Goodbye present - how to kill AV (before it's patched)

[TummieGaruda]

When it was first made they might have felt that way, but it can be killed now, has drops, has a title, and has a specific method needed in order to be practically killed. Btw the first kill did not drop anything, but players did receive a title, I was one of those.

I have no fucking clue what happened in the post above, no rational explanation for that actually, I simply quoted someone, typed, and submitted and it showed up with that.

My original post got messed up somehow. But basically in the link it talks about how they made AV to not be a final target, just something that randomly shows up and proceeds to be the everliving crap out of you.

[Ragnus]

I think the accomplishment is the wonderful feeling of being able to say "Look who got one shotted now" to the meteor spamming raep machine.

Personally I would love to see this pulled off at least once before this gets nerfed.

[Kyte]

A million blues won't work cause unlike PW, AV gains defense resistance considerably as his HP gets lower and the blues will be double weakened on top of that defense which might play a role in the cannonball against a high def target. PW is also weak to blunt damage, I would assume AV is strong to blunt damage.

Blue Magic damage is NOT lowered by any amount when weakened, which is the whole reason why it works so well against PW. Normal Aerns don't have a blunt resistance, so I doubt PW does either.

However, if PW gains actual damage resistance, then that's an entirely different story...

[Suiram]

The main issue with using a PW-style BLU strat on AV would be the unaggroed 10% HP recovery. PW doesn't have that, which is what makes the BLU thing easier to execute. AV is the opposite, not only will he regen normally but unlike most any other mobs in the game, DoTs (dia/bio) wear immediately once he's hate-free, meaning he'd have to be claimed under 10 seconds every time he goes white, and any slipup costs you 10%.

Also, once you get him below a certain % won't he automatically open with Meteor any time you tag him? If that's correct it would make it extremely difficult to keep people in range to keep tagging/Cannonballing him without dying prematurely.

[Virtuous Saint]

The main issue with using a PW-style BLU strat on AV would be the unaggroed 10% HP recovery. PW doesn't have that, which is what makes the BLU thing easier to execute. AV is the opposite, not only will he regen normally but unlike most any other mobs in the game, DoTs (dia/bio) wear immediately once he's hate-free, meaning he'd have to be claimed under 10 seconds every time he goes white, and any slipup costs you 10%.

Also, once you get him below a certain % won't he automatically open with Meteor any time you tag him? If that's correct it would make it extremely difficult to keep people in range to keep tagging/Cannonballing him without dying prematurely.

It doesn't open with Meteor ever, in fact Meteor is probably the exact same % as all of the other spells when it is placed on the spell list, but that is obviously unknown. Either AV or the wynavs would attack you to death before it casted.

[Virtuous Saint]

Blue Magic damage is NOT lowered by any amount when weakened, which is the whole reason why it works so well against PW. Normal Aerns don't have a blunt resistance, so I doubt PW does either.

However, if PW gains actual damage resistance, then that's an entirely different story...

Correct, PW has no +Blunt damage taken, it is all the same, and AV has no Blunt resistance, or anything for that matter.

[Suiram]

It doesn't open with Meteor ever, in fact Meteor is probably the exact same % as all of the other spells when it is placed on the spell list, but that is obviously unknown. Either AV or the wynavs would attack you to death before it casted.

Long time ago (wall-era) AV I fought got 2Hs back at 60% and wiped us a bit later, and meteored any time someone tried to tag it over at least a half-dozen attempts. Bad luck, long time ago, many patches, glitched, etc, it wouldn't even be relevant now, of course--except that someone (Kaeko maybe?) mentioned that after failed BW zergs (during the week that BW zerg worked) he exhibited that same meteor-on-pull behavior. So I'll take your word on this if you're certain I'm wrong, but how certain are you?

[Virtuous Saint]

Long time ago (wall-era) AV I fought got 2Hs back at 60% and wiped us a bit later, and meteored any time someone tried to tag it over at least a half-dozen attempts. Bad luck, long time ago, many patches, glitched, etc, it wouldn't even be relevant now, of course--except that someone (Kaeko maybe?) mentioned that after failed BW zergs (during the week that BW zerg worked) he exhibited that same meteor-on-pull behavior. So I'll take your word on this if you're certain I'm wrong, but how certain are you?

