Terrorists win.

[Dimmauk]

I have no idea why people are that pissed.

He's going to die a slow, agonizing death as the cancer eats it's way through his body. Libya has shitty health care. And the Scots don't have to pay a cent for keeping his pathetic terrorist ass alive, knowing that he's doomed anyway.

Win.

Because he is allowed to walk around as a free man. He can go see family, go out to eat, etc.., something that the families of the people that he killed wont get to do with their loved ones

[aduidarnenye]

Because he is allowed to walk around as a free man. He can go see family, go out to eat, etc.., something that the families of the people that he killed wont get to do with their loved ones

Keeping him in gaol will not accomplish that goal either. May as well send him back as he'll die a slow, painful death anyways. Made all the more painful by poor health care. I'm sure being able to go out to eat is at the bottom of his list of priorities.

Personally, I prefer long prison terms with hard and monotonous labour for such crimes. Giving someone a quick, painless death in an execution chamber does not seem nearly enough punishment, and it hardly corrects the wrong committed.

[Meat]

Criminals of Jewish descent often escape to Israel to avoid prosecution.

Here's a blatant example:

Israel extradition law offers help to alleged criminals - Jewish Telegraphic Agency




The article fails to put emphasis on the fact that the American couple, used as an example of Israel allowing 'Israeli citizens' to be extradited, are Jewish. They focus on their citizenship in a benign fashion. When you consider the Jewish Law of Return in Israel (citizenship) is based on ethnicity - the context of the Mannings 'fleeing' from the U.S. to Israel is that they are able to do so with such expediency SINCE they are Jewish.

Israel Holds Couple Sought by U.S. Since 1989 in Letter-Bomb Killing (NY Times - 1991)

11 year old article criticizing an already amended law

[Rhinox]

Because he is allowed to walk around as a free man. He can go see family, go out to eat, etc.., something that the families of the people that he killed wont get to do with their loved ones

He suffering from Advanced Prostrate cancer. Something tells me he wont be walking around much.

[Dimmauk]

He suffering from Advanced Prostrate cancer. Something tells me he wont be walking around much.

He is still a Free Man.

[Faris]

Spoiler: show

Criminals of Jewish descent often escape to Israel to avoid prosecution.

Here's a blatant example:

Israel extradition law offers help to alleged criminals - Jewish Telegraphic Agency




The article fails to put emphasis on the fact that the American couple, used as an example of Israel allowing 'Israeli citizens' to be extradited, are Jewish. They focus on their citizenship in a benign fashion. When you consider the Jewish Law of Return in Israel (citizenship) is based on ethnicity - the context of the Mannings 'fleeing' from the U.S. to Israel is that they are able to do so with such expediency SINCE they are Jewish.

Israel Holds Couple Sought by U.S. Since 1989 in Letter-Bomb Killing (NY Times - 1991)

God i love you elvis

[Skjie]

11 year old article criticizing an already amended law

Elvis doesn't really care to dispute or verify anything anti-Israeli, you're wasting your time.

[Kuya]

Elvis doesn't really care to dispute or verify anything anti-Israeli, you're wasting your time.

I hope we are critiscizing his accuracy and not his anti Israel stance. Because if i remember correctly, you were one of the posters who agreed with my argument that whas the US government does justifies an anti US stance in the sense of opposing the US government itself. Therefore it should be justifiable to be anti Israel if what that means is opposition to the horrible things Israel does. Israel the State-Government, and not the Israeli people proper.

His rigour and accuracy in information however, is a perfectly legitimate thing to have contention with, and i hope you clarify.

[Skjie]

Yes, the government. My apologies.

EDIT: That said, I tend to side against the Palestinian government/people on most things regarding Israel. Also, few people on this forum have done as much research (Elvis likely has) as me on that topic and I'm no longer interested in discussing it.

[Elvis]

Elvis doesn't really care to dispute or verify anything anti-Israeli, you're wasting your time.

"Verify"? My facts were correct. Now if you want to dispute my insinuation that criminals of Jewish descent frequently flee to Israel to escape prosecution - that's fair. I don't have a statistic - I'm basing my conclusions on the comments of law enforcement officials cited in the first article. I also said it doesn't happen 24/7 but that it happens at all is ridiculous.

And I wish you would debate more in the Israel-Palestine thread. I haven't posted in it much in the past month or so because it's turning into a blog.

You should say something because I'm not stubborn. I've gotten a lot more perspective since 'Cast Lead'. I consider myself in between anti-Zionist and post-Zionist.

However, of course this is within the context of what I consider to be politically realist and not purely ideological. In terms of ideological - I am anti-Jewish State (preferential treatment for Jews), discrimination against non-Jews (although I've focused on discrimination against Israeli Arabs and Palestinians); anti-colonial/imperial State/Outpost to the core.

That being said I wouldn't want an Islamic State either with any kind of Shar'ia(sp) Law either. I don't support Hamas but I do support the Palestinians right to resist (by violent and non-violent means) their dispossession/displacement, daily abuse, violation of basic human rights, discrimination, etc..

They have a right to fight. I don't condone the terrorism at all. However, all nationalist groups throughout history have used terror. So the standard applied to 'others' is unfair and ludicrous.

Especially when you consider the terrorism of the Jewish nationalist groups like Irgun.

I will give you my perspective - and you should give me yours. And that's all there is really. We can't all be 100% neutral. The debate is supposed to be cathartic with opposing views as the catalyst.

EDIT:

Oh and you're implying the NY Times is anti-Israel? The Jewish Telegraph Agency? JWeekly?

Absurd.

[Skjie]

And I wish you would debate more in the Israel-Palestine thread. I haven't posted in it much in the past month or so because it's turning into a blog.

Please don't take this offensively, but I do read that thread, and I've debated every position with a lovely woman from Palestine and has a Masters in Middle East Politics as well studied under a professor who was a member of Amnesty International focusing on the middle east during the 80s. I really honestly have no desire to talk about Israel/Palestine anymore.

[Kuya]

I thought you were a believer that liked to blog about their ideals.

[Elvis]

Fair enough, Skjie.

Was that to me, Kuya? I like posting about I-P to show people what's going on over there from a different perspective, but I also feel like I'm preaching to the converted. (Hence, why I like Mondoweiss so much. There are - mostly - Zionists and anti-Zionists there always debating. And they know way more than me on the subject. I'm still learning, but I think my values and ethics have me rooted w/ the Palestinian camp - I didn't arbitrarily decide to support them.)

[Meat]

and the disinterested

[Elvis]

and the disinterested

More like the irritated. The genuinely disinterested people simply don't read the thread.

Your agitation is political (and tribal apparently) not benign as in 'oh that's just boring'.

[Kuya]

No that wasn't for you and you didn't get the reference. I hate you.

[Elvis]

@_@;

[zoobernut]

I thought you were a believer that liked to blog about their ideals.

Eating a twix right now?

[Kuya]

Yes!