King's Justice vs Raging Rush

[Khajit]

Why do people use DEX on RR at all? Has DEX been proven to significantly increase the critical hit rate of RR? I must have missed the trend, but I have never seen first hand with DEX increasing the damage of WS that have a natural critical hit rate. This goes all the way back to people using DEX for Rampage and it sucking compared to a Rampage outfitted with STR.

Where has it been proven that DEX will significantly increase the critical hit rate of a WS with innate critical ability?

Dex also adds acc and thanks to the 2h update it adds quite a bit more acc than it would for a dual wielder. hence dex gear on rampage tends to be stupid.

[hagun]

Edit: And to Hagun, how critical rate work is that the last few dex you add will significantly up your critical rate. At about 120 dex, every dex you add are likely going to add 1% to your critical hit rate until you cap (against bird only). That's why you either try to reach that point or you don't focus on it at all. Against higher lvl mobs, it is not practical to focus on dex due to the much higher AGI, making the higher str mode WS win out on damage.

Does this also factor into your WS critical hit rate? IIRC, the only thing that influences a WS's critical hit rate is TP. Also, TP has very little increase in critical hit rate as shown by martial bhuj. So it really boggles my mind why people would use DEX on a WS hoping for a slight chance that it'll critical 'more' instead of sticking with STR, which will give consistent and favorable results.

If you outfit a KJ with STR, it's going to give a ton more consistency and better numbers than an RR stuffed with DEX and lacking STR.

[Nameless]

I don't know if it has been tested or not, but they are assuming WS with chance to critical is effected by dex just like your regular hits. And that at 100% RR is 10% crit + your base crit + merit + gear + crit from dex - agi. From that point on, every 1 tp add 0.2% crit I believe. Wouldn't be too hard to test tho, so I am sure it is somewhere (hit lvl 1 mob with the WS, should be dead in 1 hit, and should be at critical cap, so it shouldnt be hard to seperate the critical and non critical and you can go from there to see if the % is 10 or 35.)

[Sifer]

Therin posted a link to some testing on the 1st or 2nd page but it wasnt specific to raging rush. There is a massive lack of parses in this thread so it isn't going anywhere. We all know that crit hit rate is lower on higher level mobs and that crit rate adds more damage on higher lv (and def) mobs. It's easy to make statement like that but only a parse would prove which WS and gear setup wins.

[Tubbers]

Does this also factor into your WS critical hit rate? IIRC, the only thing that influences a WS's critical hit rate is TP. Also, TP has very little increase in critical hit rate as shown by martial bhuj. So it really boggles my mind why people would use DEX on a WS hoping for a slight chance that it'll critical 'more' instead of sticking with STR, which will give consistent and favorable results.

If you outfit a KJ with STR, it's going to give a ton more consistency and better numbers than an RR stuffed with DEX and lacking STR.

I'm at work and don't have time to look it up (maybe I will when I get home), but the short answer is yes. Someone, I believe it was Nagamasaki or Searain, showed that crit WS follow this general outline

100% TP: Natural Crit Rate (NCR) + X
200% TP: NCR + X + Y
300% TP: NCR + X + Y + Z

Where 0 <= X <= 10; 0 <= Y <= 20; 0 <= Z <= 30

For some crit based WS, I believe it was Rampage, 100% X had a value of 0. I am fairly certain this was shown testing on level 1 rabbits in Ronfaure, showing the WS to have a 24% Crit chance with someone who had 4 crit merits, and 20% crit chance with someone who did not have any crit merits.

Also, @Fridell, yes it was at birds.

[Max™]

FFXIGEAR.com

Using that gearset I was told on several occasions that I was parsing 1000~1100 RR average at lolibri, and lolsouthcamp at MJSP. Cuch didn't exist (not that I had the gil) and augmenting hadn't been added yet.


I've since changed gear around, leveling new jobs and shit, berk +1 went bye bye to afford better Ninja toys, swapped Hollow to Ethereal earring, etc.


I KJ in this right now, Kheten is Dmg +5 Str +4 Vit +3, Coeurl gorget is Acc +8 Racc +6 Subtle Blow +1.
FFXIGEAR.com

My RR set is the same except I leave hauberk on and swap the neck to Snow Gorget.
FFXIGEAR.com

Much less complex macros than my full on dual set layout, only 5 swaps + WS line, since I rarely do much on War aside from random murder for fun, I just focused on getting the best bang for the buck from those five slots.

