What's Better?

[Vodou]

Err... I think you read what I said backwards? I think Soboro/Yoichi is better than Amano anywhere that you don't have huge RAcc issues with Namas.

This is confusing.

When I compare a Sam using Soboro and no food to one using Namas and no food, the racc dwarfs the acc.

I tend to think that:

Soboro/Yoichi is better than Amano anywhere that you don't have huge acc issues with Soboro.

Clarify?

[Byrthnoth]

Ah, I forgot Namas' massive RAcc boost. Yeah, I don't know where Amano would be better than Soboro/Yoichi then. Maybe in cases of extreme monster defense or evasion? Ironically, cases of extreme monster DEF are where people start advocating Hagun use over Amano, if memory serves.

Take an Amano SAM, give it 2/3 the DoT but double the WS frequency and reduce the cRatio level correction. Then make it so it pretty much never pulls hate. I don't see how that wouldn't win most of the time.

[Vodou]

Ah, I forgot Namas' massive RAcc boost. Yeah, I don't know where Amano would be better than Soboro/Yoichi then. Maybe in cases of extreme monster defense or evasion? Ironically, cases of extreme monster DEF are where people start advocating Hagun use over Amano, if memory serves.

Take an Amano SAM, give it 2/3 the DoT but double the WS frequency and reduce the cRatio level correction. Then make it so it pretty much never pulls hate. I don't see how that wouldn't win most of the time.

I think this is coming full circle.

At lower evasions, where Soboro can land with meat, Namas not only is capped but is getting an attack boost. This makes it superior and even matches well with rngs average ranged damage.

At higher evasions where food has to swap to pizza, if soboro acc is still capped, it does not hurt the dot compared to amano, but does hurt the ranged damage. Not so much as to change the rankings. (Maybe a lot closer? Likely not.)

At even higher evasions, where acc is uncapped for soboro (and Hagun), but not amano, the use of food with no ranged attack still hurts, and the DoT is being hurt. Do the rankings change, I don't know. Namas racc is still very high or capped, but ratt is lower.

At some point, if evasion goes higher, rngs ability to use pot and stand at 18' while sams are using sushi and still missing, likely changes the overall ranking.

Just a thought, but haven't had coffee, so I'm not making the case.

My guess is, mobs with evasions over 500-510, that spam AOE stuns amnesia, terrrors, damage etc are where a lot of these changes happen.

[Greg]

Elvaan RNG q's:
Archery is fully merited.
Hope torque or gorget for ws? For tp?
Scouts belt or buccaneer's belt for ws? For tp?
Mirke with +10 RA or osode for ws?
CFG or S. Kote for ws?
Fay Gendawa with +3 str, RA+16 and ws dmg+3% or Ebow?

[Chen]

answer the PM you willy!

use scouts for both
osode for the ws, the rest idk.

[Marcicus]

For EXPing PLD past 65:

Shield Torque vs Peacock Charm

[Greg]

Im no PLD but for xp I'd say PCC all the way, except for maybe an oshit moment, then you'll want the torque.

[Yarko]

Ok well, done the maths. Namas SAM does come ahead in both HNMs and "merits" mobs, but only marginally (5%) compared to Amano SAM. Annihilator and Yoichi fall behind by about 25% on HNMs compared to Namas SAM (by about 35% on merit mobs/limbus/einherjar, but I didn't plan on using RNG in those situations anyway), and annihilator is only slightly better than Yoichi, the difference is not as big as I thought. So yeah, going for Yoichi.


Excel file with the maths: http://rapidshare.com/files/326764728/DDs.xlsx.html
did not take into account crits
Buffs for SAM: haste, march, min
Buffs for RNG: double min

[Aero]

For RNG in merits you either have to assume they're using Slugwinder or have a KC which I dont think you took into account.

[Fottiti]

Ok well, done the maths. Namas SAM does come ahead in both HNMs and "merits" mobs, but only marginally (5%) compared to Amano SAM. Annihilator and Yoichi fall behind by about 25% on HNMs compared to Namas SAM (by about 35% on merit mobs/limbus/einherjar, but I didn't plan on using RNG in those situations anyway), and annihilator is only slightly better than Yoichi, the difference is not as big as I thought. So yeah, going for Yoichi.


