Large Hardon Collider

[Max™]

Most importantly, the higgs boson is an essential ingredient of the Standard Model. The Standard Model is basically a general description of all matter, energy, and interactions in the small scale. It's supposed to be the theory of our universe on the small scale. The Higgs Boson is such an important piece of the Standard Model that we can't really feel that it's "complete" until we can experimentally find the Higgs Boson. It's the only particle of the Standard Model that hasn't been experimentally observed yet.

The Standard Model has been incredibly successful at explaining our universe and making new predictions. It's pretty much the standard at which any other small-scale theory is judged. If you're inconsistent with the standard model , you're wrong as far as particle physicist are concerned (within the appropriate energy scales. Every expects that the Standard Model will break down at some point though).

However, the Standard Model is far from perfect. For one, it's sort of an ad hoc theory. It relies on so many different parameters and constants that we physicist arbitrarily set to just the right value so that it gives us good answers. When you start to really look at the Standard Model, it really doesn't look like a satisfactory theory. It just seems way to...I don't know, I guess "ad hoc" really is the best way to describe it.

There's also issues related with point particles and renormalization. Renormalization is basically when you take equations that are non-sense (i.e. infinite), sweep the infinities under a rug, and say "tada! all clear" . Over the past few decades, there has been lots of rigorous mathematical treatment of renormalization, so most physicist don't view it as harshly as they used to. But nonetheless, we all wish deep down inside that renormalization would just go away.

+1

There are a few other big problems with the standard model, but nonetheless, it is still an incredibly successful theory, and the Higgs Boson is an incredibly important part of an incredibly successful theory.

Even outside of the Standard Model, the Higgs Boson is a fundemental aspect of many theories that attempt to describe our universe on the small scale. The LHC is guaranteed to have an incredible impact on our understanding of the universe, regardless of whether or not it finds the Higgs. If it doesn't find the Higgs, it blows a huge whole into the Standard Model (because it means that either the Higgs doesn't exist, or at least gives us a good idea of it's energy (which tells us other important things about it). And if the LHC does find the Higgs, then we've just experimentally verified the origins of mass itself. This will affect every single other theory out there in some dramatic way. Also, it would be the only spin 0 boson in existence, which by itself makes it very interesting to theorist.



Actually, that pretty much is all they're doing lol. But, as in Eliseos' example, if the only way to understand watches were to smash them apart and see what pieces come flying out, then we really have no other choice.

I'd say it's like trying to understand how watches are put together by smashing them together and seeing what lands in your lap...

[Mizango]

What would you need to disprove it?

You mean besides a brain? Then again it would probably depend on which TP you'd ask and their mood that particular day.

[Max™]

String Theory is too elegant a fit for the Universe to be completely wrong, but it is too lost in itself to focus on being totally right.

It is definitely pointing towards the right idea, but right now it's still like jerking off to a mathematics textbook and noticing your jizz looks like a theory of everything.

[Mizango]

Hey man, if you cant see the toe in your spooge something is wrong.

[Max™]

If you're spooging on your own foot, you need to drink more water so you get better range.

[Woozie]

The only thing string theory got right is the fact that we probably need to throw away the idea of point-particles.

[Evensong]

I really enjoy reading this thread! Probably one of the reasons besides FFXI stuff that I keep visiting BG.

Since you're all so good at proficiently explaining Science to both physicists and non-physicists alike, could I ask you to tell me a bit about M-theory in simple terms? Am I correct in that it reconciles (in theory) GR and QM? As much as I am capable of understanding, there is this sort of membrane that wraps itself around, or that is wrapped around the strings and that it gives us 11 dimensions. I really don't know how I'm supposed to imagine these membranes though nor these dimensions...

Also; does either of you agree with M-theory? Or rather, what are your views on it?

[Max™]

M-Theory is like String Theory +1.

If a string is a 1 dimensional loop, a membrane is n dimensional, so a string is a 1 brane, a sheet is a 2 brane, etc.

I'm a strict 4 dimensional type of theorist, though I definitely agree on the extended object concept (no point particles).

[Mizango]

I really enjoy reading this thread! Probably one of the reasons besides FFXI stuff that I keep visiting BG.

Awesome

Since you're all so good at proficiently explaining Science to both physicists and non-physicists alike, could I ask you to tell me a bit about M-theory in simple terms? Am I correct in that it reconciles (in theory) GR and QM?

In the beginning, yes. Upon it's release M-Theory was hyped beyond belief and held the hopes and dreams of so many people since it could have "potentially" be the theory that could unify everything. This is the thing that Einstein tried and failed to do for the last 30-40 years of his life. He was looking for a simple equation that would reconcile incompatible aspects of his theory of general relativity and those of quantum theory that could uniformly explain the nature and behavior of the all matter, energy and everything that ever is and was.