I'm not, I didn't mean to sound like I know everything with 100% certainty, but I've never known AV to cast immediately after it is claimed unless it has a 2hr that forces its AI to cast like chainspell or manafont. It could have been possible that when it got 2hrs back, however it did, it did Manafont>Chainspell combination or something and casted instantly for a bit? Truly I have no clue, but I have never seen that from AV.

[Suiram]

I'm not, I didn't mean to sound like I know everything with 100% certainty, but I've never known AV to cast immediately after it is claimed unless it has a 2hr that forces its AI to cast like chainspell or manafont. It could have been possible that when it got 2hrs back, however it did, it did Manafont>Chainspell combination or something and casted instantly for a bit? Truly I have no clue, but I have never seen that from AV.

After I made my post I went to Kaeko's blog to see if I was remembering right (although what I remember was a post here, but he's usually methodical about posting everything on his LJ, too) and this is what I found.

Typically, the ganking strategy is an "all or nothing" strategy. If you fail, you just give up and try again. The reasoning behind this is after you fail, if you try to repull and either restart or continue progress, AV is already fully into one of it's later modes, where it gets access to non-Manafont Meteors, increased 2hr frequency, and 2hr combos. The instant AV is pushed below 80%, that first mode switch hits and it gets free non-Manafont meteor. At this point, it's frivolous to restart as your gank will end almost immediately after engaging.

I bolded the important part. What's interesting is if you're right and I'm right, then what is it about Kclub zerg that would have had such an effect on Meteor frequency? Although that might be a discussion better suited for the other thread.

[The Blackrose]

Ladies and gentlemen, if you wish to avoid the banhammer, shape up or GTFO now. Only warning.

Christ, you compliment a thread and it turns into hell in a handbasket...

[Mizango]

Ladies and gentlemen, if you wish to avoid the banhammer, shape up or GTFO now. Only warning.

<3

[Titanss]

eh w/e

[Malacite]

Hah I thought about doing this and mentioned it to my LS way back when MV was added & got laughed at by my LS...

Seriously epic shit O.O; think SE will nerf it? I sure hope not

[Aksannyi]

You know how protective SE is of their baby...

[Kaisha]

Seriously epic shit O.O; think SE will nerf it? I sure hope not

They nerfed PUP's Magic Mortar regardless of it being just as much a bitch to set up to abuse, they'll nerf this also.

[dejet]

As for the blue thing cant you just have 18 blus RRing one at a time so that AoEs dont matter? I mean he does not agro so that means nothing if you just wait to RR

Its HP regain would be the thing stopping it if anything not the AoEs (for blue burn)

[Yugl]

I'm having trouble figuring out how people compare this to an exploit. Maybe it's just me, but I think what is and what isn't an exploit is quite clear in FFXI.

Edit: Suiram, if I remember correctly, AV's AI would lock up when using the Kraken method. So in essence, it's as if they locked AV's actions.

[Ivve]

I think the point is that it doesn't really matter whether or not it's an "exploit" as defined in the MMO world. SE has a track record of patching things they consider to be too powerful, even if they are actually operating as intended and no cheatery type actions are taking place. Can we please drop this portion of the discussion? It's really not achieving anything at all.

[Yugl]

Ok, I'll let you safe face it.

It's pointless to discuss whether SE will or will not patch a mechanic of the game because quite frankly, whether you're right or wrong means nothing until they actually fix it. Worry about what's in front of you now. Either do the MV tactic or don't, it's that simple. If SE happens to patch it before then, too bad. Nothing constructive can come out of this thread other than actual attempts using this strategy.

[urat]

I vote if this works so well we NEVER EVER EVER even TRY it on AV.

Cause then it'll get nerfed and we'll have lost a good burn method. As long as we kill everything but with it, I think we could get away with it.