfein went down screaming.

[Darus Grey]

No, a taser is not a replacement for a firearm.

If someone is pulling a gun on me, i'm not gonna use a fucking taser on him.... so they are no way intended to replace duty firearms.

They are another option in a arsenal of "non"-lethal tatics.

lolno. You have a really short memory if you don't remember the introduction of tasers. They can kill you...we're not talking 1/100000...we're talking 1/100 here. 400+ people have DIED over MINOR violations due to use of a taser.

[Plow]

Hey! I have an idea! How about staying calm, talking to the Cop like a normal person, and following orders. Hopefully, you won't get a dickhead cop, and they will treat you like a normal person too.

You're forgetting this is BG.


Cops are *ALL* evil bastards out to get us, and we are all allowed to be as crazy and threatening as we want. The cops not allowed to shoot back, even with a tazer, until they're legally dead.


Oh, and this cop is a terrorist because he was trying to use force to stop something from happening.

[archibaldcrane]

darus, remember two things. When jmc says "if someone points a gun at me" it's less hypothetical than if you or I said it, since he's a cop. Also, he put the "non" in non-lethal in quotes, which demonstrates he recognizes that tazers can kill, even though they are considered to be used as an option less lethal than a gun.

That being said jmc, how do you feel about this cop tazing this woman as opposed to just physically restraining and cuffing her? Lazy, or justified?

[Darus Grey]

If someone points a gun at him he's justified pulling a gun on them.

That doesn't change that Tasers were sold to the public when they first started on the scene in the 80s as a replacement for guns. Which is what they are. As I said, lethal force is lethal force...it's not like there's some "extra safe" way to tase people...people just randomly die after being tased. Justify to me how this is appropriate for non violent offenses other than "they had it coming".

If given the choice I'd rather have my knee shattered with a night stick than play death roulette with a taser.

I fully recognize that tasers have a valid use, but use for non-violent offenses is not one of them.

[Plow]

I do remember tazers being "sold" to the citizenry as being replacements for guns, but it was still because they could shoot people with them and be much less likely to cause permanent damage.

I dunno, it does seem like there's something going wrong when people are dying from it. I mean there's videos on youtube of people tazing themselves in the head and directly in the chest and shit.

[archibaldcrane]

I just wonder when the first cop is going to lose the tazer lottery when getting shocked as part of the training.

[Korietsu]

When you're talking about any less than lethal replacement to guns or any other weapon, there's one thing you have to remember, ANYTHING can kill you. Beanbag guns can kill you, stun batons can kill you, physical force of any kind can kill you.

[archibaldcrane]

When you're talking about any less than lethal replacement to guns or any other weapon, there's one thing you have to remember, ANYTHING can kill you. Beanbag guns can kill you, stun batons can kill you, physical force of any kind can kill you.

...no. The physical force necessary for this cop to put this old lady into handcuffs could not have killed her. Sorry, not buying it.