Joining the Military

[Abandon]

Enlisted life is not as bad as some people make it out to be; that mostly depends on what you do. Some people (speaking on Navy life as that's what I know) get stuck in deck division, mopping every deck in sight and painting for sometimes no reason other than to keep you busy.

It's also true that yes, there are a lot of shitbags in the military; people who couldn't cut it in real life situations and needed to be somewhere to get some discipline in order to live a somewhat decent life.

But for all of the typical stories you hear about the negativity of military life, you'd be surprised at how many people in the military do just fine, even in the enlisted ranks. People who put up a decent ASVAB score get pretty much jobs of their choice that advance quickly, get choice of orders (and therefore choice of where they want to live), and good pay.

Not all enlisted people are riffraff. Some simply don't want to go officer because the type of work done between officer and enlisted are completely different, and some people simply do not want to make a living doing paperwork. Some people prefer to work with their hands and enjoy their craft.

Myself, for instance. I went to college, first at the University of North Texas, then transferred to UT, and graduated with my bachelors in classical performance in music on 3 different instruments. I left college with the intention of joining the Navy band, and decided to instead dabble in the nuclear field. Things didn't work out there due to 1) the school being hard as shit, and 2) getting in trouble with alcohol. I left there and was stationed at the Naval Academy, and now plan to head to the submarine community as a Fire Control Technician, headed to Hawaii.

I have nothing against going to school, getting a degree and getting a job. But for some people, that is simply not an option, and they deserve every opportunity to earn a decent living and do something other than work third shift at Waffle House. Why not be happy with someone's decision to try to make something out of their life? Or the people that grow up, and plan from childhood to join the military, why hold it against them?


As far as family life goes, it is indeed hard. I know of many marriages that have been ruined because of one, or both, in the marriage are away and don't learn to cope with the other being away so much. Cheating is rampant and I know of quite a few people who cheat, quite often in some cases. But just like any other career choice, people who want to cheat, WILL CHEAT. Shit happens, it's sad, but it's also life. I'm rambling, a long night of wings, beer and college football.

[Neosutra]

Did all the questions get answered?

Have been in the field for the last week, and going back for another couple weeks soon, then back over to Afghan.

Either way, here is my 2 cents:

Ive been an NCO (enlisted) and am now an officer (10 years in now). Conformity touched on a lot of the problems in today's military, and they are all true. The military (any branch) isnt a job, it is complete ownage of your life. People who could not have succeeded elsewhere in life, are lower educated, or need that extra drive find a good fit in the military. Unfortunately that is why you get a lot of the bottom of the barrel people that Conformity is talking about. Any intelligent/educated person will find themselves wanting to gouge their eyes out as an enlisted person (and even as an officer sometimes... try being a quantum physicist around a bunch of criminal justice majors).

However, there are good sides:

The military is economy proof.
You can retire at 38-40 years old with full medical benefits and a decent check depending on rank.
You get free college anywhere and get paid to go to college (the programs they have now are fucking amazing).
It will challenge you, shape you, and redefine the person you are (even with people like Conformity that hated it, it taught them what they dont need to put up with). Myself, I learn a lot of what "not" to do, and how to deal with a variety of people in stressful environments.

Some of the bad things however, as Conformity said:

You will never find a job in the civilian world that will work you as hard or as long as the military works you (specifically army, marines). I work an average of 17 hours a day in the army, with blood, sweat, and tears (tears of my enemies, I dont cry motherfucker). Not to mention, even as an officer you will feel less like a human being in the military that if you worked at McDonalds night shift.

You will get deployed, two to three, to four times in your career. Airforce generally doesnt deploy much, but when they do it is usually only 3 months, occasionally 6 months for specific MOSs, and you get a pretty good lifestyle when you do deploy. Marines have harder deployments, but only for 6 months. Army gets 1-2 year deployments and pretty harsh ones.

Your wife will cheat. There is no debating this. Just hope you planned a head and showed her where you would bury her if she steals all your money and sends you a tape of her fucking the neighbor. If you want to do the military, dont get married, just bang the women around you (another reason to join the airforce, the army doesnt have women, just men in female uniforms).

You will go through times of deep depression, post traumatic stress disorder, divorce, potentially lose a limb, get wounded, or die (more so in army/marines). Hope you are lucky enough to just get a bit depressed.

All in all, as I said in the last thread: If I had to do it again, I wouldnt join the army. However, I wouldnt be the person I am today without it (who knows if that is a good thing or not). Ive gotten a few good career boosts from the military, and some good training/leadership ability. It has put a tremendous amount of stress on my marriage and I can just hope it makes it through this next deployment.

