Absolute Virtue Information (OP Updated)

[Seraphus]

While seeing the "Readies" message in itself is an incredibly major thing, I'm not sure if people would ever have considered if the message was triggered by a piece of gear.

Just a thought

[Max™]

I'm sure someone would have noticed that they got the message while wearing it, but others didn't if it worked that way. I'm sure the various torque/weapon tests would have noted it as well, it is kind of strange seeing a mob warn you it's going to 2hr.

Can't say it is unrelated, but I doubt it's the only thing that makes it happen.

How many Sams fighting AV would NOT be wearing Justice Torques?

[Seraphus]

How many Sams fighting AV would NOT be wearing Justice Torques?

With that thing's horrendous-ass drop rate, you'd be surprised.

Also re-watched the video, there's a RDM/THF in the video kiting the Wynavs, maybe some sort of advantage to keeping all 3 Wynavs alive?

idk im just throwing out random ideas <_>

[Meat]

Its not just PB apparently. What do you know about this "Nirvana" shell that has been teaming up with them? Although I have yet to see any tangible proof, I still think the notion should be investigated rather than dismissed entirely without seeing anything for ourselves. The person who posted the information on here was known as "NSX".

That's probably Nsxtasy from r0, but i'll agree with Lovex. PB and New Nirvana are just these average old school jp shells with a lot of well geared players. They teamed up and timed out to pw @ 90% with upwards of 70ppl. Highly unlikely they beat av

[Hapernack]

Exactly how extreme can meteor get, damage-wise?.....
I remember hearing someone mention Meteor (w/ bracelets) does like 2.5-3k damage, is it possible that maybe having Paladins (2 tanking, 1 or 2 on standby) all having Aegis, capped shellra V on them, and stacking a bunch of Magic Defense Bonus gear would drop Meteor's damage to a more managable number?

It doesn't matter if you can drop it to manageable/surviveable numbers for your tanks. Meteor's range is ridiculous. If you can see AV, you're already dead probably. One meteor in bracelet mode and your entire alliance is destroyed. Even if you survive, you won't be alive for long because even if BOTH your tanks got ridiculously lucky and lived, well congratz your support is all dead. Your mages and healers are all dead. Every DD on the hate list is dead too. Everyone but you has a 0% chance of living through it and its not like they can be out of range. Its a total insta-wipe.

That's probably Nsxtasy from r0, but i'll agree with Lovex. PB and New Nirvana are just these average old school jp shells with a lot of well geared players. They teamed up and timed out to pw @ 90% with upwards of 70ppl. Highly unlikely they beat av

Not to discredit you or anything but its "he said/she said" text from both sides at this point both for and against these notions. Until proven one way or another, nothing more can really be said. Either that or a couple "informants" to BG people are gonna look really dumb.

[Thorny]

How many Sams fighting AV would NOT be wearing Justice Torques?

I'd hope any SAM involved in a serious AV attempt knows in this case they're better off with a peacock charm or ancient torque from a DD standpoint, torque theories aside. You're not capping acc on AV.

It doesn't matter if you can drop it to manageable/surviveable numbers for your tanks. Meteor's range is ridiculous. If you can see AV, you're already dead probably. One meteor in bracelet mode and your entire alliance is destroyed. Even if you survive, you won't be alive for long because even if BOTH your tanks got ridiculously lucky and lived, well congratz your support is all dead. Your mages and healers are all dead. Every DD on the hate list is dead too. Everyone but you has a 0% chance of living through it and its not like they can be out of range. Its a total insta-wipe.

30' aoe from target, fealty guarantees 1/16 resist which assures your tanks will survive if they have fealty up, if there were a decent way to predict it then not really insta-wipe

[Virg]

Exactly how extreme can meteor get, damage-wise?

I remember in an interview SE said that they always gear their "Test" people according to how powerful their target is, so they used Aegis paladins for AV and PW.

I remember hearing someone mention Meteor (w/ bracelets) does like 2.5-3k damage, is it possible that maybe having Paladins (2 tanking, 1 or 2 on standby) all having Aegis, capped shellra V on them, and stacking a bunch of Magic Defense Bonus gear would drop Meteor's damage to a more managable number?

They had PLDs with Earth Staff and Koenig gear tanking AV in their video. No way in hell you can survive Meteor with that. Possible they actually had Aegis and HQ MDB gear but why would they tank AV with Earth Staff and Koenig in the first place then? Also I highly doubt that you can reduce Bracelet Meteor with Aegis and MDB gear to a point where you can survive it without the use of Fealty.

