What's Better?

[Argettio]

haste does nothing to our WS , thats why we all should tp in full hachiman.

http://snarkynet.com/images/sarcasm-detector-thumb.jpg

http://firstrung.co.uk/dbimgs/boom1.jpg

[Pirian]

I'd probably stick with Cuch for both. If your acc is good you can toss on a 2nd STR ring for KJ for more benefit. Also, I'm sure you know already but WS Gorget would be a better choice on both WSes. Also, what race are you? You want to aim for about 117 DEX on RR for birds. Mamools need a fair bit more depending on which.

Elvaan ._. I have a dex build but it's 7 dex short of 117 last I checked. And yeah, I'm not overly worried about gorgets for warrior as I'm mostly on sam if any DD at all. But then I need gorgets for sam too so that's a moot points

[Gergall]

use footwork only after a charm, to get back to 100tp as fast as possible ( for shoulder tackles), then cancel it. that's it. If you get more tp per hit, the madamme gets also more tp per hit.

Wiki states that during Footwork, base TP gain is 13.8 but "Treats your base TP return as 9.3% for the purposes of enemy TP return" and that Subtle Blow then stacks on top of that.

Would you or anyone please comment on this? Now that I've had some sleep and reread this information it seems even more certain that Footwork is ideal for the entire fight.

[FailureMidgard]

use footwork only after a charm, to get back to 100tp as fast as possible ( for shoulder tackles), then cancel it. that's it. If you get more tp per hit, the madamme gets also more tp per hit.

And yet, each hit also has a +3 static attached to it. So you have to compare 2 fists+6 tp vs 1 footwork+3 tp. Footwork -should- be more efficient as far as playertp:monstertp gain.

Don't use Footwork. MNK is already pretty TP efficient thanks to Subtle Blow and frankly it just isn't necessary. The longer the fight is the more likely DoT is to wear during Charm and the more likely you are to have to restart from 100TP.

Mnk is actually the least "TP efficient" job in the game, up there with nin and any other job that dual wields. Subtle Blow keeps it from getting too out of hand, it doesn't make you feed less than a 2h/nin.

[Ragnell]

Tp build- FFXIAH.com

Rate this just plain just got 75 set, anything need to change, until I get better shit

[Cream Soda]

SH > assault Jerkin unless your acc is capped


Other than that shit u already konw u need.

Swift belt, brutal/rajas ect

[Ragnell]

SH > assault Jerkin unless your acc is capped


Other than that shit u already konw u need.

Swift belt, brutal/rajas ect

No CoP so no Swift or Rajas

[homerun]

No CoP so no Swift or Rajas

I think he means to work towards it.


For legs, your best bet is to get askar pants or aurum legs till you can get barbarossas/homam. Dusk trousers aren't a bad option either.

Also since you don't have the earring, use thalassocrat over skystryder.

Life over potent for tping while uncapped acc as well.

[Ragnell]

I think he means to work towards it.


For legs, your best bet is to get askar pants or aurum legs till you can get barbarossas/homam. Dusk trousers aren't a bad option either.

Also since you don't have the earring, use thalassocrat over skystryder.

Life over potent for tping while uncapped acc as well.

Yea i'm still workin on my CoP and thanks

[Ragnell]

Well I havent done Nyzul yet so i'll have to keep those as an option (pants)

[Byrthnoth]

Okay Starr, thanks for stating the obvious. My point was that Delay -3% doesn't directly enhance Weaponskills, while Double Attack does. Regardless, I didn't feel like doing the math and simply said that there was likely no parseable difference, which is probably true.

Here's the math:

So Delay -3% lets you WS 3.09% more frequently by virtue of lowering your delay 3.09% while not affecting your TP gain rate.
DA+2% on SAM/DRG with Brutal lets you WS 1.94% more frequently.

Now, does the occasional ~+1 fTP to your WS make up for the -1.15% WS frequency?

