Oh Texas... (72 year old ninja subdued)

[archibaldcrane]

Also, now that she's been properly identified as an agile stealth assassin, I fully support the officer's actions. She could've thrown down one of those smoke bombs and disappeared, or used some of that, um what's it called? Ninjutsu, yeah that's it, to create multiple images of herself, and then the cop would've been really fucked.

It's one thing when you have to deal with a single 72 year old ninja, but 3? Where two are just illusions? Which one do you taze? That's 'Bear calvalry'-level fucked right there.

[Day]

There's not much difference between a taser death, a drowning, accidentally mixing the wrong meds, getting hit while crossing the street, or having a heart attack on an amusement park ride.

Ok, so there's a difference in the circumstances, but nobody expects a taser death just as nobody expects any of the other deaths. Shit happens. For the majority of people, tasing is just an uncomfortable experience.

In fact, I bet more people die from those other causes than tasing, but I'd just be pulling stats out of my ass at that point. It's still a bet I'd make, though.

It'd never have passed approval as a legal method of subduing someone if it had anything but a negligible fatality rate. Unless you think regulation of this sort of thing is more lax than, say, FDA approvals or other safety-related regulations.

Cmon dude, I know you're just playing advocate, but going from taser being lethal to water being lethal is a HUGE jump, over a couple sharks.

[Darus Grey]

The difference is another individual is responsible for the taser death, as it was caused by a deliberate action of people there to PROTECT us(lol right...) who had other options that didn't have a ~1% chance to kill us. There's about 60 taser deaths a year. They're ok because more people die to other things?

Seriously this logic is all over the place.

I want someone to justify to me why people involved in non-violent offenses should be subjected to ANY chance at random death at the hands of police officers. Many of these tasers are over shit like TRAFFIC VIOLATIONS FFS. Granted no one should be resisting...but people are not rational and it's easy to cause panic. Hell many tasing incidents involve NO resistence.

Boggles me as to how people can be ok with this...

This particular situation would of been done with if the police officer let her sign the ticket when she agreed to it after he threatened to arrest her. Policy be damned, he esculated the situation unesseccarily and tased her after she dared him to do it, to show her HE WAS A MAN.

[Drex]

I'd argue there's more than a 1% chance of killing an old lady by taking her down, if we're going to play to the "ohhh the poor elderly just put her in a nice retirement home" crowd. If he broke the bitch's hip physically restraining her, you'd still be outraged I'm sure.

Cops have it lose-lose and she had entitlement issues because she thought her age gave her a get out of jail free card. What if she got back in her car and sped off back into traffic? How long should the cop have let the situation go on, just because she's an old lady? What if he tried to physically restrain her again (he had already tried once) and she ran into traffic? Or ran into her car and locked herself in? Now what?

[Eticket]

What's odd is looking at the list of taser deaths in Canada. Drugs are a contributing factor in almost half 13/27 of the deaths noted since 2003.

In the US there have been 406 or so since 2002.

Granted, this is not an independent or objective site so their data may be skewed. I would be willing to bet there are other contributing factors in a large number of those cases. However, I will say that the numbers are higher than I would have expected them to be.

With that said, I'm standing by with my feeling that the use was justified in this particular instance. Is the use justified in every case? I'm sure it's not. This case only stands out because of the age of the woman involved.

[Khamsin]

The difference is another individual is responsible for the taser death, as it was caused by a deliberate action of people there to PROTECT us(lol right...) who had other options that didn't have a ~1% chance to kill us. There's about 60 taser deaths a year. They're ok because more people die to other things?

It's not so much a 1% chance to kill us, as it is a 1% chance to kill someone with a medical condition or other factor that makes death a possibility.

For most of us, they can tase us 1000 times (on separate occasions, not all at once) and it won't kill us.

Cmon dude, I know you're just playing advocate, but going from taser being lethal to water being lethal is a HUGE jump, over a couple sharks.

Your reaction to me saying water is lethal is based on your perception of water being harmless, and indeed it is the basis of life. But people still drown. Dumbass women competing for Wiis still die of water poisoning. The point being made here is that water, like tasers, are ordinarily harmless. In other words, I wasn't saying water is lethal, I was saying tasers are as harmless as water. But shit can still happen. Some people can't swim, some people have heart conditions or are on (possibly illegal) drugs that weaken the heart.

Now, I don't want to pull stats out of my ass, so let's just play a thought experiment.