The resulting implications of this knowledge could (through unlocking the secrets of nature) would enable technologies and idea that currently only dared be spoken or dreamed up within the science fiction world to reality and give us an inexhaustible source of energy, technology and even something that would make Dr. Ronald Mallet proud; time travel!

Superstrings on the other hand, has as its core the belief that the four fundamental forces of nature; gravity, electromagnetism, and strong and weak nuclear forces, as well as all matter in the universe are merely different expressions of a single existing force This existing force (which make up all of the material making up all energy and matter) is thought to be made up of tiny vibrating strings that exist in a multidimensional space. Much akin to what Max said, the extra dimensions, those of which that reside beyond the ones we recognize: three spatial dimensions and one time are imagined to be curled up into tiny pockets inside any given observable space.

Long story short, the vibrations of the strings within the afore mentioned multidimensional hyperspace are theorized to interact with the particles that make up everything, that includes all matter and all energy that is and ever has been in existence. I mean its a lot to get your head around, give 'The Elegant Universe' by Brian Greene a shot if you are interested in M-Theory, he does a fabulous job in explaining it in much greater detail than I.

Also; does either of you agree with M-theory? Or rather, what are your views on it?

I personally think that M-theory is indeed interesting and could potentially something to look seriously at at some point in the future but I think for the now and right here it is being pushed too hard in an attempt to make it the "be all that ends all" in an attempt to rush to the the 'theory of everything'.

It is what it is, it is interesting and I love reading about it just like anyone else, but I need a little more in my cup to just up and be all gung ho about it. It would be interesting to hear other people ideas on it. I know how Woozie feels about it, seeing as how we have talked about it off of BG a few times.

How do you feel about it?


Edit: Here is the link to the Brian Greene and the Elegant Universe channel, this should give you immediate gratification as opposed to waiting to get paid to buy the book, although the book is a excellent read.

http://www.youtube.com/view_play_lis...egant+universe

[Takedown3]

wait wait wait, i drink a ton of water and my spooge is only making it to my foot, what am i doing wrong?

[Max™]

Do more kegel exercises, guys can do them as well.

Btw, Einstein was trying to find a way to show a local and real theory, he probably suspected a local and non-counterfactual definite theory by the time he wrote GR.


The Greene channel will do a lot to catch you up on the basics of GR and QFT, and hopefully illustrate the hole in physics.

We have two pillars where we should have one... which is a big part of the problem.

[Kaylia]

Anyone remember how to demonstrate that derivative are unique in R^n? If no one have an analysis book around, I will go to the library this weekend, so don't worry about it (just trying to save some time). And don't waste time trying to solve it if you don't remember how.

[edit]
I was trying to find a contradiction using delta/epislon definition if you assume that 2 limit exists, that's how I remember it at least. The derivative definition doesnt really matter, as long it's for Rn.

[Eliseos]

Looks like the big day is tomorrow (or tonight in the US):

http://www.dw-world.de/dw/article/0,,4911429,00.html

[Woozie]

Looks like the big day is tomorrow (or tonight in the US):

http://www.dw-world.de/dw/article/0,,4911429,00.html

So tonight is the end, huh?

So what's everyone going to do in their last few hours we have left to live? I haven't put much thought into it, but I guess it's too late now. It feels kinda weird knowing that the entire universe is going to be destroyed tonight, but I knew this day would come sooner or later.

[Mizango]

I'm going out with a big bang.

[Eliseos]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ljtuGoIIKGs

EDIT: The best part about if the world actually somehow does end tonight, the people who were saying so can't live to gloat about it!

[Celeras]

How anti-climatic

[Psion]

Give it time, Rome wasn't singularitized in a day, you know!

[Kryssan]

Pfft. Humans still seeking the easy way out. Why is it that our apocalypses can't be like something out of Mission Possible? If we deign to have one it should be long and drawn out and involve as much suffering as possible. This quick stuff just doesn't cut it.

[Max™]

http://public.web.cern.ch/public/en/LHC/LHC-en.html


http://lhc.web.cern.ch/lhc/Cooldown_status.htm Magnet temperatures, they aren't cycling til these are all cooled down.


http://aliceinfo.cern.ch/Collaboration/index.html Quagma studies (Quark-Gluon plasma)


http://atlas.ch/ The Atlas and the CMS are both the "big bang" labs.
http://cms.web.cern.ch/cms/index.html They are using slightly different methods, but both will search for the Higgs, Dark Matter, and extra dimensions.


http://lhcb-public.web.cern.ch/lhcb-public/ Regarding beauty quarks and why we there was a matter/anti-matter imbalance.


http://totem-experiment.web.cern.ch/totem-experiment/ Proton/Proton scattering, and information on the structure of Protons.


http://public.web.cern.ch/public/en/LHC/LHCf-en.html Cosmic ray studies.