If you do decide to join the military, go Airforce. No other branch takes care of their people like the Airforce. It literally is a different military experience. Also, if you can, get college done and do the officer path, you will enjoy life more and your career will have a lot more options.

Good luck in your decision.

[Crisco]

You know what...I wrote out a whole spiel but deleted it. All I can say is just expect out of it what you put in. If you go into the military with a negative mentality, you'll hate every minute of it. But if you go in looking to become a better person, both physically and mentally, you will never regret it. I joined for many reasons, one being college, and I enjoyed the shit out of my 4 years. I'd still be in the marines if it wasn't for Iraq. Anyway, there's nothing better than spending 4 years traveling the world and meeting the likes of people you wouldn't have any exposure to in the US. That and being airborne is fucking awesome.

So do what you want, but don't join for the wrong reasons.

ps. In WI, TX, and some other states...you get PAID to go to college

5) blah...First they come from a shitty gene pool...blah

There are a lot of intelligent and happily married people in the military. Sure, you have to sift through all the people that aren't smart enough to do anything but basic grunt work, and the average marriage in the military only lasts 1-2 years before divorce, but that's still not enough to make such a generalization. Your view must be within the context of a really shitty unit/base/ w/e.

[Crisco]

Did all the questions get answered?

Also, if you can, get college done and do the officer path, you will enjoy life more and your career will have a lot more options.

Good luck in your decision.

Just don't be that chump-out-of-college officer that nobody respects. I always preferred officers who did enlisted time. They were able to see both sides of the coin and life for the enlisted was better under their command.

[Abandon]

Just don't be that chump-out-of-college officer that nobody respects. I always preferred officers who did enlisted time. They were able to see both sides of the coin and life for the enlisted was better under their command.

This, a hundred times over. The kids I get at the academy are fucking morons and will be hated on their first few ships, lol, and there's little we can do to change how they react with their people due to how much time they DON'T spend with the enlisted people here. My favorites have always been t he prior enlisted.

[Kryssan]

Myself, for instance. I went to college, first at the University of North Texas, then transferred to UT, and graduated with my bachelors in classical performance in music on 3 different instruments. I left college with the intention of joining the Navy band, and decided to instead dabble in the nuclear field. Things didn't work out there due to 1) the school being hard as shit, and 2) getting in trouble with alcohol. I left there and was stationed at the Naval Academy, and now plan to head to the submarine community as a Fire Control Technician, headed to Hawaii.

Nuke waste! lol just kidding mate. But the public at large wants to know - do you glow green?

The military is economy proof.
You can retire at 38-40 years old with full medical benefits and a decent check depending on rank.
You get free college anywhere and get paid to go to college (the programs they have now are fucking amazing).
It will challenge you, shape you, and redefine the person you are (even with people like Conformity that hated it, it taught them what they dont need to put up with). Myself, I learn a lot of what "not" to do, and how to deal with a variety of people in stressful environments.

I see your statements and raise you that the Navy is considering cancelling SRB and removing several special duty pay allowances. These decisions coming on the heels of having SRBs suspended for a large portion of last year and the Navy being unable to assign orders to personnel due to lack of funding. It is not economy proof. That being said, you are at least guaranteed to not get fired no matter how big a douche you are unless you get caught being illegal in some fashion - and even then it really depends on what you did.

Your wife will cheat. There is no debating this. Just hope you planned a head and showed her where you would bury her if she steals all your money and sends you a tape of her fucking the neighbor. If you want to do the military, dont get married, just bang the women around you (another reason to join the airforce, the army doesnt have women, just men in female uniforms).

Oh the stories I have...

If you do decide to join the military, go Airforce. No other branch takes care of their people like the Airforce. It literally is a different military experience. Also, if you can, get college done and do the officer path, you will enjoy life more and your career will have a lot more options.

Good luck in your decision.

I agree. USAF in my experiences with the military takes the best care of its people, hence our joking about their bases that I referred to earlier. There is a reason USAF personnel receive a stipend if they have to stay in Navy housing. (This is because the USAF considers a majority of USN housing to be sub-standard... and hey, they're right!)

This, a hundred times over. The kids I get at the academy are fucking morons and will be hated on their first few ships, lol, and there's little we can do to change how they react with their people due to how much time they DON'T spend with the enlisted people here. My favorites have always been t he prior enlisted.

Nothing a 4" firehose and a few minutes of alone time in the bilge won't fix. Or a couple hours taped in some immaculate fashion to large equipment that preferably rotates... I mean, there is no hazing in the military. None at all. I would never condone such action. Publically.

