Multi-hit WS accuracy testing

[Raelia]

Stale thread, but I think I have a solution for testing secondary hits receiving the accuracy bonus from WS Properties (and also Gorgets, if needed).

If you strictly want to confirm if secondary hits receive the accuracy bonus or not, and assuming they're non-percentage bonuses:

Edit: A two-hit WS would be necessary, or the mob must be able to survive all hits of the WS otherwise, or any landed hit ends the WS and it is indeterminable how many swings were attempted before one landed. Swift Blade is then the best candidate, being three hits and low enough overall damage.

Get exactly 256 accuracy, likely an underskilled weapon or while level sync'd, or use -Accuracy gear.
Use a weak weapon, like first stage relic, helpful for next step.
Find a target that can survive all hits of the WS and has the lowest evasion possible, expecting ~30-40 evasion from a Doonz mob.
Optional: Use Infrasonics to reduce the targets evasion another -20.
Quaff Blinding Potion for precisely zero accuracy, unaffecting any bonus.
WS and check TP return.

If the secondary hits land any more than 20% of the time, they're receiving an accuracy bonus. The lower the target's evasion, the bigger boost any accuracy bonus is going to be, as long as the blinding potion has accuracy dead on zero without.

If the accuracy bonus is any less than 5-10, it may still not be apparent, but then why the hell would anyone care.

If the accuracy bonus is percentile, it would be more readily visible in standard testing and usage at high accuracy totals, and testing wouldn't be so necessary.

As for the OP, I never saw him mention that he was testing a Sea Gorget with Guillotine, just Guillotine, and last time I checked:
Delivers a four-hit attack. Silences enemy. Duration of effect varies with TP.

Nope, no accuracy bonus there. We already know the first hit is auto-capped and secondary hits use standard Accuracy.

[Starr]

With a mob lower level than you do you not receive a bonus to acc %?

[Raelia]

With a mob lower level than you do you not receive a bonus to acc %?

Except from Signet, no you shouldn't as far as I know.

[Nightfyre]

Edit: A two-hit WS would be necessary, or the mob must be able to survive all hits of the WS otherwise, or any landed hit ends the WS and it is indeterminable how many swings were attempted before one landed. Swift Blade is then the best candidate, being three hits and low enough overall damage.

Wouldn't Savage Blade be better then? Two hits, damage varies with TP rather than something annoying like a crit WS, along with eliminating the potential question mark of ACC varies with TP. Seems like it fits the bill perfectly. Alternatively, any two-hit non-crit/acc WS... Mordant Rime would be perfect since TP affects the add effect rather than damage.

[Starr]

Except from Signet, no you shouldn't as far as I know.

I thought it was like (Acc=Evasion)=75% hit rate for a mob the same level as you, (Acc+4(mobLV-yourLV))+Evasion)=75% hit rate where mobLV-yourLV can be positive or negative meaning if it was 5 levels lower than you you would need the mobs evasion-20 in accuracy for 75% hit rate.

[Raelia]

Wouldn't Savage Blade be better then? Two hits, damage varies with TP rather than something annoying like a crit WS

The point was how to consistently test the accuracy bonus to secondary hits from WS properties (and Gorgets), so the concept can be applied to Penta Thrust or Asuran Fists, which are:

ACC varies with TP.

Its kinda pointless, but it would be precedent that WS properties affect all hits, which was questioned earlier, and therefore Critical Hit bonuses on a WS more likely affect all hits.

After SE capped all first-hit/one-hit accuracy, it would be incredibly lulzy if WS Properties and Gorgets didn't affect secondary hits.

@Starr, the idea was to completely zero out accuracy except for the bonus and then attack a mob with minimized evasion so that the bonus of 10/20/30/40 accuracy gives an ensured hit-rate increase. It may also determine if the increase is flat or percentage; if secondary hits remain at 20% minimum accuracy it may suggest a smallish percentage increase instead of an integer bonus.

The mechanics of 'accuracy varies' WS should give an insight to the mechanics of 'chance of critical' WS.

[Nightfyre]

The point was how to consistently test the accuracy bonus to secondary hits from WS properties (and Gorgets), so the concept can be applied to Penta Thrust or Asuran Fists, which are:


Its kinda pointless, but it would be precedent that WS properties affect all hits, which was questioned earlier, and therefore Critical Hit bonuses on a WS more likely affect all hits.