[Virtuous Saint]

No, Meteor is 25 from target it is casted on, and it is around 5500 and 6000 base damage (obviously not the base damage given the fact that it has massive MAB, but this is basically what it comes down to when it hits target), Bracelets/Manafonted versions. It works like all -ga spells in that the more targets hit from 1-10(cap) the less damage is taken. So you have 6000x.4=2400, -50% MDT=1200, additional MDB=possibly slightly less for Manafonted version, then for bracelets version which seems to be slightly less damage approx 5500 base you have 5500x.4=2200, -50% MDT=1100, additional MDB=possibly slightly less.

You can technically have every single BLM out of range of meteor, yet in range to be able to nuke if they and the PLDs are positioned perfectly, having PLD max range in front of AV and BLM max range directly opposite side, but there is an incredibly high chance AV will move at some point and Meteor before people can reposition. The thing is no mage healing any tank can be in range to cure and out of range of Meteor, so as soon as one goes off they all die.

We had best possible geared PLDs which were taking 1200-1300+ from bracelets Meteor that hit 10+ people, so maybe that can give you an idea of how strong it is. These PLDs obviously weren't all idling in full MDB, but that just isn't going to happen for every Meteor that hits, but they obviously had -50% MDT. I'm not sure if people are understanding this, but after 79%HP Meteor will be casted at random just like Comet/AeroV/AerogaIV/TornadoII, it doesn't matter what 2hrs it has at all. The only time it has absolutely no possibility of casting Meteor are during the 2hrs which it cannot cast during, which I labeled all of them in the OP.

Let me give you an example: AV uses Hundred Fists, it will attack at certain delay for 45sec exactly, and it cannot cast or WS during this, and as soon as it wears off it will immediately use a random WS and spell, every single time and that spell could be Meteor. A combination of 2hrs which make it unable to cast can help you for only a very short time before the potential for another Meteor is back, and 1 combination is Mighty Strikes>Hundred Fists which I checked a video btw and it does use the dust clouds back to back, there isn't just 1 dust cloud. The only way a PLD survives this is with Sentinel/Reprisal, then another PLD covers them half way through.. you get the point.

Btw Fealty doesn't reduce it to 1/16, it's either 1/8 or a -% magical taken.

[Hapernack]

30' aoe from target, fealty guarantees 1/16 resist which assures your tanks will survive if they have fealty up, if there were a decent way to predict it then not really insta-wipe

That's still ridiculously huge and would kill pretty much everyone (basically any non-PLD is gone). Its not predictable or stunnable and AV can decide to use it as often as it wants. As of right now we don't know how to lock it or nerf it, and we can't avoid it. So at this moment in time, it really is pretty much an insta-wipe unless I'm missing something.

[Virtuous Saint]

About the readies thing, no it cannot be every 2hr. Hundred Fists and Mijin Gakure do not have 'readies', this isn't based off looking at .dat, but just knowledge of what happens when it uses these when in what could only be described as 'readies mode'. What happens for these 2hrs is: 'Absolute Virtue readies Lateral Slash' >> ~3sec in chat >> 'Absolute Virtue uses Hundred Fists or Mijin', I reported this to an SGM who of course got back to me stating they found no problem, they are all so god damn retarded it is sad, and yes, this is a Tonberry WS. Our JP friend in ls stated that in JP it is something that is unique to AV, i.e not a Tonberry WS. Basically what you have is 'Absolute Virtue readies >> all except HF/Mijin', also we have fought AV for countless....... countless hours, and we have seen 2-3 readies and 1 lateral slash since last update to AV. There is no conceivable way to get it to readies, and the only times we see it are when we are sacking it tbh.

[Virtuous Saint]

That's still ridiculously huge and would kill pretty much everyone (basically any non-PLD is gone). Its not predictable or stunnable and AV can decide to use it as often as it wants. As of right now we don't know how to lock it or nerf it, and we can't avoid it. So at this moment in time, it really is pretty much an insta-wipe unless I'm missing something.

Nope, you're not missing a thing, that quote is slightly invalid info tho.

[Virg]

Just a quick question for you VS. Given the fact that you fought AV lost of times allready.
Do you think it´s possible to roll with Kaeko´s strategy? Positioning the back line jobs on top of Pallace entrance thus avoiding Meteor while tanks stay down and keep them "Invincible" through the massive use of Wild Card mules so their Sentinel and Fealty will be pretty much up at all times.

