What's Better?

[matix]

The point was: it's a better option then killing your self/losing exp/ being weak with a ahigh possibly of re-dying nerfing your ranged accuracy comeplety for 5 more minutes, when you clearly can just do much smarter things,

losing exp is not a concern of mine, and shouldn't be to most people, esp with how easy it is to be capped, it takes no more than 20sec to die, get back up, pop a food, and start shooting again.

sans relic proc barrage, there is an almost non-existant chance you'll be pulling hate within 5mins of dying, assuming you have some half decent tanks, additionaly, you could also take it easy while your single weak if your concerned about dying again

[Shin Volcano]

losing exp is not a concern of mine, and shouldn't be to most people, esp with how easy it is to be capped, it takes no more than 20sec to die, get back up, pop a food, and start shooting again.

sans relic proc barrage, there is an almost non-existant chance you'll be pulling hate within 5mins of dying, assuming you have some half decent tanks, additionaly, you could also take it easy while your single weak if your concerned about dying again

I don't know what kind of rng you're playing or tanks you have, but i'v had no issues not pulling hate and still doing good damage over time and not laying in the dirt, why? because i use a heavy -enimity set in my tp build on NMs that can make a huge difference in grabing hate off of. if you like dying that's you, but that's not a smart way to go about it just to lose hate, and my rng has a 40k buffer so dying wouldn't mean shit to me, but it's that high because i don't do stupid shit like grab hate whenever on whatever.

[Viq]

Matix's mob will die first. That's worth a few exp.

[Shinryuu]

Attn: RNGs:

If these two apply:
- Your exp means nothing to you
- The fight is long enough

Matix's method wins and you don't gear up -enmity at all. Why? Because you will grab hate. Only situation I'd consider enmity gear is when the fight is of such a duration that going all-out w/ enmity lets me live just barely and w/o it I die. You'll do a tad bit more damage w/ the enmity. However there's no way to tell what that cutoff duration is so just die and let die.

[Shin Volcano]

What fight will last long enough to warrent that, that grabing hate would be bad? because if he dies again that's his "Method" out the window, assuming there are other dds there damaging the mob to, that method is just an exp loss. yes you will grab hate, so during that 5 minutes, he better hope and prys he dosn't grab hate again.

Plenty of the mobs i'v fought without dying died fast enough with no deaths, this is definetly something you'll have to show me, because the only long duration fights i know that uses rng is dark ixion and sometimes khimira, and you'll grab hate on those sooner or later no matter what you do, hell dark ixion you don't even have to try to die.

Odin, hell you don't have time to die. and most other fights that aren't Ixion, smn was ussualy the better choice for me, don't have to worry about hate then.

[Tsuko_Asura]

Who the hell are you, and why have the only posts I've seen out of you in the past few minutes been exceptionally stupid?

[Shin Volcano]

Who the hell are you, and why have the only posts I've seen out of you in the past few minutes been exceptionally stupid?

They are only stupid to the people are the king of stupid posts, such as you, dosn't matter who the hell i am, the more important question is, why should i care about you?

[ZhiGaruda]

pop a slugwinder or ees to seal the deal for it to kill you

that'd be a good time to suicide

I actually really like this guy. My kind of RNG.

[Fottiti]

All this discussion is proving is, none of you have any fucking idea how VE works anyway.

[matix]

What fight will last long enough to warrent that, that grabing hate would be bad? because if he dies again that's his "Method" out the window, assuming there are other dds there damaging the mob to, that method is just an exp loss. yes you will grab hate, so during that 5 minutes, he better hope and prys he dosn't grab hate again.

Plenty of the mobs i'v fought without dying died fast enough with no deaths, this is definetly something you'll have to show me, because the only long duration fights i know that uses rng is dark ixion and sometimes khimira, and you'll grab hate on those sooner or later no matter what you do, hell dark ixion you don't even have to try to die.

Odin, hell you don't have time to die. and most other fights that aren't Ixion, smn was ussualy the better choice for me, don't have to worry about hate then.

you dont get it, im entirely capable of not blowing my load when im single weak, thats not the problem ANYWAYS, i can still fire away at my maximum rate without worry, since i wont be pulling hate over the tanks within 5mins of my suicide, theres nothing except flashywinder/relic proc'ing barrage thats going to get me pulling hate immediately, besides maybe the tanks dying? its not some incredbily hard to pull off scenario where im constantly fighting the tanks for capped VE, its never been a problem for me to make it well beyond the 5min mark.

your making it sound like i need to be holding back immensely or something to not pull hate during my weakened phase, but ive nothing to worry about as long as people are playing their jobs, im not going to be in range of aoe's, so my only worry of dying would be pulling hate again, it would take quite a while to get VE up to where pld's are, esp when pld's will be riding the cap most of the time, and after my suicide reset ill be at 0! giving me lots of leisure time to chip away safely without any worry for at least 5mins, and usually it'll take more than 5mins to grab hate again anyways.