Take 1000 random people, regardless of whether they can swim or have heart conditions. Put those 1000 people in deep water, and see how many live. Now tase them, and see how many live. Dry them off first, if you want. Which killed more people? In reality, you'd probably need a bigger sample size to see a death, but still... think about it. I don't know the answer, but I'm still pretty sure you won't see a huge difference between the two.

[Day]

The difference is in the application. Cops don't throw rivers at people.

[Khamsin]

The difference is in the application. Cops don't throw rivers at people.

Then compare it to whatever other normally-harmless-thing-that-still-kills-people you want. Prescription mix-ups, ecoli in your burgers, getting hit by a bus while crossing the street, going after your hat under the batman ride and ending up not needing it afterall, etc.

[grantlogan]

Some of you need to be tazed right in your leaky vajayjays.

[archibaldcrane]

The difference is in the application. Cops don't throw rivers at people.

ninjas aren't people, and a heavy dose of river application would be warranted in any encounter with a ninja.

[Day]

Then compare it to whatever other normally-harmless-thing-that-still-kills-people you want. Prescription mix-ups, ecoli in your burgers, getting hit by a bus while crossing the street, going after your hat under the batman ride and ending up not needing it afterall, etc.

That's the crazy thing about analogies and comparisons they often make no sense when applied. We are discussing the means of restraining someone (72 year old someone) with the use of technology that is not potentially lethal. It's really not a hard concept. People die everyday from crazy shit yes, but that has absolutely nothing to do with the topic at hand.

[Dimmauk]

Some of you need to be tazed right in your leaky vajayjays.

http://www.tvgasm.com/newsgasm/oprahsyoutube.jpg

[Xiona]

yea sending a high voltage shock through an elderly persons body wouldnt screw with a likely age weakened heart... not lethal my ass haha

then again she was a ninja

[Athas]

Tazers are so incredibly dangerous that only someone with the extreme mental and physical fortitude of an elderly Texan woman can withstand being subjected to one without dieing.

Oh wait, I forgot she was a ninja.

[Kuya]

We must all stop forgetting how dangerous ninjas are to this great nation of ours.

[Dimmauk]

Ya'll forget that the Grandma's in Texas are tough bitches. Ask one, they will tell you the same.

[Gregorio]

Lethal Force is Lethal Force. Tasers have an alarmingly high chance to kill you compared to how "safe" they're billed as, and as such are lethal force. If the situation doesn't warrant a gun, there is no reason to use a taser.

Tasers were originally invented and marketed as replacements to guns, and if you even do a damn basic google search you're going to find situations where a police officer used one in a gunfight or against armed criminals with success. This is an appropriate use.

Lethal force against people for traffic violations is not.

Tasers are not considered lethal force just because they have a small chance at killing you. As mentioned earlier, police batons can kill you, shotgun bean bags can kill you, hell I'd be willing to be there's even been severe allergic reactions or possible deaths due to mace or pepper spray...but none of these are considered lethal force.

As for not using a taser unless the situation warrants a gun...I can name plenty after watching 1 or 2 episodes of COPS. I saw an (unarmed) giant drunk guy tossing around 3 cops while resisting arrest. They had to get him to comply somehow, so out comes the taser. A gun would not be required if the taser was not present...but batons and beating would. Any situation where a person is violently resisting arrest and risks harming the officer or someone else a taser is justified.

And I may be googling it wrong (I tried a few different times), but I was unable to find any articles about a police officer using a taser during a gunfight.

[Melchiah]

If the woman had a gun, this could've been avoided.

If "Darwinism" becomes a bannable offense, this one should be right behind it.

So GD retarded.

[Dimmauk]

If "Darwinism" becomes a bannable offense, this one should be right behind it.

So GD retarded.

I don't support terrorism, but I agree both of those should be bannable.

[bigrougabagel]

I don't support terrorism, but I agree both of those should be bannable.

I am starting to dread the darwinism myself, but headspaces comment seems random enough that it wouldnt cause a bandwagoning effect. Or perhaps i just havent come across it enough for it to register as "god not this again".

topic: Old lady being a shitty old lady. Lazy cop being a shitty lazy cop. Both of them made mistakes and neither one is completely to blame. The old lady should have been more rational towards the cop. Said cop shouldnt have let the situation escalate as far as it went.

conclusion: Keep tasers until all cops have mastered jedi mind tricks, or the vulcan neck pinch, whichever clan of geekdom they subscribe to.