[Virtuous Saint]

Just a quick question for you VS. Given the fact that you fought AV lost of times allready.
Do you think it´s possible to roll with Kaeko´s strategy? Positioning the back line jobs on top of Pallace entrance thus avoiding Meteor while tanks stay down and keep them "Invincible" through the massive use of Wild Card mules so their Sentinel and Fealty will be pretty much up at all times.

Ya it def is but of course that would take a shit load of people and then you still might run out of time ect. I thought about using wild card before but that would take a ridiculous number of mules/people still. I had an idea of having everyone at the ramp and just having a straight up flawless absorb party of RDM/SMNs with best possible -MDT +MDB. PLDs will take roughly 1100-1300 damage so they need to be full HP at all times tho.

[Hapernack]

Nope, you're not missing a thing, that quote is slightly invalid info tho.

Yeah I caught your post afterwards, I kinda went to bed and left my computer mid-post and finished it this morning.

[pchan]

No, Meteor is 25 from target it is casted on, and it is around 5500 and 6000 base damage (obviously not the base damage given the fact that it has massive MAB, but this is basically what it comes down to when it hits target), Bracelets/Manafonted versions. It works like all -ga spells in that the more targets hit from 1-10(cap) the less damage is taken. So you have 6000x.4=2400, -50% MDT=1200, additional MDB=possibly slightly less for Manafonted version, then for bracelets version which seems to be slightly less damage approx 5500 base you have 5500x.4=2200, -50% MDT=1100, additional MDB=possibly slightly less.

I have questions regarding resistance of meteor and aeroga/tornado spells. Level 95 mobs like Tiamat require 300 fire resist to cap resists, so basically 250 fire resist to match their magic accuracy (which yields 50% resist rate). On the other hands, blm bombs (level 76) in halvung require about 150 fire resist to match their magic accuracy. So very lousy speaking mobs get about 5 magic accuracy per level, and since AV is reported level 84 (wiki) you would need 190 dark resist / wind resist to match its magic accuracy and get 50% resist.

-So my question is, what is the resist rate (even eyeballing) of aeroga IV (meteor if available) with basic barspells from WHM ? Do you even notice resists ? If so this could mean that it has less magic accuracy than +190 and make a dark resist more viable.

[Virg]

Ya it def is but of course that would take a shit load of people and then you still might run out of time ect. I thought about using wild card before but that would take a ridiculous number of mules/people still. I had an idea of having everyone at the ramp and just having a straight up flawless absorb party of RDM/SMNs with best possible -MDT +MDB. PLDs will take roughly 1100-1300 damage so they need to be full HP at all times tho.

I like the idea of a RDM/SMN party to absorb a lot. Did anybody actually ever try that? Probably not but that´s a promising idea right there. Also I really like where this thread is going. Keep it up people and keep the retarded shit out of this thread please.

[Virg]

So my question is, what is the resist rate (even eyeballing) of aeroga IV (meteor if available) with basic barspells from WHM ? Do you even notice resists ? If so this could mean that it has less magic accuracy than +190 and make a dark resist more viable.

Iirc it was mentioned before that somebody resisted AerogaIV quite a few times. Not 100% sure though. I don´t really see any chance to resist Meteor in Bracelet mode without PLD´s with full MDB and Fealty up. Especially because they can´t idle in MDB while tanking AV and Meteor is instant.

[Shinryuu]

You'd need RDMs with D.Rings, orz. Maybe add a (Galka?) COR w/ BLU roll who has to survive as well.

[pchan]

Iirc it was mentioned before that somebody resisted AerogaIV quite a few times. Not 100% sure though. I don´t really see any chance to resist Meteor in Bracelet mode without PLD´s with full MDB and Fealty up. Especially because they can´t idle in MDB while tanking AV and Meteor is instant.

I'm asking about aeroga 4 because SE uses baraero in the video meaning they expect resists. It could be possible that AV has less magic accuracy outside of manafont/chainspell ?

[TheMysteriousX]

It's an interesting thought. Could we bring down the damage of meteor to managable levels using light carol/MDT/MDB/Magus' Roll?

EDIT: or, from the other side, lowering AV's MAcc/MAtt. Absorb-INT, those crazy BLU spells no one uses etc.