the point is you can kill what your fighting even faster this way

[Shin Volcano]

you dont get it, im entirely capable of not blowing my load when im single weak, thats not the problem ANYWAYS, i can still fire away at my maximum rate without worry, since i wont be pulling hate over the tanks within 5mins of my suicide, theres nothing except flashywinder/relic proc'ing barrage thats going to get me pulling hate immediately, besides maybe the tanks dying? its not some incredbily hard to pull off scenario where im constantly fighting the tanks for capped VE, its never been a problem for me to make it well beyond the 5min mark.

your making it sound like i need to be holding back immensely or something to not pull hate during my weakened phase, but ive nothing to worry about as long as people are playing their jobs, im not going to be in range of aoe's, so my only worry of dying would be pulling hate again, it would take quite a while to get VE up to where pld's are, esp when pld's will be riding the cap most of the time, and after my suicide reset ill be at 0! giving me lots of leisure time to chip away safely without any worry for at least 5mins, and usually it'll take more than 5mins to grab hate again anyways.

the point is you can kill what your fighting even faster this way

What? i get it just fine, if that works, then more power to you, i just have had little to no issues doing damage and staying alive, but you also can't always predict if and when an aoe will hit you, because shit can hit the fan. don't get sore at me, but i'v never seen any rng use that way. if it works, great for you.

[Callisto]

For PLD, I currently use Crab Plate in my bloodtanking set while engaged, would Darksteel Harness be worth using instead?(will be a bit before I can get HQ Harness).

[ZhiGaruda]

What? i get it just fine, if that works, then more power to you, i just have had little to no issues doing damage and staying alive, but you also can't always predict if and when an aoe will hit you, because shit can hit the fan. don't get sore at me, but i'v never seen any rng use that way. if it works, great for you.

I get what you're saying, but the other guy does have a reasonable point to make. While it's not always acceptable (I.E. for a short fight, massive amounts of death do nothing more than make you look like a fool with no idea how to play your job) in some situations it is the most viable option.

My one and only acceptable situation being a very-very low man group doing DI. When the fight is upwards of 45 minutes to 1 hour, every DD will be at capped hate regardless of your -enmity hullabaloo. There is no way around this. At this point, everytime a ranger WS's, they are going to pull hate. At this point, when hate is completely irregular, it IS the best, if not ONLY option, to start having those who pull hate sac themselves.

Of course this only happens if your LS sucks. So unless you are Jammalamma, please disregard this post

[ZhiGaruda]

For PLD, I currently use Crab Plate in my bloodtanking set while engaged, would Darksteel Harness be worth using instead?(will be a bit before I can get HQ Harness).

Do you happen to have Koenig Cuirass? You'll see more damage reduction from that.

Nonetheless, you're probably better off with the +ACC from Avalon for more Atonement spam.

[Callisto]

Do you happen to have Koenig Cuirass? You'll see more damage reduction from that.

Nonetheless, you're probably better off with the +ACC from Avalon for more Atonement spam.

Nah all I have is Avalon/Neuvo(FC/Enm)/NQ DS, and yeah I was sticking with Avalon just for the Acc, but wasn't sure if the DS would make enough difference to be worth changing to.

[ZhiGaruda]

Nah all I have is Avalon/Neuvo(FC/Enm)/NQ DS, and yeah I was sticking with Avalon just for the Acc, but wasn't sure if the DS would make enough difference to be worth changing to.

It depends. What are you blood tanking?

[Callisto]

For the most part Xarc, we've been pretty slow event-wise lately and most everything else we do I'll probably just end up coming as WAR if I need to tank.

[ZhiGaruda]

For the most part Xarc, we've been pretty slow event-wise lately and most everything else we do I'll probably just end up coming as WAR if I need to tank.

Meh, when I went PLD/RDM to Xarc I normally tanked the NMs in full -PDT% gear, so you may find it useful for them. I normally didn't find time to get off more than one Atonement per NM anyhow, so big TP gain wouldn't have mattered.

Try both! See which you like more.

[Callisto]

I guess I should ask about PLD/RDM too as well, I've had some rough times when I've tried it, but I think part of it has been me not really getting the playstyle...are you just relying on Flash for hate, or actually utilizing Blind/Sleep/Dispel? I've had a ton of trouble keep up with MP when I tried to use more than just Flash/Phalanx/Aquaveil. Is there a certain amount of MP/tick Refresh support you shouldn't try it without?

[Wulfgang]

i just have had little to no issues doing damage and staying alive

Then you're wasting potential damage is the point of this debate. The amount of damage from going all out then dying and starting over is undoubtedly greater than going hard then trying to hold back for the rest of the fight.

Khimaira, Odin, DI, and a number of other fights are good examples of this. Your point is valid that you may get hit by an AOE and be double weak and useless, but the best RNGs usually manage.