360 failure rate 54.2%

[Xno Kappa]

I didn't think it was possible after I spelled it out so clearly so let me put it in bold for you this time.

Nobody said the failure rate wasn't bad. You got upset over him calling the 360 the better product and went off on your own stupid tangent, nobody forced you to. You build strawmen like they are going out of style, bro. Jesus.

Are you just purposely ignoring your buddies "ode to games and their gaming experience" edit or something? I would've left his comments alone before that but he made it obvious he's discussing things that aren't necessary in a thread about failure rates in order to push his own beliefs about said system.

The ones upset here are you two flipping out about crap you your very self's brought up. Now calm down, take a deep breath, and relax.

[Brill Weave]

I will say this though. Despite the extremely high failure rates at least Microsoft has bitten the bullet and will repair RRoD free of charge and tosses in a month of free XBL Gold. The repair system is extremely fast as well. Once it's been received you get it back in 2-3 weeks. And we still love you Oct. My post wasn't exactly short either.

[Cyn]

I'm not a Xbox owner so I'm not entirely sure about this, but if you bought a 360 when it came out, grabbed a HDD and HD-DvD for it and started churning out XBL Gold payments, wouldn't you have spent significantly more than purchasing a 60gig PS3 at launch?

[Brill Weave]

I can only answer for myself personally Cyn. I can't claim others are in the same vein of thinking I am. When I got the 360 I picked up the Arcade version which came with no memory devices, games, and 1 controller. I picked up a memory card and two games with it at that point in time because it was all I wanted to spend. Picking up a 60gb PS3 would have cost me pretty close to the same amount and I would have been getting less. In the end I just couldn't justify spending over 400.00 for a system on it's own when I could get a system and two games of my choice for the same price.

[Shojin]

Here I thought it was the price and the vastly superior game library available. Had the PS3 and the 360 come out at the same time the same thing would still be happening. Look at exclusive titles for example. I like the PS3 and I enjoy the games I've played but there's only a handful that are OMG IT'S FINALLY HERE!!! worthy that are exclusive to the PS3.

When it comes to PS3 vs 360 I can't help but draw comparisons to the Dreamcast vs Playstation. The Dreamcast was the much more powerful system. It was a technically superior system and it released early. It didn't have the library the Playstation was able to roll out with it. Look what happened there, it died and nearly ended Sega. It also came out I think six months before the PS2. The PS3 is a better system, but it doesn't have the support the 360 does. It doesn't have the library.

It's a great system but to say that the sales positions would be different if the release dates were the same is just silly. Most people who buy these games are younger college aged kids. They are going to buy the cheaper system especially if it has more games and more perks. Not hating on the PS3, I enjoy it. But I think that the PS3 could have come out three months before hand and still be losing to the 360, RRoD and all.

In the end Microsoft made a fairly comparable cheaper priced system that has a larger game library and more DLC support than the PS3. It is the better product because it caters to it's demographic's resources and requests. How many developers refuse to release DLC on the PS3 due to the issues they have with the PSN? Look at how long it took PS3 users to get the Fallout 3 content.

While I don't agree with the exclusive part of this (Both have good exclusives Warhawk, KZ2, LBP, MGS4, Valk Chronicles, Gran Turismo etc vs. GOW2, Halo3, Forza, Fable 2 etc.) I agree that MS has a better execution of service through XBL, Cross game chat, party system, cross game invites etc. Although I disagree with the having to pay a fee to play multiplayer online for console gaming.

As for how well the consoles themselves they are doing, I think MS releasing earlier did impact sales slightly, but nothing major, however for software sales I think people tend to buy games for their default system (If you own an Xbox 360 first, and you get all multi-plat games for it, etc, then later on you buy a PS3 for the exclusives, when multi-plat games are released in the future, people tend to stick to their default console, in this case the Xbox 360) Sales figures from a few months back worldwide, Xbox stood at around 31 mil consoles sold, PS3 at about 25mil, with the Xbox 360 having a year head start in sales. To be honest I think both consoles are doing fairly well, obviously no where near the Wii's over 50 mil sold, but still very decent. Will be interesting to see how PS3 slim and the price drop impacts the figures.

I don't get the part you said about issues with PSN though? From what I have read the MS verification process is a lot more grueling than Sony's, and has more restrictions (like the size limit) However some developers have said how they refuse to learn how to use the PS3's architecture, most notable Gabe Newell from Valve. But he himself has said recently that the PS3 has become too big to ignore, and Valve are now actively hiring PS3 developers.

