What's Better?

[Thunder]

Don't have one side aware of the parse without the other side aware as well.

How else am I going to outparse relics

DRG has 52 acc, 39 atk, and a wyv where as sam has +19% ws dmg, a 5hit, 10% DA, and berserk. And hell if I'm about to try and compare gearsets. I doubt there's ever going to be a real definitive answer and you'll be fine meriting on whichever of the two jobs you have.

[Yugl]

I didn't say people shouldn't do their best damage. I said they simply don't always do their best damage. Plus, I'm willing to take more risks and strain the healer (Unless that's me) when I know I'm in a parse for damage. These risks may be in favor of damage, but detrimental to XP.

Edit: If Thunder's description is accurate, it favors SAM.

[Cream Soda]

How else am I going to outparse relics

DRG has 52 acc, 39 atk, and a wyv where as sam has +19% ws dmg, a 5hit, 10% DA, and berserk. And hell if I'm about to try and compare gearsets. I doubt there's ever going to be a real definitive answer and you'll be fine meriting on whichever of the two jobs you have.

While drg has 52 more acc, I find my sam build mathing my drg's build in terms of acc on birds, or close enough not to be a difference anyway. (seeing as i average 93% on birds, can't see drg getting much higher)

[Thunder]

I agree from just eyeballing what the two jobs come into play with that Sam should win, but I don't agree with anybody really taking an interest to care. What's somebody going to do, math out a gungnir drg vs an amano sam? Both in perfect gear? Who has a gungnir and amano and has to worry about that kind of decision. Unless it's something black and white like:

Hi, I have this gear on drg and this gear on sam. What will win?

This question's just going to turn into, "well I'm sam and I beat this drg" "but that drg sucked!!!!" etc etc.

Again, unless I'm missing something important the difference between the two jobs should be pretty minimal on birds.

[Yugl]

The best question would be: What's the significance of finding the answer to this question? Do you want to know whether to come DRG or SAM to merit PTs? Post your gear for both and see. Do you want to simply know from a hypothetical point of view?

[Scary]

Hypothetically speaking of course, and also wanting to know if there's any area where DRG can beat SAM in terms of DD.

[Wolfknight]

lol mediocre? Liger is far from mediocre.

Would probably be best if you actually knew what you were talking about before you went and started typing.

He was above average but he made some very poor mistakes on gear they overloaded on quite few stats. They were missing 4% haste[didn't use blitz/turban/V. belt would still be capped acc w/Aurum body], and they over dex'd[past 117] and still gave up gorget for love when the dDex cap is stupid sorry, and there were few other improvements like sword strap since had V fork.

[liggy 0]

Shouldn't have to have someone tell you they're monitoring your damage for you to decide to play your best. Should be putting out your A game every time.

thanks for the love, but tbh i only put out B quality play style (in merit pts atleast, who wants to go 3hrs straight busting balls when you got to scan for SW in afew =< ) unless i know there's parse.

pretty much all of what yugl said.

ive been parsed before by others and ive had better results.

i dont see how not having certain gear available to achieve some form of perfection it to be called stupid. im aware of my incomplete gear set.

i would think im at least above mediocre. :3

[Knyghtmayre]

DRG has 52 acc, 39 atk, vfork, 6-hit, a wyvern, 60/72tp meds, high/jump, and drakesbane the most ridiculous fucking weaponskill in the fucking world where as sam has tomoe, +19% ws dmg, a 5hit, 10% DA, 140-160tp meds, sekkanoki, and berserk.

if you want to be technical and all...

so you're looking at

DRG:
Accuracy +52*
Attack +39*
DMG +9 on Weapon
Wyvern
Jump & High Jump
Drakesbane

SAM:
Weaponskill damage +19%
Double attack +7%
Twice as potent Meditates, 17% more often
1 less hit per 100TP (17% more efficient?)
Sekkanoki
Berserk
Riceball builds!**

*I don't really know where you got attack/accuracy differentiation. I assume:

DRG Polearm 276
SAM Polearm 240
Skill gap: 36

36*.9=Accuracy+32(.4) Attack+36

DRG Traits
Accuracy Bonus II: Accuracy+22

Totaling:
Accuracy+54 Attack+36 before DEX and STR differences, though I can't be certain what those are, I only know that SAM has more DEX and DRG has more STR. I imagine it is only a couple both ways, so STR+2 for DRG and DEX+2 for SAM. That would leave it at around Accuracy +52 Attack+38.

**Don't really know if the ability to have a riceball build on SAM is worth mentioning or not, but it's significant to me.

[mdkuser]

Better Damage output between SAM/war vs. DRG/sam on Bird camp. Assuming sam is using polearm of course and that both jobs are pimped out ie, ace's, hauby+1, usu boots for sam, and drg with ace's, aurum body, full homam, etc........... Usually best possible gears without relic weapon. Met a sam who claimed that his sam/war has never been outparsed by any drgs on bird camp. I find that hard to believe, although I haven't had an opportunity to go head to head with him until I get my drg up to 75. There's gotta be a drg out there who's pimped enough to make that claim that no sam/war will ever outparsed him on bird camp. Any drgs confident enough to make that claim, or is it really not possible? Please let me believe..........