Excel file with the maths: http://rapidshare.com/files/326764728/DDs.xlsx.html
did not take into account crits
Buffs for SAM: haste, march, min
Buffs for RNG: double min

I can't look at the spreadsheet right now but if you are counting Hasso for SAM then 2x march will almost always be better than march/minuet.

As for merit mobs there was never going to be a vast difference between Amano and Yoichi, but Yoichi has the piercing bonus on birds and if you are fighting mamools then fulltiming hasso on everything wouldn't be an issue (yes I know you can fulltime hasso in merits/ein/limbus but its usually wise to put up seigan rather than risk dying to fang rush/sickle slash/etc).

[Aero]

I can't look at the spreadsheet right now but if you are counting Hasso for SAM then 2x march will almost always be better than march/minuet.

As for merit mobs there was never going to be a vast difference between Amano and Yoichi, but Yoichi has the piercing bonus on birds and if you are fighting mamools then fulltiming hasso on everything wouldn't be an issue (yes I know you can fulltime hasso in merits/ein/limbus but its usually wise to put up seigan rather than risk dying to fang rush/sickle slash/etc).

SAM With Yochi should always be fulltiming hasso as Soboros DoT alone should not be enough to pull hate off another DD worth his weight.

[Fottiti]

SAM With Yochi should always be fulltiming hasso as Soboros DoT alone should not be enough to pull hate off another DD worth his weight.

Learn to read, I said that yoichi sam would be able to fulltime hasso without any potential risk (if you are with other decent DDs) whereas Amano couldn't because you will have hate against targets with dangerous tp moves.

[Aero]

Learn to read, I said that yoichi sam would be able to fulltime hasso without any potential risk (if you are with other decent DDs) whereas Amano couldn't because you will have hate against targets with dangerous tp moves.

Learn to express your ideas clearly? At no time in that sentence did you elude that that thought was meant for Amano as you were talking about Yochi.

[Khajit]

B haidate vs Usu pants for penta.
I seem to have ~25 acc over my target acc for birds with crab sushi. I'm pretty sure the Usu wins at this point but it would be nice to have confirmation. Or perhaps it changes whether or not zerk is up?

[Fottiti]

Learn to express your ideas clearly? At no time in that sentence did you elude that that thought was meant for Amano as you were talking about Yochi.

Learn to think before you post, if you read as its written then the sentance structure alone implies I am still referring to Yoichi.

Oh and the word you are looking for is allude.

[Wulfgang]

Oh and the word you are looking for is allude.

Thought evaded!

[mdkuser]

B haidate vs Usu pants for penta.
I seem to have ~25 acc over my target acc for birds with crab sushi. I'm pretty sure the Usu wins at this point but it would be nice to have confirmation. Or perhaps it changes whether or not zerk is up?

usukane is better for pure damage.

[Callisto]

Working on DRK to 75 but I had some Q's, first merits...I was assuming something along the lines of:

5 Souleater Recast
5 Last Resort Recast
5 Diabolic Eye
4 Desperate Blows
1 Dark Seal

Would there be a better setup? I'm not sure how much difference DB actually makes in regular merit situations so idk if it's really worth capping it.

Second is weapon, Moliones's set was relatively cheap so I grabbed it to ding into already, but I was wondering how it'd compare to Perdu + Lava's/Kushaw/e's Rings, since I'll have no room for Scythe merits and I think I'll only be able to muster about 388 Acc unbuffed with Moliones's and 395 with Perdu, but I know the base D dropoff would be pretty sizeable vs. the 20 Attack gain, and with Diabolic Eye or Abs-Acc up I'd probably be using Blitz which would drop 6 attack from breaking the Mandy ring combo.

[Midnightjade]

What's the most useful piece of AF+1 for a WHM arriving at 75, assuming otherwise average gear (Noble's, Blessed, full Goliard)? It looks like Briault, just want to check I'm not missing something.

Thanks. I have the Apollyon and Temenos WHM items from years ago and am currently leveling the job. I no longer do Limbus and have no plans to run Salvage or Dynamis for WHM at this late stage in my career.

[Callisto]

Hands. At least in terms of straight Cure strength/-Enmity mix. Body is a good resting piece but Enfeebling skill is meh to me, Divine is important for Repose but there aren't that many situations where a 75 WHM is actively debuffing. It's worth having a set for when you do, but not worth prioritizing AF+1 for it.