[Octavious]

I don't get the part you said about issues with PSN though? From what I have read the MS verification process is a lot more grueling than Sony's, and has more restrictions (like the size limit) However some developers have said how they refuse to learn how to use the PS3's architecture, most notable Gabe Newell from Valve. But he himself has said recently that the PS3 has become too big to ignore, and Valve are now actively hiring PS3 developers.

I love the PSN, lol, and I've said it before but mainly because of how I can purchase items. When I want to buy a map pack thats $9.99, I pay 9.99 with my credit card. Not 1000 MS points which would leave me w/200 since the pack was 800, or any of that bullshit. Also, the PSN syncs up with my PlayStation Underground (which is now just the PSN Forums) account. My XBL experience hasn't been too bad, but updating CC info and renewing Live is kind of wierd occasionally. My main gripe is simply their online purchases. >_>; I hate the fact that I have 300 MS points left over and most map packs run 800-1000. I just want to pay for what I want and not that extra crap. :-(

[Zosi]

Are you just purposely ignoring your buddies "ode to games and their gaming experience" edit or something? I would've left his comments alone before that but he made it obvious he's discussing things that aren't necessary in a thread about failure rates in order to push his own beliefs about said system.

The ones upset here are you two flipping out about crap you your very self's brought up. Now calm down, take a deep breath, and relax.

First, you don't decide what's "necessary" in a thread, thankfully. If you want to be the dictator of thread topics, start your own forum. Second, I wasn't pushing my own beliefs about said system. I said that I thought that Microsoft delivered a better product this generation, and that's not really an unreasonable belief - you may disagree, and that's perfectly fine. If I thought that Sony had delivered a better product when I was shopping for consoles, I probably would've bought a PS3 instead. Now that they have dropped the price, I probably will. It's just an opinion on which is worth purchasing, not some kind of personal attack or repudiation of your closely-held beliefs. Third, you're the only one raging here. Your posts are full of anger over something that's completely trivial - if you really got that worked up, you could use the deep breaths a lot more than me.

[Jaybar]

First, you don't decide what's "necessary" in a thread, thankfully. If you want to be the dictator of thread topics, start your own forum. Second, I wasn't pushing my own beliefs about said system. I said that I thought that Microsoft delivered a better product this generation, and that's not really an unreasonable belief - you may disagree, and that's perfectly fine. If I thought that Sony had delivered a better product when I was shopping for consoles, I probably would've bought a PS3 instead. Now that they have dropped the price, I probably will. It's just an opinion on which is worth purchasing, not some kind of personal attack or repudiation of your closely-held beliefs.

1. You're right, that's called de-railing.

2. I think you are misinterpreting the word "good product". The way the 360 has scoped out, I'd consider the Ford Explorer from the late 90's a good product in your definition (good sales, terrible hardware). If you have no idea how that analogy worked, google "Ford Explorer" and "Recalls".

[Brill Weave]

I meant with later releases in comparison to other systems Shojin. I like the PS3 and I like their exclusive games. I would love to have a PS3 but I there's just no way I am going to plunk down that much money for Valkyria Chronicles and a few others. If it goes down in price further I would probably seriously consider it just on the off chance that they port Yakuza 3 over and it was PS3 exclusive.

[Diamicles]

The 360 was worth the $300 I paid for it (even after I got RRoD and MS replaced it w/ a new system). So was the PS2 when I purchased that system, and it died eventually too, due to a hardware defect. Now that the PS3 is going to be $300, I'll purchase it as well, and it will be worth the cost also, and still will be even if there comes to be a defect in the hardware...

[Zosi]

1. You're right, that's called de-railing.

The derail occurred when a certain dumbass read my post and took something that was clearly offered as an opinion as some kind of vicious personal attack on his favorite console.

2. I think you are misinterpreting the word "good product". The way the 360 has scoped out, I'd consider the Ford Explorer from the late 90's a good product in your definition (good sales, terrible hardware). If you have no idea how that analogy worked, google "Ford Explorer" and "Recalls".

I don't think that that analogy quite works like you think it does. In both cases, the models that have problems are quite obviously not good products - but in each case, there are future models that do NOT have the same problems, and the brand as a whole isn't destroyed by a model with problems. They still make brand new Explorers, are you seriously trying to claim that they can't be a "good product" because a previous model had problems? Maybe you should tell Ford.

[Shojin]

I meant with later releases in comparison to other systems Shojin. I like the PS3 and I like their exclusive games. I would love to have a PS3 but I there's just no way I am going to plunk down that much money for Valkyria Chronicles and a few others. If it goes down in price further I would probably seriously consider it just on the off chance that they port Yakuza 3 over and it was PS3 exclusive.