On a WS like Tachi: Rana (3x fTP of 1.0), obviously you get 3 chances to DA and can potentially DA twice, meaning you increase your average WS damage a bit less than 2% by having 2% DA.
1 - .98^3 = ~5.9% DA rate :: The 2x and 3x DA cases are very small so you can disregard them (the result is still ~5.9% if you don't). Similarly, I also disregarded the possibility that hits might miss / Zanshin might proc / etc because it just makes the problem overly complex and the extra hits from the 1.15% difference in TP phase is just as or more likely to miss.
5.9%*33% increase in damage (4 fTP / 3 fTP - 1) = 1.95% increase in damage
To calculate it assuming you're using Brutal already: (.95^3 - .93^3 = 5.35% DA rate) So it's a 1.8% increase in WS damage to have an additional 2% DA.
If a SAM was using Tachi: Rana all the time, it might make sense to choose Pole Grip over Sword Strap even if you could use it simply because a 1.8% increase in WS damage > 1.15% increase in WS damage. Whether this is worth it depends on your DoT. SAM DoT is generally pretty low relative to other jobs, but you would have to have your damage totals be about 2:1 (1.15/.65, then round up if your Acc isn't capped in multi-hit WS) for WS:TP phases in order to make Pole > Strap.

On a WS like Tachi: Gekko, where people screw their Acc to shit and have a minimum hit rate for the Double Attack, obviously it's not worth really considering the Double Attack as a factor in WS. This is true to the extent that in the past (in this thread <,<) I've questioned whether SAMs should even be wearing Brutal over a Triumph Earring during YGK.

Math likely favors Sword Strap without considering other stats simply because DA essentially doesn't increase WS damage in YGK and Sword has a slightly higher TP rate/DOT. However, the 10 Atk and 1 Str potentially increases his DOT in the DA set enough that he can make up the lacking 1.15% WS and TP damage.
If he was using a multi-hit WS then I'd definitely say Pole Grip + 10 Atk/1STR >= -3% Delay.
Do I think you can parse the difference? Not really.



About MNK. With 42 Subtle Blow (Hades/BB/Usu Gote/Rajas, aka how our MNKs geared), 348 Delay delay gives 4.5TP to the enemy. That's 3.88TP/second assuming 100% Acc and 25+35% Haste. Every time SAM hits the monster with Hagun (Rajas so 5 Subtle Blow), 450 Delay gives the monster 13.8TP. That's 4.28TP/second with 100% Acc and 22+35% Haste. So in terms of TP efficiency, MNK is really pretty good.
It's deceptive just how much Subtle Blow can matter. I always fingered Thieves as the real source of gear TP spam troubles, but if you do all the math they really aren't hugely different from the other DDs, especially when you consider they're naked most of the run (aka no Haste from gear).

[Despain]

ACP Body for PLD (+5 enmity, Fast Cast +5)
vs.
ACP Body for COR ("Quick Draw" ability delay -5, "Magic Attack Bonus"+4)

I'm torn

[pchan]

About MNK. With 42 Subtle Blow (Hades/BB/Usu Gote/Rajas, aka how our MNKs geared), 348 Delay delay gives 4.5TP to the enemy. That's 3.88TP/second assuming 100% Acc and 25+35% Haste. Every time SAM hits the monster with Hagun (Rajas so 5 Subtle Blow), 450 Delay gives the monster 13.8TP. That's 4.28TP/second with 100% Acc and 22+35% Haste. So in terms of TP efficiency, MNK is really pretty good.
It's deceptive just how much Subtle Blow can matter. I always fingered Thieves as the real source of gear TP spam troubles, but if you do all the math they really aren't hugely different from the other DDs, especially when you consider they're naked most of the run (aka no Haste from gear).

enemy gain your (base tp +3)* subtle blow

edit : also destroyers return a base tp of 4.9, not 4.5 .

[Max™]

ACP Body for COR ("Quick Draw" ability delay -5, "Magic Attack Bonus"+4)

I'm torn

I.R. Body is good enough to not miss the 5 FC, and the casting time adjustment was irritating if I wasn't fulltiming it, but there's no easily available replacement for what the Cor Mirke does.

If I leveled the job I'd totally redo my Acc/DW Mirke for QD/MAB.

[Tobi]

I was wondering which would be best for my current SAM and DRG 6hit TP build.

