Bard: Chr vs Skill vs Macc?

[Asmoranomar]

Stuff

Again - why are people reading out of context? Fuck. I even addressed the issue of when to pick between skill and CHR (albeit briefly). The goal is to NOT exceed the desired dCHR cap (I even said that). No one is saying to blindly stack CHR - In fact, it was said MANY times not to (I even referenced the days BRD's wore CHR over skill for crying out loud). Other people already covered the issues on deciding Skill vs CHR vs MACC in the same slot (or slots) - I didn't feel the need to cover it yet again (Infact YOU even said it, just to say it again later).

On a side note: Not all of my debuff builds reach 120 CHR. So its not like you *have* to hit it or your worthless. I'm well aware of what is required, and balancing CHR between Skill/MACC is always a consideration whenever I had obtained a new piece of equipment. I like your example, but it would be notable to include that not all gear choices should always be done between same-slot pieces. Sometimes it might be worthwhile to pick a 'weaker' piece and make up for it in another slot - all the while balancing dCHR in the process.

Other than that, everything else is a genuine recap of what was already said.

Also - Kaeko later posted that while it was originally thought sing > wind, later testing and review determined that this was not necessarily the case. It was put in the comments later on.

[Lahan]

I do not know if you would call it a weaker piece, But I like my pipers torque over the wind torque.

I think some people read it as the stats cap at 120 but they do not, that may be where some confusion is coming in.

[barber2006]

Again - The goal is to NOT exceed the desired dCHR cap (I even said that).

Sometimes it might be worthwhile to pick a 'weaker' piece and make up for it in another slot - all the while balancing dCHR in the process.

Nope. The goal is to build your debuff set to give you the most overall macc.

Even if you have 200 CHR Bard's Roundlet (5 CHR, 5 singing skill) would be better than demon's helm +1 (6 singing skill) even though you have gone over 'the desired dCHR cap'. THERE IS NO CAP!*** There is a point where CHR (or INT or MND) gets less effective (giving .5 macc instead of 1 macc), but this 'cap' does not exist. If they ever come out with a hand armor that gives 30 CHR your af+1 will ALWAYS be second best even if you are over the 'cap'.



No, it's never ok to pick the 'weaker' piece. Rdm might choose 5 mnd over 7 enfeebling for potency reasons. But for a job whose debuffs are of a static potency you should always choose the 'best' piece.




***Again, assuming the model for enfeebling and elemental resists is used in the brd debuff formula.

[Asmoranomar]

Meh, Maybe we are just confused between 'absolute magical accuracy' and that magic accuracy where your hitting low/high end caps and level difference functions. Either that or we aren't taking full consideration of what was said previously - Last time, I said 'at the cost of other (CHR)/Skill/MACC gear' Anyways, I think we are trying to say the same thing. It's just a hassle to repeat things like "Dont stack CHR" or "With appropriate gear" or the relationship between magical accuracy and CHR pre/post dCHR when it was already covered multiple times previously.

Anyways, there has definitely been situations where I've opted to trade off certain pieces of gear for others to obtain a better build. I vaguely remember a time after I obtained Astute and replaced Jesters+1, and recycled other CHR pieces back into my build due to having a lower CHR total - all from the standpoint of a 120 CHR cap/limit/whatever of course. I wish I remembered what I had swapped, but that was a while ago. But that was my point on that - Instead of focusing on tit-for-tat swaps, examining the build as a whole. You know this too, as you said 'most overall macc' - I was just hoping you would have used different slot equipment to show an example of this.

[pchan]

To answer a previous question (not yours, but I'm too tired to find it now), 120 isn't a randomly pulled number. It's the high-stat cutoff for RoZ and CoP NM's (Gods, Kings, etc). .

It is a random number, you can't determine what CHR a NM has so yeah... Even for BLM nukes it's random, not only because not many NM have more than 100+ INT, but also because for those few NM (Jormurgand : 120 INT) you actually "want" 130 INT (not 120) to maximize magic accuracy from INT, and finally because such a high INT build is necessarely done at the cost of Macc gear.