Most DLC for multi-plat games usually hit both consoles around the same time, just PSN always updates their store on Thursday, and I think MS updates whenever they want? But I think I know what you mean, you mean with like Fallout 3? Yeah, I agree there, but to be fair it wasn't even planned to be released for PS3, they only just changed their minds recently and have been working to get it out. I doubt the DLC for Oblivion will come to PS3 though (other than Shivering Isles, which we already got).

Then there is the underhanded bullshit tactics that both companies pull with exclusive DLC. Like MS paying $50mil for exclusive GTA4 DLC, or PS3 getting playable Joker exclusivity. I think if a game is multi-plat then really, it should be supported for on each platform.

As for Yakuza 3, learn japanese and import it! lol (One thing I think Sony has got right this gen was making their games region-free, and I hope that they don't change that)

[Jaybar]

I don't think that that analogy quite works like you think it does. In both cases, the models that have problems are quite obviously not good products - but in each case, there are future models that do NOT have the same problems, and the brand as a whole isn't destroyed by a model with problems. They still make brand new Explorers, are you seriously trying to claim that they can't be a "good product" because a previous model had problems? Maybe you should tell Ford.

The best part is that people still bought the newer ones after their old ones rolled over. If you stretch it out, yes the analogy doesn't work as well, I'll give you that.

[Brill Weave]

Supposedly they are debating making Yakuza 3 available for both systems. Regardless if it gets ported over here and is a PS3 exclusive, I will end up buying the system. I love the series and I think that they have some of the greatest plots ever done in a game. I will not miss out on another chapter of that if I can avoid it.

The DLC seems like with PSN they kind of get shafted a little(as you said Oblivion for example.) It's almost as if they pick and choose as opposed to XBL where it all is available. XBL mirrors electronic stores with their releases, so every Tuesday there's new stuff being thrown up there.

[Shojin]

The DLC seems like with PSN they kind of get shafted a little(as you said Oblivion for example.) It's almost as if they pick and choose as opposed to XBL where it all is available. XBL mirrors electronic stores with their releases, so every Tuesday there's new stuff being thrown up there.

Yep. Back when the PS3 was still starting out, multi-plat games were built on PC/360 (use the same architecture) and ported over to PS3. So when the game DLC came along, because the PS3 install base was still fairly low it wasn't worth the investment to port it over to PS3. Thankfully, this really only happens these days when DLC is bought, or a company makes a deal with the developer, at least I can't think of a recent title that has done this.

[Cesaria]

Our PS3 died before the 360 (fiance brought MGS4, put it into the drive, anticipating a nice romantic evening with Snake - bye bye PS3). Sony replaced that by couriering a replacement out the following day (I was impressed) and had no problems since then with it.

360 was bought the day Halo 3 came out - died just before it was out of warranty but not to RROD, had the drive magnet coming unstuck unreadable disc error. Had some fun with Microsoft claiming it was out of warranty based on them guessing from when it left the warehouse and their predicted shore shelf time (ours was the last one in the store so must have been there for a while) meaning I had to email them a scan of the till receipt and photo of the rear label on the box to get them to amend the warranty details on their computers, it took a little trip off to Germany and came back problem free so far.

[Cyn]

They tried to say that the warranty starts at manufacture date and not purchase date? Because that sounds pretty fucking retarded lol.

[Kaylia]

They tried to say that the warranty starts at manufacture date and not purchase date? Because that sounds pretty fucking retarded lol.

When you are trying to get a refund, you fill a form on the phone or online. The only thing they can possibly know is the date your console left the warehouse, so if it's been over 3 (1) years, they ask you for additional proof that you bought it after, because you could lie about it.
There is nothing wrong with this, unless you want to argue they should still fix the x-box after 3 years 2 months or w/e.




I can't wait for next gen to be released...stupid console war has been going on for 3 years, and the argument on every side are getting fucking old. I want fresh drama.

[Cyn]

Ah I see, looking back over it, he was attempting to have it repaired without proof of purchase initially.

Yeah the console war thing has been old for years now. But next gen is definitely not coming anytime soon.

[Kaylia]

Ah I see, looking back over it, he was attempting to have it repaired without proof of purchase initially.

Yeah the console war thing has been old for years now. But next gen is definitely not coming anytime soon.

Based on this current generation, I would think there might be a race for the first release. I wouldn't be surprised if we get the first glimpse in 1 year or so, and a release in 2 years.