So... my girl wants to be celibate...

[Weeks]

And given that, how can your personal feelings of "well, i like these religious rules.. but i dont like those ones", have any bearing on which religion is actually true?

Because if you're going to believe in the fucking Easter bunny, may as well be the one who gives you candy, not the one who leaves pebbles of shit on your doorstep.

[Obev]

Uh... not a valid comparison. He's not wanting to go on a drugged-up sex-crime spree with his girlfriend. If gettin' it on with someone you love is the same as having a drug-fueled orgy, I can see you're going with an Old Testament kind of god here. If he is getting his ass out of this relationship he better not look back, lest he turn into a pillar of salt.

I fail to see how the act of having sexual intercourse with a single partner you love could be interpreted as "SCREWING UP." Monogamy is marriage by any other name. Does an omniscient deity really need to go down to the records office? Surely if God can see them screwing, God can see they love each other.

People pick religious beliefs based on what is most comfortable to them all the time. It's called conversion. Why else would religions have a compulsion to go out and "spread the good news" if people didn't have the capacity to pick their religion? This isn't even really about religious belief. It's about doctrine.

"Which one you believe has a deity that is actually the creator of/in control of the universe" is a non-issue if you're talking about most "Western" religion, from Judaism through Christianity to Islam and beyond. It's all the same god. It's a matter of how you interpret books and which prophets you believe. The considerably large text of biblical apocrypha is testament (pun intended) to the fact that religions do just that: pick and choose their doctrines. Under the broad umbrella of Christianity there are dozens if not hundreds of conflicting viewpoints on everything from the relatively banal issues of sexuality and morality to the fairly major point of faith that is transubstantiation. "Truth" is a stupid word to use when discussing which religious doctrine is the one for you - if there is a deity, it would be so far beyond our simple dialectics of "right/wrong" that we could not (and looking at the world have not) ever fully understand.

I'm not suggesting he go all Richard Dawkins on his girlfriend. Just point her to one of the more... sane avenues of her church.

I do rather suspect that you're trolling. Good night.

[Xiona]

it will never go back to what it was. marriage means less sex on average. most likely she will tell you she only wants to have sex for procreation not to mention hounding you for jerking it.

it sounded like a good run while it lasted but honestly shes not the girl you originally started dating. yes we all change but not that drastically and in such an extreme direction. sex is very important to a relationship.

i would tell her that she is moving in a completely different direction than you. there are plenty of women out there who dont let a really old book of fiction dictate their enjoyment of life.

[zoobernut]

PS: How does it make any sense to pick a religious belief based on what is most comfortable to you? Shouldnt it be done by which one you believe has a deity that is actually the creator/in control of the Universe?
And given that, how can your personal feelings of "well, i like these religious rules.. but i dont like those ones", have any bearing on which religion is actually true?

That is the funny part. I have yet to meet a single person in the world that believes in a religion because they *truly* believe in it. Most are because they were raised that way or like it or feel most comfortable with it. Virtually every religion in the world is a complete orgy of different sects that have conflicting and different beliefs because people do exactly that. They pick and choose what they want to believe in. Religion doesn't exist because it is fact, it exists because it gives humans comfort in the face of the unknown and because it is there to comfort people they adjust it and change it to fit their needs. This is why religion evolves and changes.


Edit: Just to be clear this is completely separate from the existence of God so we don't have to go into that argument. This is strictly with respect to organized religion.

[grownup]

Uh... not a valid comparison. He's not wanting to go on a drugged-up sex-crime spree with his girlfriend.

you mixed comparisons. that comparison was not made in the context of the OP and his girlfriend, but on the "unconditional love" thing.

"Truth" is a stupid word to use when discussing which religious doctrine is the one for you - if there is a deity, it would be so far beyond our simple dialectics of "right/wrong" that we could not (and looking at the world have not) ever fully understand.

true enough.... but what is also true, is that if you believe in a particular religion, and you believe that that religion has revelations from The Creator, saying, "I want you to act in This Fashion"... then it doesnt matter whether you understand "the deity" as a being. What matters is that you behave as the deity wishes you to.

The parental reference is again very relevant here:

A parent tells a child how to act.

Is it important that a 5 year old "fully understand" what it is like to be a parent, and adult morality, and what drives them?
no.
It's only important for the 5 year old to understand that it is a child, NOT an adult, and it should behave in the manner its parents tell it to behave.
Primarily, because the parental rules are for its own good. Even though the 5 year old has no mental capacity to understand WHY it is for its own good.

If there is a Creator that made us... wouldnt that being have a view of what is good and bad for us, "so far beyond our simple views" that we couldnt even fully understand it?
We'd be really stupid children to think we know better.

[Correction]

Oh boy another religious debate! Of no relevance to whether or not Valisk should cave to his girl's corrosive, unrealistic demands or find another girl willing to put out like he wants her to.

[Bweigelt]

you mixed comparisons. that comparison was not made in the context of the OP and his girlfriend, but on the "unconditional love" thing.




true enough.... but what is also true, is that if you believe in a particular religion, and you believe that that religion has revelations from The Creator, saying, "I want you to act in This Fashion"... then it doesnt matter whether you understand "the deity" as a being. What matters is that you behave as the deity wishes you to.

