Random Question Thread V: But does it 6-hit

[Lovex]

Ive heard stories and I just want to confirm.

I have never myself seen a raged KA.

Is King Arthros rage time 20 Minutes or 30 Minutes?

I know wikia says shit like cassie/serket are 20minutes. That's complete BS.
They are very clearly direct 30 minute rage timers.

Can someone say for sure if KA is indeed 20minutes or 30minutes?

We were hoping to duo on BLU and BRD with thf mule standing by for TH.


Thx

[Thorny]

Ive heard stories and I just want to confirm.

I have never myself seen a raged KA.

Is King Arthros rage time 20 Minutes or 30 Minutes?

I know wikia says shit like cassie/serket are 20minutes. That's complete BS.
They are very clearly direct 30 minute rage timers.

Can someone say for sure if KA is indeed 20minutes or 30minutes?

We were hoping to duo on BLU and BRD with thf mule standing by for TH.


Thx

It's 20 minutes. If you can't duo it on BLU and BRD in 20 minutes, delete your characters.

[Max™]

I'd think honestly if you knew how to navigate jungles, it'd be a nice spot to pull. I mean, you've got gobs, lizards, bees, crawlers, etc.

I could voke one mob through the hole you drop down to get to norg from the OP, run north for a bit to a certain point, loop back around east, run towards Kazham, drop down the tunnel that exits right outside of Kaz, run east and drop down the hole there, then run up to the far northeast nook on the map and wait for a train of damn near every Opo in Yuhtunga (guessing over 40) to catch me.

The times I had to turn around, monkeys just appeared out of the ground swinging at me for damn near a minute as I ran through the train, I have no idea how many it actually is. Couldn't see em all.

I could follow a more direct route to Kazham and get about 30 easily, from pull to burn would be the time I took to get from the OP to the zone + a few minutes for the train to detour around a couple spots.


Incidentally, I tested jailer weapons on jumps, work out the odds of 19 jumps and like 10 high jumps never taking a stone. It's like sub 0.01% I think Ruke said.

Tested with only 1 stone equipped, never meleeing, jumping mobs I didn't oneshot even with natural doubles + crits out in Rolanberry.

[Ripebear]

It's 20 minutes. If you can't duo it on BLU and BRD in 20 minutes, delete your characters.

Especially that BRD.

[Shinryuu]

If you have anything remotely resembling a real party (regardless of the situation) Jump and High Jump and Meditate are not at all a factor for Love vs. competition comparisons, due to the large amount of haste.

[seiji]

Love halberd: shits and giggles only, or does it have any practical use for SAM?

?

[tonystigma]

When going for an Erlking's Kheten, which zone should I do the fight in for augments?

Beaucedine Glacier (S)
DMG +3~6
STR +4
Attack +5~7
Double Attack+1
Additional Effect: Water Damage +12

Xarcabard (S)
DMG +4
Attack+5~8
Accuracy+4
Additional Effect: Stun +13

Grauberg (S)
DMG +3~6
STR +2~5
Attack +5~8
AGI +1~2
VIT +1~2
Double Attack+1~2
Additional Effect: Disease +5~9
Additional Effect: Earth Damage +13~
Additional Effect: Fire Damage +13~
Additional Effect: Flash +6
Additional Effect: Light Damage +13~18
Additional Effect: Paralysis +7~15
Additional Effect: Stun +1~9
Additional Effect: Water Damage +9~
Additional Effect: Slow +7~
+1~5 Resist Slow +1~3
Accuracy -2~

Jugner Forest (S)
DMG +3~6
STR +3~4
Attack +5
Additional Effect: Fire Damage +9
Additional Effect: Ice Damage +9
Additional Effect: Silence +5~11
Additional Effect: Disease +7

[Shinryuu]

Love Halberd is SAM's best polearm, and DRG's best if you don't count relic.

[Cream Soda]

Love Halberd is SAM's best polearm, and DRG's best if you don't count relic.

By how much?

I know it's faster in delay, but even w/ the 50% stone proc should take roughly the same number of attack rounds to 100 tp due to 5hit vs 7hit

[Yugl]

By how much?

