4870 X2 vs 285GTX

[avelle]

I'm starting to spec out a new system and pretty much the only thing stopping me is I can't decide between video cards. Part of me wants to stay away from Nvidia because of the continued problems I've had with FFXI framerates and my 8800GTS and part of me wants to stay away from the X2 card because I'm not sure how that will interact with an older game like FFXI.

These are the two cards I'm looking at:
Newegg.com - EVGA 02G-P3-1185-AR GeForce GTX 285 2GB 512-bit DDR3 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP Ready SLI Supported Video Card - Desktop Graphics / Video Cards

Newegg.com - SAPPHIRE 100251SR Radeon HD 4870 X2 2GB 512-bit (256-bit x 2) GDDR5 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP Ready CrossFire Supported Video Card - Desktop Graphics / Video Cards

I realize both of these cards are far and beyond what FFXI requires, but so was my 8800GTS and that thing just did not get along well with FFXI at all. Anyone have feedback on either cards or possibly a link to somewhere to go do more research on what's working best these days?

[Pikarya]

Almost everyone is going to tell you the 4870 (fan boys aside).

[Akiyama]

IIRC, the video card isn't what effects FFXI as much as the processor does. That being said, both cards are really good in my opinion. nVidia fans will tell you the 285, ATI fans will tell you the 4870X2, but I don't see a problem in either one. Go with whichever is cost effective.

[Reality]

lower resolutions 1400x900 > 1680x1050 > 1920x1200, those two cards are practically identical. 2560x1600 and adding effects like AA and AF, the 4870X2 will pull away, assuming the game supports crossfire well

[avelle]

lower resolutions 1400x900 > 1680x1050 > 1920x1200, those two cards are practically identical. 2560x1600 and adding effects like AA and AF, the 4870X2 will pull away, assuming the game supports crossfire well

This is my concern. The 4870X2 is essentially crossfire but on one board right? Does that mean something like FFXI will only take advantage of one GPU? Or does it even matter?

[Kryssan]

FFXI totally isn't going to care about either videocard. Depending on your luck you may or may not suffer Zfighting (believe it or not I had an 8800 that actually not only worked well with FFXI, but did not suffer from zfighting -- it CAN happen, fairly rare though, even in my own experiences). Haven't had a nV card in a while though.


As long as you have a program to let you edit the details (RivaTuner/ATT/etc) its not going to matter. Choice is based on personal preference and the size of your wallet.



Real question you should be asking is whether or not the other games/programs you use can get the full benefits of the cards, and whether or not your motherboard can support it/get the most out of the cards. It'd be nice if SE would let us know some details about the graphics requirements and capabilities of FFXIV, but I have a feeling we'll probably only find out at Beta, or worse, release.

[avelle]

What is Zfighting? I'm planning the system around the upcoming games, Aion, FF14, etc, but I don't want it to stutter on FFXI so trying to get an idea of what works well.

[Pikarya]

Z-fighting - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

[avelle]

Ya, I definitely have that going on in FFXI. I wondered what was causing that. :/ Do the ATI cards have that problem in FFXI?

[Kryssan]

Unfortunately yes. I have yet to find a combination with ATI or nV that gets around the zfighting issue in FFXI with the latest versions of their cards and a variety of drivers, official and third party. As the gap between FFXI's engine and the current graphics hardware becomes wider, I sincerely doubt this problem will be one that is corrected. We all just kinda suffer through it and hope that either someone will come up with a fix or else.

[guartz]

I like how people blame the cards, and not the software.

Go with ATI imho, unless you foresee a future where Physx is a required feature.

edit:

The way I think of it, is, ATI is better future proof, and while gtx 285 is better for now,
I don't think it will fair as well, say, 1 year from now.

[Solefald]

Well first of all why are you considering two very high-end cards? Do you have dual displays, or a 30" display, or play on an HDTV? These are the only situations in which cards this powerful can really be justified. Either of them would be overkill for a typical 20-22" display.

CrossfireX/SLI tends to be somewhat buggy and doesn't work in all games, so if those are your only two choices I would go with the Nvidia 285. However, ATI is definitely better for FFXI and like the guy above said, it might have a better lifespan than the Nvidia (I won't go into details but in general ATI seems to have a better long term business strategy.) Personally I would go with a Radeon 4870 or 4890 1GB.