The same basic rules apply, and I still notice that certain mobs which I've come to identify in my head as "squishy", eat RR's up like nobodies business. Mostly things with low Agi so I'm pushing high dDex with just 110~.

I still notice that some areas, certain limbus floors, certain campaign mobs, certain dyna zones, I can't seem to crit RR to save my life, and the KJ set mops up beautifully.

When zerk is up, KJ tends to give nice beefy returns, and RR is stable enough to fall back on when unbuffed in most cases.

If you're only ever using one for everything, you're probably doing something wrong, my gearsets are far from ideal these days, but I still can't imagine just defaulting to one fulltime over the other when I know it would shine.

[Corrderio]

I know this is going to be a dumb question however since KJ's mod is STR only has anyone tried using Pallas/Alky bracelets? Assuming you can make up for the DEX penalty?

[Max™]

-7 Acc, meh.

FFXIGEAR.com

Assume these augments:

Kheten Dmg 91 +6 Str +5 Double Attack +2%
Galea Str +4 WS Acc +15 Acc +10 Att +5

336 Base Acc, +14 from 8 Gaxe merits, +25 from head, +10 from Gorget.
=
385 Acc in WS gear, 410 with Aggressor, 420 with Hasso
450~ Att roughly before food/zerk/buffs

138 Str +5 Merits, 4 Galea, 5 Kheten, 10 Hasso/Food for 162 total Str

Nonetheless, FFXIGEAR.com would drop 3 Str but gain 8~9 Acc, and would be hard to beat all around.

[Limlight]

Max a little input if you have time (i'm not a huge math guy but I do fiddle with ffxigear)

my current KJ set up, I've been waffling on using ares body vs haub+1 Thoughts?

http://ffxigear.com/?ref=17795#

Again I parse everything and my food is generally pizza+1. Ares body has really parsed nicely in t3 ein, dynamis, limbus, zerg fights etc (basically I use KJ for everything but birds)

4 da 3 bergressor

8/8 gaxe

Usual buffs are brd + cor double march / chaos, sam or fighters when i get chaos roll KJ has just been going crazy for me. Should I really bother with getting friggin zahak's mail, claymore strap and all that crap for a pure RR build?

btw my current RR build (I usually only use this at birds and it consistently beats KJ)

FFXIGEAR.com

[Max™]

Nah, your RR "hybrid" is plenty functional. Zahak's and shit are if you just got the gil and nothing else to upgrade, or for some reason you really enjoy meriting.

I wouldn't do the Haub +1 > Ares swap without Pizza or a 25 WS Acc Galea.

Nhead + Haub +1
17 Str, 11 Dex, 12 Acc (20~ counting Dex), 12 Att

Galea + Ares
16 Str, 25 Acc, 29 Att

-1 Str, +5 Acc, +16~ Att is an interesting trade, should do better for KJ.

Nhead + Ares
23 Str 5 Dex 24 Att

+6~7 Str for -20+ Acc, and you still don't win on Att? Nothx for a multihit.

[Starr]

btw my current RR build (I usually only use this at birds and it consistently beats KJ)

FFXIGEAR.com

Hi, if you only use this on GC it is 3 DEX above the 117 you need to cap dDEX, change the Pixie Earring for Triumph.

[Limlight]

thx max

basically what i was thinking

[Starr]

or for some reason you really enjoy meriting.

still clueless jeez.

[Max™]

Define irony.

[Starr]

Bitch please, as if this thread hasn't played into my hands. Keep sucking at WAR.

[Max™]

You're cute, if you weren't a limey brit I'd have to adopt you so I could lock you in a closet in the basement, only opening the door occasionally when I needed to take a piss.

As it stands, I wouldn't want to get that close to you, for fear of catching some obscure tooth disease.

[Starr]

It's cute that it kills you to know that you'll never be as good as me at WAR.

[Max™]

I'm a taru melee, honey, as are you... we're the bottom of the barrel.

If it really gets you off to think you're the top of the bottom of the barrel, good for you man, I've been there, done that, hit it for a couple thousand points of damage and moved on.

[Seraphus]

I'm a taru melee, honey, as are you... we're the bottom of the barrel.

If it really gets you off to think you're the top of the bottom of the barrel, good for you man, I've been there, done that, hit it for a couple thousand points of damage and moved on.

/thread

[Yugl]

/thread

This entirely.

Edit: The fact that Starr asks for a thread and demands math people; yet, attacks the math people when they disagree with him (And worst of all, using the LOLYOUAINTASGOODGEARASME response) only goes to show that this is a FIGHT ME NOW thread.