I know it's faster in delay, but even w/ the 50% stone proc should take roughly the same number of attack rounds to 100 tp due to 5hit vs 7hit

I think the advantage is the speed at which you reach 100% TP (Double hits, not just delay) not the actual numbers of swings it takes to reach 100% TP. I too am interested in how much L Halb actually provides in terms of comparative damage though.

[Tsuko_Asura]

Isn't Fortitude Axe just -barely- better for warrior, while it allows you to keep your six-hit?

[Tsuko_Asura]

You get WS points for H2H even when Footwork is up on DK, right?

[Cream Soda]

You get WS points for H2H even when Footwork is up on DK, right?

Actually, I don't believe so. Since it's considered ws'ing w/ your feet slot, which isn't w/e weapon you're trying to break.

[Byrthnoth]

Love Halbred and Tomoe are close-ish, but Love Halbred probably wins for SAM especially if the +7 DEX on it falls in a convenient place.

Even with a 7-hit, Love Halbred WSs more frequently and it has about 25% higher DoT.

It takes 6 attack rounds to get to 100TP with a 7-hit. 6/1.5 = 4 rounds on average. 396 Delay.
It takes 4 attack rounds to get to 100TP with a 5-hit. So again, 4 rounds on average. 480 Delay. Tomoe WSs about 40% harder than Love Halbred.


Fort Axe (11.43DPS w/50% Twice rate) and Perdu Voulge (11.43 DPS) lack the DoT disparity, and that's why they're so much more comparable. I'm still not convinced Fort Axe is better than Perdu Voulge really.

[Thorny]

Fort Axe (11.43DPS w/50% Twice rate) and Perdu Voulge (11.43 DPS) lack the DoT disparity, and that's why they're so much more comparable. I'm still not convinced Fort Axe is better than Perdu Voulge really.

DPS is a terrible means of comparing weapons. Both fSTR and WS mods will benefit Fort Axe significantly more(unless you go noticably over fSTR cap for it, but not likely in most situations), which is where it pulls ahead. Too lazy to dig through PMs for the comparison I did, but fort won.

[FailureMidgard]

Love Halbred and Tomoe are close-ish, but Love Halbred probably wins for SAM especially if the +7 DEX on it falls in a convenient place.

Even with a 7-hit, Love Halbred WSs more frequently and it has about 25% higher DoT.

It takes 6 attack rounds to get to 100TP with a 7-hit. 6/1.5 = 4 rounds on average. 396 Delay.
It takes 4 attack rounds to get to 100TP with a 5-hit. So again, 4 rounds on average. 480 Delay. Tomoe WSs about 40% harder than Love Halbred.


Fort Axe (11.43DPS w/50% Twice rate) and Perdu Voulge (11.43 DPS) lack the DoT disparity, and that's why they're so much more comparable. I'm still not convinced Fort Axe is better than Perdu Voulge really.

How do Jailer weapons work with DA job trait? Because if it only procs when the Jailer weapon doesn't, you're looking at:

6hits with 58.5% DA vs 4hits with 17% DA. 3.78*396=1499 delay. 3.42*480=1641 delay. So you're looking at +25% tp dmg and +9% ws dmg vs +40% ws dmg using your other numbers? Love is most definitely losing atm, before counting loss of accuracy/attack from tomoe+ranged slot (even at 6 acc from 7 dex assuming perfect dex, you're losing accuracy even with a tiphia, not to mention btath). It's possible your +40% guess is off by a bit, but it'd have to be off by a lot for Love to win.

[Thorny]

How do Jailer weapons work with DA job trait? Because if it only procs when the Jailer weapon doesn't, you're looking at:

6hits with 58.5% DA vs 4hits with 17% DA. 3.78*396=1499 delay. 3.42*480=1641 delay. So you're looking at +25% tp dmg and +9% ws dmg vs +40% ws dmg using your other numbers? Love is most definitely losing atm, before counting loss of accuracy/attack from tomoe+ranged slot (even at 6 acc from 7 dex assuming perfect dex, you're losing accuracy even with a tiphia, not to mention btath). It's possible your +40% guess is off by a bit, but it'd have to be off by a lot for Love to win.

Unlike other multihits, DA stacks with jailer ones. You can triple attack with brutal and love halberd, for example.