[Cantih]

Nuke waste! lol just kidding mate. But the public at large wants to know - do you glow green?

This reminds me. Read something about some guys that put a pinup poster in the engine in such a way, that by the end of the run, it had to be removed as hazardous material.

[Neosutra]

Ya, I'll echo the sentiment about officers that were enlisted first making the best commanders, it has helped me tremendously in my commissioned years.

And by the way, I didnt mean to rag on enlisted personnel, I just was unhappy as an enlisted member. It wasnt that I didnt enjoy the work, it was just the constant frustration of knowing you are smarter than the people above you making all of your decisions for you. As an officer, I still /facepalm at some of the decisions my superiors make, but I can at least filter some of that bullshit before it gets to my troops.

Also, if you want to go enlisted first and get some of that helpful college money, there are a lot of "green to gold" programs that will pay you to go to college (full military salary for 4 years to just go to class..).

[Abandon]

No offense taken, Neo. Good to know I'm not the only military person around, to be honest.

As far as the nuke questions, no, I don't glow. Fun fact of the day: You receive more radiation sitting outside playing football on a random weekend day than you do working in the reactor compartments due to the shielding.

Also, back to Neo. Ah, yes, the boatswain's locker meetings. I got my ass kicked by 4 E-5s for mouthing off, and I've also beat the brakes off a first class who decided it was okay to call me a nigger to try and put me in my place. But that shit doesn't actually happen... at least nobody finds out about it.


*edit*

Sir.

[Effluo]

If you're going to join the military, make sure it is a decision you can live with for the next 4 or so years. Many jobs in the military require a minimum 4 year commitment, and some of the more advanced ones require 6 years. As some have said, the Airforce will by far treat you the best and they also have quite a few advanced schools that could be beneficial when you get out. Personally, I went Navy as bit of family tradition.

I did not have many options after graduating. I didn't have much interest in college at the time, and didn't want to spend my times working at either a) a handful of fast food joints b) the local grocery store or c) the plastics mfg plant. For me, it was a way to get out and do something. I ended up with a job completely out of what I was hoping for, but it all panned out in the end. Nothing like wanting to be a Cryptographer and ending up being an Admin bitch. (They wanted me to be a nuke, but I told them fuck off, maybe that's why I ended up a Yeoman) But, I made sure to bust my ass at every chance I had, and ended up being hand picked to do my first tour at the Pentagon. I busted my ass everyday of my tour there, and it was an awesome experience, but also made me realize I could never stay in the DC area.

Yea, I ended up with the cliche wife who cheated on me, ran home to MI and all that. But in the end I married a Navy chick, and well, that was 8 years ago.

No matter where you go, there will be that officer who's a complete fucktard, and well, you just gotta deal. Many of the cooler Os are prior enlisted. Hell, the second Admiral I worked for started his career as an E-3, and retired as an O-7. He was good people.

There are many programs that will get you from Enlisted to Officer if you want to go that route. When I got out of the Navy, the Army was accepting E-5 and above to become Warrant Officers and make them Helo pilots. Too bad my eye sight sucks.

Really think about the decision to join the military. Cause once you're in, that is till the end of your enlistment. IF you think you can just be a fuck up and get out, you're going to limit your possibilities in the future.

AND WHATEVER YOU DO DON'T LET THE FUCKING RECRUITERS LIE TO YOU!!!

[Abandon]

Yes. Recruiters lie. Meeting quotas, etc

[Darkdreamer]

Some interesting replies here. Well here's my 2 cents. I spent 7 years in the military (Air Force). I've been around the world, I've had more than my fair share of trips to the sand box. I met some amazing people, and I've met some amazing douchebags.

This will be a life altering experience if you do decide to join the military. Now if it's altering for the good or bad is debatable and you're going to see people argue for and against joining.

Now doing it because you want to do your part and feel all patriotic is all well and good on paper but unless you piss and shit red, white, and blue that logic is going to fail you pretty damn fast especially if you get a bad job, assignment, supervisor, deployment, etc, etc. I'd honestly suggest doing it for another reason (nothing going for you job wise in your life and you're on your way to being homeless, you want to go to college but can't afford it, you live in some shit hole corner of the country and you want a better life for yourself that you're never going to get there).

This isn't a 9-5 job, it is really a way of life. You can easily get called up at 4 am and told to get your ass on a plane and be flying to some shit hole of the world by 8. Hell I had a paper pushers job (hooray for high ASVAB scores) and I worked the 8-5 job, but I still got that 4 am wake up call and I still went to shit hole countries that barely had electricity, let alone toilets.

