Arizona moves to allow concealed guns in bars

[Araelus]

Wait. This just occurred to me. If the penalty is upon the individual should he be caught drinking while carrying, then it isn't the bar's responsibility to ensure compliance. I dunno. Have to think on it more.

That's the strong point I thought you were alluding to earlier - if someone carrying a concealed weapon is drinking, since they've now compromised their mental state (in addition to breaking the law), they're no longer legally able to defend themselves. So why would they choose to drink & carry?

Especially in the many places where it is illegal to posses any firearm, in any state of carry, at any non-zero BAC.

How was it enforceable before, when CC was disallowed in bars period? How does the enforceability change one iota?

You're right - these kinds of laws rely on those who have a CHL to obey the law on their own. Unless a law enforcement officer stops by for some other reason (in which case the CHL must disclose the presence of a weapon to the LEO). Thankfully CHL are extremely law-abiding (according to the U.S. Dept. of Justice).

[Suited Aces]

Pennsylvania has no law against carrying in any place that serves alcohol, 100% perfectly legal. Don't worry Arizona won't turn into the old west. Just more sensationalistic bullshit.

[Melchiah]

How was it enforceable before, when CC was disallowed in bars period? How does the enforceability change one iota?

Let me clarify: It isn't enforceable while maintaining the concealed nature of concealed carry.

Which defeats the purpose of making concealed carry legal in the bar in the first place... basically it's just meaningless legislation.

[Rhinox]

Yeah, it would be almost as retarded as thinking that having the choice on rather or not you want guns in your bar is a good thing means you're a hypocrite if you don't want them in yours personally.


such a fail existence


also, your response is truly epic considering how on the last page you tried to run away when you realized you were completely wrong by pretending you're the nice guy and talking about how you're being respectful because he didn't come "barging in with insults"

Hey asshole, I stopped responding only to nibe not because I think he is right but because I wasn't getting through to him. You see If I Feel the argument isn't going anywhere I just stop responding. I don't Plow threads up and change arguments mid thread or argue semantics and claim victory on strawmans like you do in just about every fucking thread.

Nice trolling though it actually got me to respond.

[Zalius]

fucking idiots

[Beckwin]

The Daily Item, Sunbury, PA - DA seeks death in bar shooting of 2

no info as to whether the guy had a permit or not, but still shows that stupid barfights can escalate if the option of a firearm is present.

and this is just the first google result for "Pennsylvania bar shooting"

...and here's another:

http://www.wjactv.com/news/19087933/detail.html

...and we dont' stop...

http://cbs3.com/wireapnewspa/Police....2.1053470.html

[Suited Aces]

PA bar shootings

lol yes please don't stop. While you're at it, try googling "Florida Bar Shooting" and "Arizona Bar Shooting", or any other state you wish. Results may surprise you.

Now if you could show that PA has a disproportionate amount of bar shootings... then maybe you would have a point.

[archibaldcrane]

no info as to whether the guy had a permit or not, but still shows that stupid barfights can escalate if the illegal irresponsible firearm owners are present.

ftfy

Fortunately, people with concealed weapons permits have been shown to be exceptionally responsible gun owners. Failure to acknowledge that renders pretty much everything else moot.

[Beckwin]

do we know that they're responsible drunk gun owners?

it's good that they're currently responsible and leave their guns at home when they go to a bar. let's leave it that way.

[archibaldcrane]

do we know that they're responsible drunk gun owners?

The law doesn't allow you to carry while you're drunk.

...

[Beckwin]

And people go to bars to not drink.

The point is that it's unenforceable either way; you're only encouraging mistakes by saying "well you can do it as long as you don't drink alcohol at this alcohol drinking establishment".

This is like saying yeah you can bring your penis to a strip club, but you're not allowed to get an erection. or something to that effect.

[Plow]

Hey asshole, I stopped responding only to nibe not because I think he is right but because I wasn't getting through to him. You see If I Feel the argument isn't going anywhere I just stop responding. I don't Plow threads up and change arguments mid thread or argue semantics and claim victory on strawmans like you do in just about every fucking thread.

Nice trolling though it actually got me to respond.

I'm the one that tries to change arguments and fling insults etc. Right. Brilliant posting right there.

I'm also the one trolling and throwing out straw men that have nothing whatsoever to do with the discussion.


If you want to discuss the law, and your interpretation of hypocrisy go right ahead, if you want to fling insults, try ad hominem, etc., you might want to consider not being so massively hypocritical about it when the discussion was about hypocrisy in the first place.


The fact of the matter is, believing one should have a yes or no choice, and choosing no personally, is absolutely not hypocritical in any way, shape, or form.