[FailureMidgard]

Unlike other multihits, DA stacks with jailer ones. You can triple attack with brutal and love halberd, for example.

Alright, my bad, I'm not at home at the moment, but using Bryn's estimates, it's still leaving Love behind Tomoe. I suspect his #s are off, and Love is better than he is saying.

[Byrthnoth]

(394*480)/60 = 3152 Seconds common denominator
Love Halbred - D42981, 120 WSs (480=120*4 Attack rounds)
Tomoe - D33884, 99 WSs (396=99*4 Attack rounds)

Assuming the same gear for Tomoe and Love Halbred during Penta Thrust, and assuming ~+D32 from 20%STR/20%DEX (~+33 for Tomoe), Tomoe's base damage beats Love Halbred's by about 27%. Originally I just tossed out 40% because I wasn't factoring in the base stats/gear because I didn't want to try and make a Penta build for SAM. So 120 Love Halbred WSs would be worth about 94.5 Tomoe WSs.
Unless you assume that the extra 4.5 Tomoe Penta Thrusts and ~4 Acc/9 Atk difference (compared to the potential 0-7% increase in Crit rate) make up for the 25% difference in DOT, then Love Halbred is better. Don't people use Crab Sushi on lolibri now anyway?

If anything, my numbers show Love Halbred pretty much trouncing Tomoe. I don't account for over-TPing, which means that Love Halbred's WS frequency is actually lower than one would assume, but it's probably not going to make up the difference. We're talking about a 25% increase in DoT over ~11 minutes (near Haste cap) being made up for by a dozen or fewer WSs. Also, there's a pretty good chance that the DEX+7 on the Halbred is going to fall in the 40-50 range for a Polearm SAM/WAR vs. birds, meaning you're also looking at a substantial crit boost.

[FailureMidgard]

(394*480)/60 = 3152 Seconds common denominator
Love Halbred - D42981, 120 WSs (480=120*4 Attack rounds)
Tomoe - D33884, 99 WSs (396=99*4 Attack rounds)

Assuming the same gear for Tomoe and Love Halbred during Penta Thrust, and assuming ~+D32 from 20%STR/20%DEX (~+33 for Tomoe), Tomoe's base damage beats Love Halbred's by about 27%. Originally I just tossed out 40% because I wasn't factoring in the base stats/gear because I didn't want to try and make a Penta build for SAM. So 120 Love Halbred WSs would be worth about 94.5 Tomoe WSs.
Unless you assume that the extra 4.5 Tomoe Penta Thrusts and ~4 Acc/9 Atk difference (compared to the potential 0-7% increase in Crit rate) make up for the 25% difference in DOT, then Love Halbred is better. Don't people use Crab Sushi on lolibri now anyway?

If anything, my numbers show Love Halbred pretty much trouncing Tomoe. I don't account for over-TPing, which means that Love Halbred's WS frequency is actually lower than one would assume, but it's probably not going to make up the difference. We're talking about a 25% increase in DoT over ~11 minutes (near Haste cap) being made up for by a dozen or fewer WSs. Also, there's a pretty good chance that the DEX+7 on the Halbred is going to fall in the 40-50 range for a Polearm SAM/WAR vs. birds, meaning you're also looking at a substantial crit boost.

Meditate is +42 wses for each (actually, it's +42 for Tomoe, it's less than +42 for Love), so 162 vs 141. Assuming the +27%, we're looking at 141*1.27 is equivalent to 179 WSes from Love, which is 17 WSes over Love. Your damage #s are off by 9k at the moment for autoswing damage (pre attack though?)? And as you said, this is before accounting for redundant TP. Even at a 2.0 multiplier on that, you're looking at 18k damage needing to be made up by 17 WSes worst case scenario for Love...probably going to be a difference closer to ~35 WSes).

As for sushi, I use it, and with all my gear, 4 pole merits, and Black Tathlum, I'm like 2 acc past cap on the higher level birds. In any case, if you really want dex, you're dropping 9 acc and 9 attack for 6 dex, may as well drop 7 acc for 5 dex on ring.

Also, that's a 52minute session, not 11. You're giving Love a benefit at every twist and turn to come up with your conclusion (ignoring overflow, ignoring meditate, assuming acc cap, ignoring atttack).