Main: Hagun
Sub: Rose Strap
Ammo: Tiphia Sting
Head: Askar Zuchetto
Neck: Peacock Charm
Ear1: Brutal Earring
Ear2: Ethereal Earring
Body: Haubergeon +1
Hands: Dusk Gloves(Dex +2 aug)
Ring1: Ecphoria Ring
Ring2: Rajas Ring
Back: Amemet Mantle +1
Waist: Swift Belt
Legs: Byakko's Haidate
Feet: Fuma Suna-ate

Is this set fine or should I switch over to Hachiman Kote, Pole Grip, higher ACC ring for 6hit?

Main: Fay Lance(DMG +5, str +2, Lightning damage +15 aug)
Sub: Claymore Grip
Ammo: Tiphia Sting
Head: Askar Zuchetto
Neck: Peacoc Charm
Ear1: Brutal Earring
Ear2: Ethereal Earring
Body: Askar Korazin
Hands: Dusk Gloves(dex +2 aug)
Ring1: Iota Ring
Ring2: Rajas Ring
Back: Amemet Mantle +1
Waist: Swift Belt
Legs: Homam Cosciales
Feet: Aurum Sabatons

Would Switching over to Rose Strap, Homam Corraza, Ecphoria Ring be better? Any other suggestions would be nice.

Also, I have 4/8 GK Merits and 8/8 Polearm merits.

[mdkuser]

Okay Starr, thanks for stating the obvious. My point was that Delay -3% doesn't directly enhance Weaponskills, while Double Attack does. Regardless, I didn't feel like doing the math and simply said that there was likely no parseable difference, which is probably true.

Here's the math:

So Delay -3% lets you WS 3.09% more frequently by virtue of lowering your delay 3.09% while not affecting your TP gain rate.
DA+2% on SAM/DRG with Brutal lets you WS 1.94% more frequently.

Now, does the occasional ~+1 fTP to your WS make up for the -1.15% WS frequency?

Your doing maths that has been done on this thread many times. If sword strap doesn't break your X build, it is ( about 1%) better than pole grip, and this apply to any 2handed DD. /nin or /war or anything else use sword strap, /sam use pole.

[Nightfyre]

Main: Fay Lance(DMG +5, str +2, Lightning damage +15 aug)
Sub: Claymore Grip Pole Grip or Rose Grip
Ammo: Tiphia Sting
Head: Askar Zuchetto Walahra Turban
Neck: Peacoc Charm
Ear1: Brutal Earring
Ear2: Ethereal Earring
Body: Askar Korazin
Hands: Dusk Gloves(dex +2 aug)
Ring1: Iota Ring
Ring2: Rajas Ring
Back: Amemet Mantle +1
Waist: Swift Belt
Legs: Homam Cosciales
Feet: Aurum Sabatons

Would Switching over to Rose Strap, Homam Corraza, Ecphoria Ring be better? Any other suggestions would be nice.

Also, I have 4/8 GK Merits and 8/8 Polearm merits.

Pretty sure your SAM setup with Rose Strap is the better of the two options you listed. For DRG, use the Homam setup if you're lacking ACC and this setup otherwise. As a DRG with full Polearm merits, you'll be good with Askar 99% of the time.

[pchan]

Mnk is actually the least "TP efficient" job in the game, up there with nin and any other job that dual wields. Subtle Blow keeps it from getting too out of hand, it doesn't make you feed less than a 2h/nin.

No, mnk is still the best, as they can cap or almost cap subtle blow easily ... and that's with their best gear. Hi2u sam/war 1WS= 1 WS for the mob pretty much.

[Dooom]

No, mnk is still the best, as they can cap or almost cap subtle blow easily ... and that's with their best gear. Hi2u sam/war 1WS= 1 WS for the mob pretty much.

Thief, FFXI, and other unimportant matters

Theorycrafting to suggest that sam is more tp efficient than monk.

[Altariel]

For Slug Shot looking at Denali Jacket + Dusk Trousers vs. Corsair's Frac +1 + Commodore Culottes. Basically a difference of 9 R.Att 10 AGI vs. 5 R.Att 8 AGI 3 STR

266 Marksmanship Skill and not counting the Body/Leg combo I'm at 82 STR 85 AGI +30 R.Att from gear with gorget.