Stale thread, but I think I have a solution for testing secondary hits receiving the accuracy bonus from WS Properties (and also Gorgets, if needed).

I can't read Carry on.

[Fwahm]

The problem is, you get 4 bonus accuracy per level you are above the target monster, so just by hitting a level 20 mob at 75 you are getting over 200 bonus accuracy.

[Starr]

Above is exactly what I said in a different way.

[Fwahm]

Yeah, but you sounded fairly uncertain about it, so I was confirming that it works when the mob's level is lower than the player's level.

[Starr]

I was 99.9% certain from remembering Nagamaki's testing.

[bsphil]

The problem is not gorget vs torque, the problem is that gorget are not doing what they are supopoed to do -if the acc boost is true on the first hit-. If you want to "prove" that gorget give +10 to all hits, you classify the tp returns and count the global accuracy when putting all swings together. If you find +5% hitrate the conclusion is that they give +10 acc to all hits. Now if they actually give +10 acc and the first hit gets 80 acc boost, you will not find +5% hit rate... you should find less.

The JP WS gorget testing from over a year and a half ago began with the premise that the first hit of a ws has capped hitrate, you retard.

releenaseraph: Just in Time for Febru...Dammit!

Check the comments.

Also, wow you're behind the ball on this stuff BG.

[pchan]

The JP WS gorget testing from over a year and a half ago began with the premise that the first hit of a ws has capped hitrate, you retard.

releenaseraph: Just in Time for Febru...Dammit!

Check the comments.

Also, wow you're behind the ball on this stuff BG.

Without gorget
2nd hit of WS: 148/210 70.5%
3rd hit of WS: 147/210 70.0%

200 sample size on 2nd and 3rd hit, 400 total. The 95% standard error is +/- 4.49% for the 1nd and 3rd hit taken globally (400 hit total) and +/- 6.35% on each individual hit (200 sample each).

With gorget
2nd hit of WS: 158/210 75.2%
3rd hit of WS: 158/210 75.2%

same bullcrap. The increase you are measuring through test is (almost) less than the statistical error...


So no, it's not a test.

[Vodou]

The problem is, you get 4 bonus accuracy per level you are above the target monster, so just by hitting a level 20 mob at 75 you are getting over 200 bonus accuracy.

I don't think so...

I was testing Namas on mobs level 43-47 while using blind pots and I had a total of 71 racc. I landed only 13% of my shots.

From what you have said, I should have had (75-45)*4 = 120 as added racc or total 191. Clearly 191 racc against level 43-47 mobs is not going to give you 13% hits.

[CDF]

The JP WS gorget testing from over a year and a half ago began with the premise that the first hit of a ws has capped hitrate, you retard.

releenaseraph: Just in Time for Febru...Dammit!

Check the comments.

Also, wow you're behind the ball on this stuff BG.

lolforumcred and cherry-picking dumb-fuck.

[Kirschy]

I was 99.9% certain from remembering Nagamaki's testing.

Nagi's testing was only on Tough + VT Statues if I recall. People just extrapolated a general idea of an acc correction based on the 4 different levels of Enkidu. While it works for general purposes, don't think there was anything on level correction for anything below level 77.

(I'm also interested in re-reading his tests if anyone has them. It's hard to discern what was tested for true, and what was generalized for estimates.)

[Starr]

Nagi's testing was only on Tough + VT Statues if I recall. People just extrapolated a general idea of an acc correction based on the 4 different levels of Enkidu. While it works for general purposes, don't think there was anything on level correction for anything below level 77.

(I'm also interested in re-reading his tests if anyone has them. It's hard to discern what was tested for true, and what was generalized for estimates.)

It was Even Match Steel Shells at first.

[Kirschy]

It was Even Match Steel Shells at first.

Even more interested in reading the data if anyone has it then. I don't believe I read anything /w Nagi + Crabs~ Anyone have a link or saved it as a text file?

[Byrthnoth]

Another option would be to fight Mamool Ja Zenists in Mamook. Wait until they cast shadows, swing until they have one left, WS. PLD/RDM with Fast Blade and a single hit sword would work fine. Making it so you have 50% Acc base like the OP would be smart.

You can sort them based on level if you want (73-75), but I'm pretty sure the people saying there's no Acc bonus for players fighting low level mobs without Signet or Sigil is correct. Sanction shouldn't contaminate the test either, so feel free to Refresh up. =p