Here's my future drg gear: I would be devastated if a sam/war beats me on parser at bird camp:

Thalassocrat/Pole grip or D: 94 based weapon
Ace's
Love Torque
Aurum Body
Pixie/Brutal
Homam hands/legs/feet
Rajas/Ulthalam/Thunder
Cuchulain's
V. Belt

WS:

Heca set
Aurum Body

I'm pretty confident this combination can beat out many pimped out sam/wars. Thoughts?

I think any DD can beat this drg. ace's helm and cuchulain's mantle, really? why do a shitty dex build? you'r a DRG you'r not gonna break 100 dex..

A polearm sam with merits caps accuracy with a mix match set and turban, and he needs usukane body or he isn't pimped out.

I only found one decent drg in my parse, he had homam feet leg hands, askar body, ares's cuirass ( ace's and askar head...too) So on paper he looks decent at least but the parse said other wise. I was /nin and he was /sam and we did the same dmg. I dont have polearm merits. He had a problem with his WS set though because his average penta was inferior to mine.

I'd say if the sam has full polearm merit, then he should beat a drg, provided he has full usukane for true 5-hit ( or at least body feet).

[FailureMidgard]

Had this debate a bit back, can check it out :

http://www.bluegartr.com/forum/77889...-set-up-6.html

The biggest thing here btw is the fact that a sam WSes ~41% more often than a dragoon.

They both have capped accuracy (if you're gonna bring traits into this shit, also account for other gear differences such as byakko's vs homam, usu vs homam, usu vs aurum, etc.

The dragoon has more attack (my math in the other thread said ~85), a wyvern, and drakesbane.
The sam has +41% WSes, +19% WS dmg, berserk, higher crit rate.

Oh ya, a sam should always win.

[FailureMidgard]

Whether you know you're being parsed or not, should always play as if you were being parsed (though everyone in this pt knew parse was being run). Shouldn't have to have someone tell you they're monitoring your damage for you to decide to play your best. Should be putting out your A game every time.

While everyone should do that, I highly doubt everyone does...I will if it's a top party, but whenever I'm in a mediocre party, I just watch TV and don't care...Not sure how else to stay sane grinding out hundreds of merits (~600 so far?)

[Cream Soda]

While everyone should do that, I highly doubt everyone does...I will if it's a top party, but whenever I'm in a mediocre party, I just watch TV and don't care...Not sure how else to stay sane grinding out hundreds of merits (~600 so far?)

Well I'll admit, I do the same thing at times, but when I step into a pt and am destroying everything at 40+% of the dmg in a 3 dd pt, then they're obviously not at the point where they can do that. If I'm up against people I know are going to be a challenge, then parse or not then I go for it.

[Argettio]

Oh ya, a sam should always win.

I know this isn't related to the 'perfect sam vs perfect drg' questions.

SAM winning relies on 5hit and getting over 90% acc; to do that you requires exceptional gear.

So I think as you move away from the pinnacle of gear excellence the SAMs accuracy will drop quite fast (askar body instead of Usu body) or drop their 5hit build, giving DRG the edge.

If you have your Usu gear etc then Polearm SAM is unstoppable, but that's about 0.5% of all SAMs (yes most of that 0.5% are on here, but that's not the point)

Verses the other 99.5% of SAMs a suitably geared DRG should be ahead.

[Starr]

I usually go for about 45mins before I get sloppy and start browsing internet in merit parties.

[mdkuser]

While everyone should do that, I highly doubt everyone does...I will if it's a top party, but whenever I'm in a mediocre party, I just watch TV and don't care...Not sure how else to stay sane grinding out hundreds of merits (~600 so far?)

in a mediocre pt I unlock the KS30 polearm.

[Thunder]

*I don't really know where you got attack/accuracy differentiation. I assume:

DRG Polearm 276
SAM Polearm 240
Skill gap: 36

36*.9=Accuracy+32(.4) Attack+36

DRG Traits
Accuracy Bonus II: Accuracy+22

I did the two numbers in my head from the skill totals in wiki and I typed them out wrong some kind of mixmatch >.> thanks for the correction would be easier if you could just ffxigear it...

[ronin sparthos]

What's Better?

Fay Gendawa
DMG:72
STR+3 WSACC+10 WSDMG+3%

vs

Cobra Unit Bow
DMG: 77 RACC+5

vs

Vali's Bow
DMG: 71 Delay: 490 STR +3 AGI +3
Ranged Accuracy +2 Ranged Attack +23

[Neosutra]

Vali's. Especially due to weapon delay differences.

[ringthree]

What's Better?

Fay Gendawa
DMG:72
STR+3 WSACC+10 WSDMG+3%

vs

Cobra Unit Bow
DMG: 77 RACC+5

vs

Vali's Bow
DMG: 71 Delay: 490 STR +3 AGI +3
Ranged Accuracy +2 Ranged Attack +23

I tested out a Fay with better stats (+4 STR, +4% WS DMG) against E. Bow with just a couple of mobs and the E. Bow was still better.