Absolute Virtue Information (OP Updated)

[Aurara]

its just Draylo trying his hardest to make blu seem like its important.

[Draylo]

lol, homam head blows...if you need magic acc you use relic head,
and askar is a good multi-hit WS piece if you lack heca or the past helms and have AMKD hat for another job. but not for tp
hachiman domaru is a poor sam's GKT WS body.

Except relic head gives no haste, combination of both is win.

its just Draylo trying his hardest to make blu seem like its important.

Most likely a troll post as always, but BLU wasn't the only job I was arguing for with those items.

[fredjanx]

Except relic head gives no haste, combination of both is win

let's be realistic, though.... when do you need to use homam head for headbutt? HNM? I'd be on another job.

[Draylo]

I said I use it for MP drainkiss mostly, few other spells that could benefit as well (sleep).

[Yugl]

The problem is that we don't know the full extent of Magic ACC in relation to BLU spells. How can we argue whether the Magic ACC+3 will make a difference without this information? How can we argue whether the 3% Haste on a BLU spell is more important than the added magic ACC from Relic helm? When you think about it, vying for Homam Helm suggests that you need a subset of Haste, ACC, and Magic ACC. Haste + ACC is easy to determine using current knowledge. Haste + Magic ACC and ACC + Magic ACC are a different story.

[fredjanx]

k, so.... back on topic
has anyone killed JoL where he spawns at, instead of killing him where he gets stuck?

[Draylo]

Well it isn't the thread for BLU discussion so I won't go so far into it. It isn't illogical to assume that BLU magical spells would function the same as normal magical spells. The haste in addition to the macc (which is +4 btw, not +3) is a good combo. Hat is +5 skill. You can place macc in a lot of other slots as well, I would seriously doubt the hat pulling that far ahead of the homam to warrant dropping haste. I assume you are talking about headbutt, but you wouldn't need acc for magical spells, only macc.

[Yugl]

Well it isn't the thread for BLU discussion so I won't go so far into it. It isn't illogical to assume that BLU magical spells would function the same as normal magical spells. The haste in addition to the macc (which is +4 btw, not +3) is a good combo. Hat is +5 skill. You can place macc in a lot of other slots as well, I would seriously doubt the hat pulling that far ahead of the homam to warrant dropping haste. I assume you are talking about headbutt, but you wouldn't need acc for magical spells, only macc.

I'm talking about the MP Drain move. We don't have the information necessary to make these type of judgments yet.

[Niiro]

http://images4.wikia.nocookie.net/__.../f1/Tizona.jpg

I think it would be safe to say MACC works for magic BLU spells as it does for all other magic, otherwise SE is trolling BLU hardcore.

[Yugl]

http://images4.wikia.nocookie.net/__.../f1/Tizona.jpg

I think it would be safe to say MACC works for magic BLU spells as it does for all other magic, otherwise SE is trolling BLU hardcore.

It's not about whether it works; it's about how it works. For example, we have a formula for determining melee ACC. Using this, we can predict the damage increase one will incur from using more ACC and we can say when we've capped our ACC. On the other hand, we don't know how BLU magic spells work. We don't know the relation of BLU Skill to resist rates. We don't know the relation of modifiers of BLU spells to resist rates. We can gesture a plausible formula for the effect of magic ACC, but we don't know for certain. Without this information, we cannot make credible statements about the best gear unless it's exceedingly obvious.

[RealGosu]

Nice

[Sho]

It's not about whether it works; it's about how it works. For example, we have a formula for determining melee ACC. Using this, we can predict the damage increase one will incur from using more ACC and we can say when we've capped our ACC. On the other hand, we don't know how BLU magic spells work. We don't know the relation of BLU Skill to resist rates. We don't know the relation of modifiers of BLU spells to resist rates. We can gesture a plausible formula for the effect of magic ACC, but we don't know for certain. Without this information, we cannot make credible statements about the best gear unless it's exceedingly obvious.

Actually, many BLU know how Blue Magic Skill and Magic Accuracy works in relation to each other. At the bare minimum, Blue Magic Skill works exactly like Elemental/Enfeebling/Dark Magic skill and what have you v.s resist.

Then from there, it works it's way into fSTR/DCaps (this is also the reason why Blue Mages never got skill over 307 for a very long time, and now at a 312 (314/317) cap) and Metallic Body/Diamondhide (like Enhancing Magic Skill) -- it seems they only wanted to raise effective 'Magicial' Blue Magic Skill without making DCap shoot upwards, so they gave us Magic Accuracy + on gear (and a certain relic pants).

Maybe one day, someone will sit down and quantify the effects of Magic Accuracy on each spell.

But yeah, back to AV >.>'

[Yugl]

Actually, many BLU know how Blue Magic Skill and Magic Accuracy works in relation to each other. At the bare minimum, Blue Magic Skill works exactly like Elemental/Enfeebling/Dark Magic skill and what have you v.s resist.

Then from there, it works it's way into fSTR/DCaps (this is also the reason why Blue Mages never got skill over 307 for a very long time, and now at a 312 (314/317) cap) and Metallic Body/Diamondhide (like Enhancing Magic Skill) -- it seems they only wanted to raise effective 'Magicial' Blue Magic Skill without making DCap shoot upwards, so they gave us Magic Accuracy + on gear (and a certain relic pants).

Maybe one day, someone will sit down and quantify the effects of Magic Accuracy on each spell.

But yeah, back to AV >.>'

Are you suggesting that each magic spell (Regurgitation, Mind Blast, and other spells) have a STR component as well?

[Kyte]

I think he was just talking about two different things at the same time (I.E. in the first section he was talking about how it affects magical spells, then talked about how it also affects actual damage potential for physicals in the second section).

[Sho]

Yeah, that's what I meant. Also Magic Accuracy effects the landing rate of Additional Effects from Physical Blue Magic, to a certain extent.

[Mahoro]

Has anyone actually TRIED the Holy-weakening-Meteor method for AV yet? Sure, the guy who posted it might be a confirmed troll, but the theory is juuuuuust sensible sounding enough to actually be plausible!

[Titanss]

Has anyone actually TRIED the Holy-weakening-Meteor method for AV yet? Sure, the guy who posted it might be a confirmed troll, but the theory is juuuuuust sensible sounding enough to actually be plausible!

Spoiler: show

http://i57.photobucket.com/albums/g2...7211223796.jpg

[Franzer]

obviously i think we've concluded the best way to beat av is to let the 10000 noobs with pld af1 bodies who only do campaign, with their newly acquired nocturnus gear to absorb meteors

[CoronA1979]

k, so.... back on topic
has anyone killed JoL where he spawns at, instead of killing him where he gets stuck?

If this is a serious question, then yes. It's been a long time ago though since my ls was around/killed it there but in the couple times we tried AV (pre zerg w/e nerf/rebuff) it still took a shit all over us.

It's been so long I can't obviously throw large details but we did indeed kill JoL every time in the exact spot it comes down from the sky at. Many, Many times.

[Ahkow]

obviously i think we've concluded the best way to beat av is to let the 10000 noobs with pld af1 bodies who only do campaign, with their newly acquired nocturnus gear to absorb meteors

well ... there was some jp shouting for 100 ninjas to
mijin gakure AV ... not sure what happened ... and yea 10000 noobs ninjas is the way man ..