As for the weight thing brought up. You will need to meet the maximum weight standards for your heigth (at least in the AF). If you're 5'11" your weight max will be like 195ish. I was 6'5" and my weight maximum was like 220ish. I went to leave for basic and they weighed me before we bused out and I was 1 pound over my max and they sent my ass back home and I didn't get another chance to leave for another 2 months. Weight is a huge issue, especially in the Air Force right now. They needed a way to get rid of people and they went full force with weight and fitness and a lot of really good people got kicked out.

There is also another bright side. Depending on your job you can get a great deal of civilian job training. My example is I did a paper pushers job which I never thought would get me anywhere. But now with only a HS diploma I'm making $80K a year doing a job easier than what I did in the military and I have time to make these long ass walls of text on BG.

And I can agree with everyone else on the fact of recruiters lie. They will lie their ass off to get you to sign your life away. They all have quotas, don't believe the bullshit. NOTHING is guaranteed unless it's in writing on the contract you sign when you join. If waiting an extra couple months to get a job you will want to do then wait.

On the topic of being an officer. Yeah if you can do it, go for it. You make shit loads more money and a lot of the "responsibilities" are fucking jokes. You are held to a much higher standard, but you can make some nice bank.

As for branch, I am biased to Air Force. We usually get nicer lodging and food facilities when deployed. It's strict but not nearly as much as say the Army and Marines. Coast Guard is definitely a weekend warrior type choice. The Navy, well my brother has been in the Navy for about 16 years now. He is out on 6 month boat rides damn near once a year and has been every year he's been in. He has missed a lot of his 2 daughters growing up.

tl;dr

Don't join cause you want to "do your part". Recruiters lie. Being fat in the military is a pain in the ass. Military owns your ass, and they will always gets theirs in the end even if that means fucking you up the ass with no lube.

[Shenrien]

Yes. Recruiters lie. Meeting quotas, etc

I know this for fact, back when I was 18, a recruiter wanted me to join badly and I almost bought into it, but I choose not to go because I realized that I can pay for my own college, and that once I'm out of classes and when I'm done with all the surgery's and shit that I need on my lower back then I'll be set.

I've got 1 more year of schooling then its off to do something in the name of Science! or.. out in the field to play with Electricity all day.

[Arrmani]

Well I was going to ask questions about ROTC, but it seems like nobody likes officers from that. Has anyone here actually gone through with it? I do work study with a guy in ROTC and he likes it, but he decided on military before coming to college. I've been thinking about it because school really bores me and I don't feel like paying for it and doing it for another 2 and a half years. I know military is much longer than that, but it seems like good training and will help with getting a job when you get out.

[Pabst]

it was just the constant frustration of knowing you are smarter than the people above you making all of your decisions for you.

Been out of the navy for 5 years now and this is all I remember from time served. I was a Gunnersmate 2nd class on DDG. The 5'' gun mount captain and god dam I hated talking to my WEPS officer cause he really didn't know shit.

[Abandon]

PBR sucks.

But you have a point. Nothing infuriates an intelligent sailor more than having an officer, dumb as fucking bricks, try to get you to do something you know damn well you have no business doing.

[Effluo]

I enjoy being able to call in sick now without having to worry about Sick Call and all that SIQ BS. I also enjoy being able to tell my boss to fuck off, i'm not doing it type shit, giving him the occasional one finger salute, and telling him I'll kick his ass if he doesn't get shit right. I can call a dumbass a dumbass and not have to worry about NJP or Court Martial anymore, hah!

Oh, and facial hair. I damn near didn't shave for a month after i was discharged.

But, it was probably the best decision for me. Have never regreted my choice, and I enjoy telling what few war stories I have lol.

[Conformity]

I enjoy being able to call in sick now without having to worry about Sick Call and all that SIQ BS. I also enjoy being able to tell my boss to fuck off, i'm not doing it type shit, giving him the occasional one finger salute, and telling him I'll kick his ass if he doesn't get shit right. I can call a dumbass a dumbass and not have to worry about NJP or Court Martial anymore, hah!

Oh, and facial hair. I damn near didn't shave for a month after i was discharged.

But, it was probably the best decision for me. Have never regreted my choice, and I enjoy telling what few war stories I have lol.

Remind me of me when I first got out

[Phey]

E-5 was the worst rank ever.... Granted I was a SSgt for a total of 7 months before my DoS. E-4 is the best rank ever, you are high enough to not get the shitty jobs but just low enough to not get the shitty supervisor shit.

On another note your shops/places of work were way too strict if you weren't able to tell your boss to fuck off. I was telling E-6's and E-7's what I felt after about a year or so in my shop. Although they never listened to me =/

[Conformity]

Im guessing you were S-1