BG Legal: Search and Seizure

[Suited Aces]

pretty much covers you walking down the street and in your car. Entering someone's property(store or w/e) is not covered.

Maybe in the state you live in. In PA you can carry anywhere that isn't a federal building or a school, and places like airport terminals. Until recently it was unlawful to carry on any lands run by the DNR, but i believe that law was overturned.

Any store, restaurant or house is fine unless they have a sign posted, even then it's not "illegal" (you can't get charged with anything), they can only tell you to leave.

[Absolutely Virtue]

You know, if you didn't own a gun in the first place, this would never have happened. But look at the bright side: you're far more likely to kill someone you care about than one of those big, mean, scary guys you're afraid of.

So you've got that going for you, which is nice.

[guartz]

I just hope you are not posting from work, Mel.

[Nystul]

doesn't search and seizure apply to government agents? Like the first amendment, which everyone screams has been violated when a guy next to them tells them to be quiet really only applies to congress and the states. If a cop goes next door and rummages through things it's a 4th amendment violation. If I go next door and rummage it's B+E. This guy brought a gun to his desk- which isn't his anyway since the state owns that property. Call me crazy but he's fucked. And if you rely on "no proof, his word against mine" then you're fucked still. Tons of people get fired based on the boss's word against the employee.

[Takedown3]

stricter guns laws etc

[Melchiah]

You know, if you didn't own a gun in the first place, this would never have happened. But look at the bright side: you're far more likely to kill someone you care about than one of those big, mean, scary guys you're afraid of.

So you've got that going for you, which is nice.

Obvious troll, etc.

Also, my college campus is in downtown Birmingham. As a student who takes classes at night and has to walk a few blocks to and from my car, and taking into account a recent case where a freshman girl was shot to death in a campus parking lot... yeah I'm pretty sure my situation warrants my having a weapon, and you're an idiot.

[*Shinzon*]

Why do most people chime in that having a gun invites some sort of violence inherently? Give me a break already. And as far as your situation goes, contact a local lawyer have him check out what the laws in your area are and then go from there. Even though it's not a federal building, state buildings and state employees are usually subject to different kinds of rules and punishment the same way federal employees are.

[Slapper]

There's really no evidence that can be produced other than his word,

Except for this thread.

[aurik]

First of all, it's pretty certain that you consent to your person and property being searched at work unless it is in a secured area where you have a reasonable expectation of privacy. You don't have the expectation of privacy in or around your work desk / cubicle even if there are locks on it. Things like personal lockers SOMETIMES do (but usually the employer will have you sign away your right to privacy there to cover his own ass. Locked in a car on the premises you sometimes have the right to privacy, sometimes not. Depends if you signed away that right, depends on where in the vehicle the item was stored (ie, a trunk or locked glovebox has more right to privacy than something laying in plain view), etc. It's all kind of irrelevant because the item was not found in your car anyway.

As for your boss going up the chain immediately, he is almost certainly required to do so. Not doing so and cutting you some slack would put his job in jeopardy, and I'm sure you'd agree that he shouldn't have to risk his job to save yours when you were the one who made a mistake.

So, in summary, suck it up. You chose to engage in behavior that has inherent risks, you messed up, and now you might have to deal with consequences.

[Dimmauk]

Did the OP contact a real lawyer yet?

[Melchiah]

Did the OP contact a real lawyer yet?

I don't think it's going to come to that.

@aurik: I disagree, the 4th Amendment provides protection for your person, your home, your papers and your effects. My bag falls under that last category. It's no different than searching a woman's purse, I just happen to be a man.

The issue here is that it was done without my knowledge or presence. You have the right to be present when your things are searched legally with a warrant.

[Mistress Stowastiq]

Contact a lawyer. Refer to my signature.

^
Apologize officially to your boss and all involved. If you lose your job, do not try to sue or represent yourself against them for loss of your job unless you have a concealed weapons permit for the city/county and area where you had the weapon. If you do not have permit, depending on your local laws, you could face charges for a concealed weapon should they report it to the police.

As long as you have no prior agreement with your employer about property search and access within the property line of the building when holding company property such as keys, it was likely wrong for the boss to search your car. However, bringing that up opens you to explaining why you had the gun in the first place.

No matter the legal part about illegal search, they have to bring up the weapon and its official permit/possession status in court. With all of the media hysteria on public shootings, it is a really sensitive area to mess around with.

Illegal search/seizure usually relates to law officials prosecuting you for items they did not have a right to search for in the first place. This is a different situation.

There are plenty of attorneys who give free consultation so check that out. Attorney should be able to give you an assessment of your rights and possible areas for prosecution.

You might also check the NRA homepages and support affiliations and Employee/workplace laws home pages for info on rights in your area.

Good luck to you

[Correction]

So if the OP is unwilling to seek a real lawyer because he's sure it's going to be okay, what was the point of seeking BG's counsel?

[aurik]

I don't think it's going to come to that.

@aurik: I disagree, the 4th Amendment provides protection for your person, your home, your papers and your effects. My bag falls under that last category. It's no different than searching a woman's purse, I just happen to be a man.

The issue here is that it was done without my knowledge or presence. You have the right to be present when your things are searched legally with a warrant.

You're wrong. Your employer does not need a warrant to search you / your effects on the workplace, particularly if he is doing so in a reasonable way (ie no random strip searches) for a legitimate reason (for example, finding a lost item) and without prejudicial bias (ie, searching only blacks / mexicans, as it would be construed as racially motivated harassment).

4th amendment does not apply for civil interactions. It only restricts what the government can search by unilateral assertion of authority. It also does not apply to items that you have explicitly or implicitly granted permission to search, nor does it apply to items secured in locations belonging to other people who may grant permission.

To summarize, YOU FUCKED UP, now stop being chickenshit trying to slide on a technicality.

[Norelco]

Let us know how it goes.

[Qalbert]

I don't know if it is even remotely applicable, but they searched my dorm room for a gun once, and found weed in my roommates bag and he got in trouble for it.

[Vekta]

They have a right to search personal property, but only in your presence, persons conducting any search must be accompanied by a another member of staff to prevent any foul play.

Thats the code that most stick too, if they had done this the OP situation may not even of occurred.

[Norelco]

They have a right to search personal property, but only in your presence, persons conducting any search must be accompanied by a another member of staff to prevent any foul play.

Thats the code that most stick too, if they had done this the OP situation may not even of occurred.

Yeah, since no one else was witness to seeing this gun in the bag, just claim your manager moved the gun from your glovebox to your bag or something. I dunno. Just deny it.

[Melchiah]

There's a limit to what I'm willing to lie about.

My super wasn't trying to get me fired, and I'm not making up a story that would land him in hot water for my fuckup.

The only things I'm upset with him over are the fact that he didn't respect my belongings and just ask me about my bag when we talked about the desk before he opened it, and that he panicked and started this fire burning instead of giving me the chance to correct my original mistake.

[Melchiah]

Let us know how it goes.

As of Friday, letters were written between my boss and I, explanations were given.

Not terminated as of yet, I think there will be a meeting next week to sort the situation out.