They Snooze Less, But They Don't Lose

[Antithesis]

Genetic mutation could explain why some of us function fine on six hours a night.

THURSDAY, Aug. 13 (HealthDay News) -- A lucky few can get by just fine on six hours of sleep, and a new study suggests a genetic mutation might help explain why.

The finding doesn't appear likely to help people with insomnia. Still, it "opens a door" to greater understanding of why people sleep as long as they do, said study co-author Ying-Hui Fu, a professor of neurology at the University of California at San Francisco.

Armed with this research, scientists may be able to eventually develop safe ways to tinker with people's bodies so that they can sleep less, she said. "At the same time, we'll feel fine."

According to Fu, about 5 percent of people get by on six hours or less of sleep a night without any ill effects. "They're perfectly fine, and they don't have a problem," she said. "For them, six hours is like eight hours for me."

For most people, however, eight or 8.5 hours of sleep are best, she said.

"We spend one-third of our life in a state of sleep, and we know that sleep is required. If you deprive any mortal organism of sleep, it will die," Fu said. "But we don't know what is regulating how much we need. That's the bottom line about why this study is exciting."

Fu and her colleagues examined the DNA of a mother and daughter who each get by on about six hours of sleep and compared it to that of other family members. They report their findings in the Aug. 13 online issue of Science.

The researchers found that the women shared a genetic mutation but other members of their family did not. Further research found that mice with the mutation slept less and recovered more quickly after being deprived of sleep.

It's not clear, however, how the mutation actually affects sleep patterns.

Future research could provide more insight into how the mutation works, and Fu said her dream is to find a way to create a drug that would allow people to sleep less.

This could have benefits beyond more wakefulness. Studies have shown that people who sleep an average amount of 30 to 60 minutes below average live the longest, said Dr. Daniel F. Kripke, emeritus professor of psychiatry at the University of California at San Diego.

But genetics are only part of the picture, he said.

"Sleep amounts seem to be determined as much as 50 percent by genetics, and the rest by habits, social and work situations, recreation -- exercise, the Internet and late-night TV -- and environmental factors such as noise and light," he said.

As for the new study, Kripke cautioned that even if the genetic mutation does affect sleep, it's not clear if that helps people who have it. "We do not know if the amount that the people with the variation are sleeping is good or bad for them," he said. "We do not know if the gene effect should be called 'sleep deprivation' or 'enhanced energy.'"

The National Sleep Foundation has more about sleeping smart.

http://health.msn.com/health-topics/...3381&GT1=31036

I guess I fall into this category.

[Darus Grey]

Misleading...study seems like it's assuming 8~ hours is normal or required, so entire basis of the research is flawed from the start. It's taking an assumption as a fact to prove something else.

A person can survive fine with no ill effects getting just 1.5 hours of sleep twice a day. There isn't some magical sleep number you must get every-day, your body simply must experience a single REM phase every so often. Demonstrated by people who haven't slept in 20-30+ years and survive with no ill effects on Microsleep(they've trained themselves to enter instant REM, like a controlled form of Narcolepsy).

[Niiro]

Seems like a massive amount of assumptions and anecdotal statistics.

edit:

Misleading...study seems like it's assuming 8~ hours is normal or required, so entire basis of the research is flawed from the start. It's taking an assumption as a fact to prove something else.

Like that.

[Kilhart]

If a scientist said it then it must be true.

Always.

[Jaraude]

"We do not know if the amount that the people with the variation are sleeping is good or bad for them,"

For myself, most nights I get 7 hours of sleep though 6 is good enough too. The biggest factor that effects restfulness for me is not so much the duration of sleep but rather what time I have to wake up. On weekdays I have to get up at 5 AM and everyday is a struggle regardless of whether I got 6, 7, or 8 hours of sleep. I am just not a morning person at all and getting up at that time is not natural for me and so I must use an alarm. Now, on the weekend I am able to wake up on my own between 7 and 8 AM and feel WAY better than I do on the days that I have to wake up at 5 AM (even if I got the same amount of sleep as on the weeknight).

[Atreides]

it's called methamphetamines

[The Stig]

6 is fine for me. If I get bored at work though I'll top it up with a small (250ml) can of energy drink (red bull etc) because I will feel uncomfortable/heavy eyed.

[Blabj]

it's called methamphetamines

I lol'd.

I'm definately in the 8.5-10 hours category, though it does feel good sometimes to get 6-7 and then have a shower in the morning, I definately feel more awake for the rest of the day!

[Stiker]

While I am definitely a guy that loves my sleep, I can easily function on about 6 hours if I have to. I don't know if it is so much genetic mutation as it is just getting on a routine and habit.

[Blarg]

A person can survive fine with no ill effects getting just 1.5 hours of sleep twice a day. There isn't some magical sleep number you must get every-day, your body simply must experience a single REM phase every so often. Demonstrated by people who haven't slept in 20-30+ years and survive with no ill effects on Microsleep(they've trained themselves to enter instant REM, like a controlled form of Narcolepsy).

Links to these people who haven't slept for so long. It reminds me of these people who claimed they didn't need sleep if they had sunlight and when observed for how long they claimed they could go they failed.

