Random Question Thread V: But does it 6-hit

[Thorny]

In a summoner burn, using a CFH'd mob that the holder has cast dispel/etc on a bit allows you to assault with no risk. Otherwise, if you try to BP while out of range, it has the effect of assaulting the avatar (and sometimes it's hard to tell the exact range with that many mobs there).

It's actually the opposite, BPing(from out of range still generates the same hate btw!) will generate a small amount of hate and being on the top of a mob's hate list will force your avatar to attack it in an attempt to protect you.

[Deader2818]

Hey, thanks for clearing it up.

[FailureMidgard]

It's actually the opposite, BPing(from out of range still generates the same hate btw!) will generate a small amount of hate and being on the top of a mob's hate list will force your avatar to attack it in an attempt to protect you.

Oh, I guess it could be defensive? but, it doesn't seem to happen if the BP is used in range...the BP just goes off, and everything ignores you exist still. It's very obvious when you do it once out of range, because you pull hate on every action within range from that point on.

[Thorny]

Oh, I guess it could be defensive? but, it doesn't seem to happen if the BP is used in range...the BP just goes off, and everything ignores you exist still. It's very obvious when you do it once out of range, because you pull hate on every action within range from that point on.

Really, how you see it depends what you're doing it on. I can say with 100% certainty that a BP generates the same hate whether out of range or not, and will only generate hate on the targetted mob.

It's most noticable if you're BPing a mob from out of range because a BP going off will essentially always generate enough hate to outdo the hate generated by readying it. If you never get to the top of hate list, avatar will never auto-assault. Hence, confusion.

[FailureMidgard]

Really, how you see it depends what you're doing it on. I can say with 100% certainty that a BP generates the same hate whether out of range or not, and will only generate hate on the targetted mob.

It's most noticable if you're BPing a mob from out of range because a BP going off will essentially always generate enough hate to outdo the hate generated by readying it. If you never get to the top of hate list, avatar will never auto-assault. Hence, confusion.

I think you're missing what I'm saying happens. You never get hit the time you try to use the BP.

1. Summon Avatar, hate free still.
2. Blood Pact, in or out of range. If you are out of range, the enemy turns and attacks the avatar. If in range, the avatar never gets attacked until -after- the BP goes off.
3. Summon next Avatar ~50 seconds later. If you are standing in range now, and you did an out of range BP previously, the mob you targeted will come attack you once (at which point the blood loss seems to make it turn back to the holder 100% of the time). If you were in range for every previous BP, this never happens.
4. The above is repeated every time you ready a BP, in range or not, if you ever once did one out of range, until that mob is killed.

Maybe I'm missing something, but this seems to be pretty exact from what I've seen/tested.

[Thorny]

1. Summon Avatar, hate free still.

Right.

2. Blood Pact, in or out of range. If you are out of range, the enemy turns and attacks the avatar. If in range, the avatar never gets attacked until -after- the BP goes off.

Are you talking about range for the BP to land or player's range? Player needs to be in hate range to ready a BP in the first place, as it's only got a 17' range to begin with.. so I can only assume you mean range to land it. Readying the BP gives the player hate not the avatar..

Spoiler: show

http://img40.imageshack.us/img40/590...5rolanberr.jpg

Example of in range. Note that since the avatar was preoccupied with the BP, it could not autoattack and intercept. The mob swung and missed at me before the BP went off with no prior hate generation.

Spoiler: show

http://img63.imageshack.us/img63/722...6rolanberr.jpg
http://img63.imageshack.us/img63/209...9rolanberr.jpg
http://img63.imageshack.us/img63/307...1rolanberr.jpg

Example of out of range. BP from too far away generates hate, on me. The avatar instantly moves to defend me, and intercepts the mob.

3. Summon next Avatar ~50 seconds later. If you are standing in range now, and you did an out of range BP previously, the mob you targeted will come attack you once (at which point the blood loss seems to make it turn back to the holder 100% of the time). If you were in range for every previous BP, this never happens.

I entirely lost you here. A resummoned avatar has no hate, can you clarify what you're trying to say?

4. The above is repeated every time you ready a BP, in range or not, if you ever once did one out of range, until that mob is killed.

Makes no sense until I understand part 3.

[FailureMidgard]

Right.


Are you talking about range for the BP to land or player's range? Player needs to be in hate range to ready a BP in the first place, as it's only got a 17' range to begin with.. so I can only assume you mean range to land it. Readying the BP gives the player hate not the avatar..


I entirely lost you here. A resummoned avatar has no hate, can you clarify what you're trying to say?


Makes no sense until I understand part 3.

Range for the BP to land, as in the Avatar tries to ready it, then it fails and your BPRage timer is reset.