The parental reference is again very relevant here:

A parent tells a child how to act.

Is it important that a 5 year old "fully understand" what it is like to be a parent, and adult morality, and what drives them?
no.
It's only important for the 5 year old to understand that it is a child, NOT an adult, and it should behave in the manner its parents tell it to behave.
Primarily, because the parental rules are for its own good. Even though the 5 year old has no mental capacity to understand WHY it is for its own good.

If there is a Creator that made us... wouldnt that being have a view of what is good and bad for us, "so far beyond our simple views" that we couldnt even fully understand it?
We'd be really stupid children to think we know better.

I had a big long post typed out before you posted this, but I think I can summarize what I was trying to say in four words and this confirms it.

You are fucking crazy.

[Andarvi]

I had a big long post typed out before you posted this, but I think I can summarize what I was trying to say in four words and this confirms it.

You are fucking crazy.

Yup. approaching the elphaba level of crazy.

[Ryko]

You're planning to marry her, right? Look at it like she's just giving you a head start on not having sex with her.

Oh god I lol'd

[kuronosan]

you mixed comparisons. that comparison was not made in the context of the OP and his girlfriend, but on the "unconditional love" thing.




true enough.... but what is also true, is that if you believe in a particular religion, and you believe that that religion has revelations from The Creator, saying, "I want you to act in This Fashion"... then it doesnt matter whether you understand "the deity" as a being. What matters is that you behave as the deity wishes you to.

The parental reference is again very relevant here:

A parent tells a child how to act.

Is it important that a 5 year old "fully understand" what it is like to be a parent, and adult morality, and what drives them?
no.
It's only important for the 5 year old to understand that it is a child, NOT an adult, and it should behave in the manner its parents tell it to behave.
Primarily, because the parental rules are for its own good. Even though the 5 year old has no mental capacity to understand WHY it is for its own good.

If there is a Creator that made us... wouldnt that being have a view of what is good and bad for us, "so far beyond our simple views" that we couldnt even fully understand it?
We'd be really stupid children to think we know better.

This is such a stupid fucking analogy of religion that I wish you would write a new religious book, form your own religion, then ritually kill yourselves to meet your "creator".

If a creator created us and gave us free will, and moral rules to abide by, then clearly we are capable of understanding these rules and are not children.

Stop trying to be so deep when you use shallow words. You look like a fool.

[Skjie]

i would tell her that she is moving in a completely different direction than you. there are plenty of women out there who dont let a really old book of fiction dictate their enjoyment of life.

There are other women. A woman who asks you to change fundamentally doesn't actually love you.

[Grenfang]

Uh... not a valid comparison. He's not wanting to go on a drugged-up sex-crime spree with his girlfriend. If gettin' it on with someone you love is the same as having a drug-fueled orgy, I can see you're going with an Old Testament kind of god here. If he is getting his ass out of this relationship he better not look back, lest he turn into a pillar of salt.

I fail to see how the act of having sexual intercourse with a single partner you love could be interpreted as "SCREWING UP." Monogamy is marriage by any other name. Does an omniscient deity really need to go down to the records office? Surely if God can see them screwing, God can see they love each other.

People pick religious beliefs based on what is most comfortable to them all the time. It's called conversion. Why else would religions have a compulsion to go out and "spread the good news" if people didn't have the capacity to pick their religion? This isn't even really about religious belief. It's about doctrine.

"Which one you believe has a deity that is actually the creator of/in control of the universe" is a non-issue if you're talking about most "Western" religion, from Judaism through Christianity to Islam and beyond. It's all the same god. It's a matter of how you interpret books and which prophets you believe. The considerably large text of biblical apocrypha is testament (pun intended) to the fact that religions do just that: pick and choose their doctrines. Under the broad umbrella of Christianity there are dozens if not hundreds of conflicting viewpoints on everything from the relatively banal issues of sexuality and morality to the fairly major point of faith that is transubstantiation. "Truth" is a stupid word to use when discussing which religious doctrine is the one for you - if there is a deity, it would be so far beyond our simple dialectics of "right/wrong" that we could not (and looking at the world have not) ever fully understand.

I'm not suggesting he go all Richard Dawkins on his girlfriend. Just point her to one of the more... sane avenues of her church.

I do rather suspect that you're trolling. Good night.

QFT, I love this post.

Personally, to the OP, I would give it a month, maybe two if you think you can handle it. Make sure you get to the bottom of why she's really asking you to do this. If it's really about the religion, well, unfortunately religious compatibility is usually a pretty big deal in a relationship, especially to the religious. As Obev said, you can try and steer her down a more "liberal" path of Christianity, but at the end of the day if she really fundamentally believes this shit and you don't it's probably not going to work out. Punishing yourself for her belief in the great sky fairy isn't going to lead to a healthy relationship down the road, and conversely, neither is coercing or guilting her into having sex against her beliefs.