[avelle]

Well first of all why are you considering two very high-end cards? Do you have dual displays, or a 30" display, or play on an HDTV? These are the only situations in which cards this powerful can really be justified. Either of them would be overkill for a typical 20-22" display.

CrossfireX/SLI tends to be somewhat buggy and doesn't work in all games, so if those are your only two choices I would go with the Nvidia 285. However, ATI is definitely better for FFXI and like the guy above said, it might have a better lifespan than the Nvidia (I won't go into details but in general ATI seems to have a better long term business strategy.) Personally I would go with a Radeon 4870 or 4890 1GB.

I thought about going with the 4890. The reasoning for buying a card like this is wanting to not have to buy another one until next upgrade. I run a 24" display at 1920x1200 but basically I just want the best possible frame rates I can get for the games due out soonish as well as something that won't piss me off in FFXI. If I put together a new system and get frame rates in the teens in FFXI I think I may go crazy, but maybe it's just destined to be that way. I really do think its the issue with my 8800 and drivers for FFXI. But meh.

[fishstix]

I hear ATI is glitchy/laggy in Aion. I'd look into this.

Also, Aion definitely doesn't need a powerhouse to run well. I can run my graphics settings at 80% of the max with my crappy 256mb geforce 8500 gt @ 1920x1080. You can probably cap out the settings with your 8800 gts, if your cpu is also decent. I've only played in the normal pve so far though, haven't seen any massive pvp action yet, so can't say anything about how well an average card will perform in like a 30v30 battle or something >.>

[Xanthe]

I had a 4870X2 for about 8 months before it died on me. The stock cooling solutions leave much to be desired and its VRAM ended up cooking on me (my case has otherwise superior airflow). If you can I would suggest getting an aftermarket cooling solution or going with a model/brand that doesn't use the reference cooler design. I ended up replacing mine with a Sapphire RADEON 4890 with Vapor-X cooling technology (similar concept to heat pipes). It isn't a dual processor board, but as others have said that wouldn't have a bearing on FFXI anyway. The board can be run in Crossfire with another if needed. Also to note is that it have four integrated display connections (though only two can be used at once): HDMI, DVI, VGA, and Apple DisplayPort.

[avelle]

Are all of these cards except the Vapor-X using the reference cooling design?

Newegg.com - Computer Hardware,Video Cards & Video Devices,Desktop Graphics / Video Cards,Radeon HD 4000 series,Radeon HD 4890,

I was leaning towards getting the 4890 Vapor-X but it seems to be on backorder or something.

[avelle]

Ok, going to post what I'm picking up so maybe those with more knowledge than me can give it a look over and see if I'm missing something important. I'm basically just replacing the core of my main pc so I have things like harddrives, cdroms etc.

Going with a combo I saw Minions mention in another post:

i7 920, Asus 6T motherboard, 6gigs of Corsair Dominator memory
Newegg.com - Computer Parts, PC Components, Laptop Computers, Digital Cameras and more!

Powersupply:
Newegg.com - SeaSonic M12 SS-600HM 600W ATX12V V2.3 / EPS12V V2.91 SLI Certified CrossFire Ready 80 PLUS Certified Modular Active PFC Power Supply - Power Supplies

275GTX
Newegg.com - EVGA 896-P3-1171-AR GeForce GTX 275 Superclocked Edition 896MB 448-bit DDR3 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP Ready SLI Supported Video Card - Desktop Graphics / Video Cards

Was going to originally go with a 4890 like Xanthe and Sole suggested but the one with the Vapor-X cooler was on backorder and the 275 seems to outperform the current generation single gpu ATI cards anyways.

With the combo deal, everything comes out to $1,028.96 before shipping. I was aiming for around 1k so this works out pretty well.

[Solefald]

I think the memory in that combo was brought up in another thread, it's about $80 more expensive than similar kits just for some supersized heatsinks. So really the combo discount isn't all that much. Newegg has several other combos with the Core i7 that could save you some money, about $20-$100 cheaper depending on how much you mind scaling back.

Everything else looks fine.

[mootsfox]

I've got a HD4870X2, but the reason is to power my 30" display.

For a 24" a GTX260 or HD4850 would be a much smart choice. The HD4850 is a bit slower (10-15%) than the GTX260, but it's far cheaper ($85ish vs $150).