And yes, the resummoned avatar has no hate, it's the difference between you being on the hate list, and you not being on the hate list. If you BP while your avatar is too far away, you are permanently placed on the mob's hate list, and the act of casting a summon generates enough hate for it to come smack you once. Though if you summon from far enough away, this part is skipped, and it just comes and hits you as soon as you ready a BP. If you've never once BPed with your avatar out of range, any hate you may have generated by activating the BP is seemingly wiped/ignored when the Avatar is killed.

[Thorny]

Check updated post, did a quick example on my rolanmule

For the hell of it, 2 character example of exactly what you're claiming:
http://img196.imageshack.us/g/200912...rolanberr.jpg/

And while I'm at it, demonstration of how it only effects target:
http://img706.imageshack.us/g/200912...rolanberr.jpg/

For the fourth time, readying a blood pact generates a set amount of hate, whether landed or too far away. The hate generation only applies to the target of the blood pact, and not other mobs when using AoE.

[FailureMidgard]

Check updated post, did a quick example on my rolanmule

For the hell of it, 2 character example of exactly what you're claiming:
http://img196.imageshack.us/g/200912...rolanberr.jpg/

And while I'm at it, demonstration of how it only effects target:
http://img706.imageshack.us/g/200912...rolanberr.jpg/

For the fourth time, readying a blood pact generates a set amount of hate, whether landed or too far away. The hate generation only applies to the target of the blood pact, and not other mobs when using AoE.

I've said the same on AoE since my first post. Do you have another suggestion as to why sometimes a summoner will be attacked, and sometimes they won't when burning?

[Xeres Celestia Highwind]

Here is one, Can you stack the same Evolith on 1 piece of gear (IE Ebon Coat, with x2 MAB vs. a species)

[Ezhno]

No, the second evolith will overwrite the slot you have the first same-type evolith in, regardless of whether or not the second is stronger or weaker than the first.

[Thorny]

I've said the same on AoE since my first post. Do you have another suggestion as to why sometimes a summoner will be attacked, and sometimes they won't when burning?

It depends on your strat. If you use a call-for-help monster and a puller casts dispel 10 times on it, it will never attack the summoner. If you use the resting and barspell method, the pullers often won't accumulate hate on all mobs because any action caps at 50 targets effected and barspells don't accumulate mass amounts of hate. In this case, the SMN could be choosing a mob that was not effected by the majority of the barspells and as a result only have to outhate a single resting click of hate. I highly recommend the former method anyway, and the only way SMN will be getting hit there is if they're idiotic enough to not BP the bright orange call-for-help target.

[Tsuko_Asura]

Yeah, the CFH method has never let me down, while there have been many a casualty using the alternative <_<

[Spyre]

whats the lowest amount of people you need to low man mother globe?

[Tsuko_Asura]

Two, BLU/NIN with a good magic build and RDM/NIN work best, IMO, but RDM/NIN + [SCH/BLM/RDM/BLU] works as well. Initial pull with anything but BLM or BLU in the mix is going to be very messy, though.

[Tulun]

Fast cast + haste:

You get the full benefit of Fast Cast if you start in it (speed + Recast time) right? So you could end in haste and double dip?

[drwaffles]

Fast cast + haste:

You get the full benefit of Fast Cast if you start in it (speed + Recast time) right? So you could end in haste and double dip?

This cannot be that fucking hard to understand.

ANY REDUCED CASTING TIME IS CALCULATED WHEN YOU START THE CAST

ANY REDUCED RECAST TIME IS CALCULATED AT THE CONCLUSION OF THE CAST

YOU NEED ANY GEAR THAT DOES EITHER OF THESE THINGS TO BE EQUIPPED AT THE TIME THAT THE BONUS IS CALCULATED

It's not like this is even illogical or complicated... it's intuitive and has been explained so many times.

[Tulun]

This cannot be that fucking hard to understand.

ANY REDUCED CASTING TIME IS CALCULATED WHEN YOU START THE CAST

ANY REDUCED RECAST TIME IS CALCULATED AT THE CONCLUSION OF THE CAST

YOU NEED ANY GEAR THAT DOES EITHER OF THESE THINGS TO BE EQUIPPED AT THE TIME THAT THE BONUS IS CALCULATED

It's not like this is even illogical or complicated... it's intuitive and has been explained so many times.

Cool story. No need to get pissy.

thanks for answering.

[Deader2818]

Any idea on repop of Aqrabuamelu?

[Xeres Celestia Highwind]

No, the second evolith will overwrite the slot you have the first same-type evolith in, regardless of whether or not the second is stronger or weaker than the first.

Thank you. What about MAB vs. Species and MAB with Certain Element?