I also think this study is concerning the average person with average time to enter REM sleep. If you want to test pain tolerance you don't throw out the study because there are outliers of buddhist monks who take kicks to the balls for fun after they meditate for a few minutes. 8 hours would encompass the average time for the body to undergo what it needs to be rested, I don't think they are saying that 8 hours no matter the circumstances of your sleep is all that is needed.

[Tyche]

I read a study a while ago that talked about the sleep of Fortune 500 CEO's. They average something like 4 hours of sleep a night. I'm right at 6. 11:45-5:45.

[Khamsin]

I get about 4 hours per night, but I play catch up on weekends. And I'm not a Fortune 500 CEO, either.

Something seems off about the title, by the way.

As the saying goes, "you snooze, you lose."

So... you snooze less, but you don't lose. Lose what... less? More?

"You snooze less, you lose less" would be more expected. Saying "snooze less, but you don't lose" seems counter-intuitive, because if snoozing makes you lose, snoozing less would be obviously be plainly better, there'd be no need for clarification that you don't lose, and saying "but" in there implies snoozing less would have otherwise made you lose more. Because it's easy to see that by snoozing less, you'd lose less. If indeed snoozing makes you lose. Or "snooze more, but you don't lose" would be fine, although not what the study was getting at.

On the other hand, if snoozing at all for any length of time made you lose, then "snooze less, and you don't lose" would be better.

[Darus Grey]

Links to these people who haven't slept for so long. It reminds me of these people who claimed they didn't need sleep if they had sunlight and when observed for how long they claimed they could go they failed.

I also think this study is concerning the average person with average time to enter REM sleep. If you want to test pain tolerance you don't throw out the study because there are outliers of buddhist monks who take kicks to the balls for fun after they meditate for a few minutes. 8 hours would encompass the average time for the body to undergo what it needs to be rested, I don't think they are saying that 8 hours no matter the circumstances of your sleep is all that is needed.

Read better, it's not that they're not sleeping, they in-fact are. It's that they developed a skill that allows them controlled narcolepsy like symptoms where they can instantly pass into REM and wake up.

They actually sleep a couple hours a day, just only a few seconds at a time. You're confusing the act of sleeping with the act of laying in a bed. Humans can sleep standing up like any animal can.

[Blarg]

A person can survive fine with no ill effects getting just 1.5 hours of sleep twice a day. There isn't some magical sleep number you must get every-day, your body simply must experience a single REM phase every so often. Demonstrated by people who haven't slept in 20-30+ years and survive with no ill effects on Microsleep(they've trained themselves to enter instant REM, like a controlled form of Narcolepsy).

Read better, it's not that they're not sleeping,

Links to these people who haven't slept for so long

You said they haven't slept in so long and I asked for the link where the people haven't slept in so long. Did I ask for the link where people didn't lay in a bed and sleep for 20-30 years? Maybe you didn't read correctly since I used the word sleep the same way you did. Perhaps if you didn't get enough sleep last night and misunderstood.

[Darus Grey]

LOL YOU GOT ME GOOD.

edit: REAL GOOD LOLOL

Will you be happy if I put "slept" in quotes? I didn't think I needed to considering I expounded and clarified within the same sentence.

[Blarg]

Seriously? I used sleep the same way you did and then you jumped all over it. I phrased the asking for links that way because it was how you said it so it would be easy to understand what I was asking for. If you thought I understood it as these people made no effort to achieve a form of REM for the entire 20+ years then that is ludicrous since 'sleep' (added the quotes here for you so you understand what I mean, it can be hard sometimes) deprivation for longer than just 7 days can be lethal.

Once again I would like to see these studies/links to see just how long of a period they were observed for because I have heard of similar 'stay awake' stories before where things looked believable for the first few days but the person couldn't maintain their health when observation was done long term.

[Colenzo]

LOL YOU GOT ME GOOD.

edit: REAL GOOD LOLOL

Will you be happy if I put "slept" in quotes? I didn't think I needed to considering I expounded and clarified within the same sentence.

mad

[Darus Grey]

mad

People who are apparently too dumb to use a search engine themselves, and need someone to do it for them, do in-fact make me rage.

P.S. Link pls.

Edit: RRRRAAAAAAAAGGGGGGGGEEEEEEEEE

[archibaldcrane]

Darus, don't be a dick. Did these study authors need to start from ground zero with "how much sleep does the average human being need" or could they just take the generally accepted 8-8.5 hours and work from there?

The "every person is a beautiful and unique snowflake to which averages do not apply" bit is tired.

[Blarg]

People who are apparently too dumb to use a search engine themselves, and need someone to do it for them, do in-fact make me rage.

P.S. Link pls.

Edit: RRRRAAAAAAAAGGGGGGGGEEEEEEEEE

Something to go on, like the name of the study, what kid of people can do this micro sleeping would help because the searches I did before asking brought up one case of the 'world record' being a man who 'claimed he hasn't slept in 33 years after suffering a medical condition' with no statements on a study being done, just a claim. Most other results are just about how much sleep people need. Searching for micro sleep brought up instances of people going into this sleep due to being sleep deprived and it talked about the dangers of this micro sleep (driving and whatnot).

It's also not easy to search for longest time without sleeping while also stating that they in fact get micro sleep.