More than likely though she's just a psycho (read:woman) who heard some crazy Pat Robertson speech on daytime CBN, thought it would "improve" your relationship, realize the error of her ways, and you two will be fucking again in weeks.

[Kerberoz]

Even without the crazy religion shit, using sex as a tool = goodbye. It'll only get worse, not better. I doubt she'll ever change. Not marriage material if she pulls that shit even once.

[HadesChubbs]

I know you're trolling (you can't be this stupid). Now, I'm not defending her at all, it's just odd that she'd want that from one day to another. I say something wicked is going on here that we don't know. Irregardless, her demands would throw me off too if mine asked me that out of the blu.

You must have a vagina, cause you girls stick together like nothing else.

OP's g/f is a bitch, if she doesn't want to please her man, she better fucking believe hes going to do it himself. If she doesn't want you doing it either, then kick her to the curb. Easy.

[HadesChubbs]

you mixed comparisons. that comparison was not made in the context of the OP and his girlfriend, but on the "unconditional love" thing.




true enough.... but what is also true, is that if you believe in a particular religion, and you believe that that religion has revelations from The Creator, saying, "I want you to act in This Fashion"... then it doesnt matter whether you understand "the deity" as a being. What matters is that you behave as the deity wishes you to.

The parental reference is again very relevant here:

A parent tells a child how to act.

Is it important that a 5 year old "fully understand" what it is like to be a parent, and adult morality, and what drives them?
no.
It's only important for the 5 year old to understand that it is a child, NOT an adult, and it should behave in the manner its parents tell it to behave.
Primarily, because the parental rules are for its own good. Even though the 5 year old has no mental capacity to understand WHY it is for its own good.

If there is a Creator that made us... wouldnt that being have a view of what is good and bad for us, "so far beyond our simple views" that we couldnt even fully understand it?
We'd be really stupid children to think we know better.

A parent REMINDS the child how to act, because they dont remember very long. When is the last time God reminded me how to act? 2,000 years? I believe in a higher power, but if this higher power gave us the capabilities we have, then it would understand why we show doubt... why we use reason to deduct there may or may not be a higher power. If a "God" wanted us to believe blindly, why would he give us the intellectual capabilities we posses?

Your analogy is completely invalid, and you should probably just stop talking at this point.

[Fridell]

church

This is the main thing, church.....a bunch of idiots resides there, burn it.

[Arvin]

break up asap

[Plow]

Lonng story short: I met my girlfriend 4 years ago. We were very serious at first, took some time off to "grown up" and make sure we were really right for each other, etc. We had sex the 2nd week of our relationship. I was her first. We had sex 1-8 times a night, 3 days a week for about 2 months. Then we took our break. Had sex with her maybe 3 times a year for 2 years during our "break". Started talking seriously again at the end of last year and made it official. Since then we have had sex 1-6 times a day, 5 days a week, for the last 8 months.

Now I don't know what happened at church, but afterwards, she texted me and requested that we be celibate until marriage and we dicussed it all day. How would you handle the situation? I feel like she put me in a "bad" position since we didn't start off that way and we have been having sex for so long. I really do love her and want to have a family and future with her once I get out of law school. But I don't know if I can do this whole celibacy thing.

tl;dr Girlfriend wants to be celibate after 4 years of sex. What would you do?

Pretty obvious she was concerned you might be exactly the way you are.

[Onigami The Yagudo King]

Bringing up a subject earlier in the topic, it's not like shes got a gauge on your dick that tells her whether or not you've been masturbating or not. I say go with it if you really love her, and if you feel like it, stay completely celibate to test your mettle. However, if you feel the self test is unneccesary (completely up to you), then by all means, do what you have to in order to keep your head in the game and in the relationship (obviously not cheating or along those lines). Hell, make a game out of it to see how many times you can do it with her in the same house. Make a goddamn game out of it.

Also, you have to realize that if she is implementing the word of the church into your relationship with her now, and is truly committed to it, this only means that she will continue to do so even after you marry her, if you do. Whether you are religious or not, it may be wise to learn more about subjects that you may or may not know about in order to further understand why she decides to do or say things a certain way to you. This doesnt mean you have to fully convert and become a bible thumping christian and baptize yourself. It only means youre educated on the subject matter that would otherwise confuse some one who has no prior knowledge to christian customs. You arent doing it to find self realization and give yourself over to a religion, youre doing it because you truly love her and want to completely understand the other person you plan to supposedly spend the rest of your life with. But who knows, doing those kinds of things may actually open some doors for you and bring Christ into your life, completely up to your descretion, obviously. I guess all i'm saying is, you dont have to turn into an indoctrinated fanatic in order to learn about the source of her feelings.

On another side of things, if your sexual habits with her are truly as active as you say, i'm also willing to side with a couple other fellow BG'ers and just tell you shes going through a faze and after a month or two, she'll break and miss the sexual aspect of your already active relationship.

Best wishes

[archibaldcrane]

Man, I know it's too late now, but you could've really blown your mind by replying to her text: "Really? Phew, that was really starting to grate on me. So you mean we'll really never have to do that again? What a relief...thanks, babe."