For BG fitness fanatics, a question..

[Meat]

But of course you don't run any of these risks with weightlifting, right?

keep your back straight and tight, avoid locking out. ok tell me how to run and avoid joint damage

[Weiing]

I don't think anyone is dogging you for enjoying running. But keep an open mind and at least read that link (it's just a nice, readable summary of things)?

Sprinting is improved by more sprinting.

I never said running wouldn't help with soccer. But I mean, you don't run constantly for an hour in soccer, as there are times when you stop (and slide!).

Edit:
Lifting doesn't hurt your joints if you're doing it right, with proper form and such and such...
Lifting actually improves your bone density (or something like that). It's actually encouraged for women to lift heavy weights to prevent the likelihood of osteoporosis when they get older.
Lifting doesn't eat away at your muscles...

[Norellicus]

You can tear them, which is just as bad if my dad is any indication -- he tore his hamstring a number of years back and now can't do anything that really relies on it heavily.

And "not if you do it right" is a retarded excuse, of course you can fuck yourself up if you do the work wrong, and it's plenty safe if you know how to do it properly. Same applies to running, you can train yourself out of abusive habits fairly easily (I did!) if you know what you're looking for and what you need to do to fix it. Running injuries are more common because it strikes people more of a natural, animalistic thing that has no precise sciences and can just be done by anyone without any prior knowledge, preparation, or maintenance. Which is dumb.

[Caiyuo]

The hell are you talking about? That is exactly what most runners do, you don't just start running 26, 13, 6, or even 3 miles lol. Who the hell are you observing that would lead you to the above conclusion?

Calm the fuck down, lol I was making the point that if you're progressing to running multiple miles at a time that in essence you aren't running in moderation because of how long you'd be running at a time, even if it isn't done on a daily basis. I think we have differing opinions on moderation through frequency and distance.

[Weiing]

You can tear them, which is just as bad if my dad is any indication -- he tore his hamstring a number of years back and now can't do anything that really relies on it heavily.

How did he tear his hamstring?

And yes, when you lift weights, you basically tear your muscle. That's what it is. Muscle growth is the repairing of that torn muscle.

[Norellicus]

I don't know, I wasn't there and was like 6 when it happened. He was laid up for a week and couldn't do any kind of "lifting" (not necessarily weights, but like moving equipment for work and such) for a few months afterward, at least. To this day he still can't do a lot of heavy loads, and he never runs.

And yes, I know you're breaking down muscle to rebuild it when you lift weights, I'm just saying I don't think you're making much of a case for why running is so much more evil than weightlifting is when they both cause a form of debilitation in the name of improvement. I'm not an expert in anatomy so I couldn't tell you the exact science behind one or the other, but I find it highly skeptical that either is terrible. Educate yourself on your preferred method, get some supplemental training to shore up your weak areas, and do your preventative maintenance, and either one should be fine.

I did read that article, and I'm not saying it's wrong, but it's also kind of obscure about its comparison; he talks about "high intensity" cardio, what exactly does that mean? And who's to say that every person has the same tolerance (or lack thereof) in their physique for it that it just becomes universally bad? Based on the research I've been doing to make sure I know what I'm getting into, it seems like your average running 'training day' is only about 3-5 miles, which can be done leisurely in 30 minutes, and from the running I've done so far I can fairly reliably say that 30 minutes is not intense unless you make it out to be (such as sprintervals or fartlek). The article just seems so firmly planted on one side of the argument and presents its case from a completely subjective point of view (which its allowed to do, since it's a blog/editorial and not an impartial news report), I have a hard time just looking at it and saying "gosh, they're so right and I should stop right now".

[Tristam]

I don't think anyone is dogging you for enjoying running. But keep an open mind and at least read that link (it's just a nice, readable summary of things)?

Sprinting is improved by more sprinting.

I never said running wouldn't help with soccer. But I mean, you don't run constantly for an hour in soccer, as there are times when you stop (and slide!).

Edit:
Lifting doesn't hurt your joints if you're doing it right, with proper form and such and such...
Lifting actually improves your bone density (or something like that). It's actually encouraged for women to lift heavy weights to prevent the likelihood of osteoporosis when they get older.
Lifting doesn't eat away at your muscles...

What? Any weightlifting puts stress on "joints", tendons especially, no matter how well you're doing it, which is why upper extremity tendonitis and stress fractures are much much more common in weightlifters than endurance atheletes.

Bone density improves with any athletic activity, it's not exclusive to lifting heavy weights. Bone structures develop in response to muscle load and impact dependent on the demands of the particular sport.

Anything related to exercise will eat away at your muscles if you're not doing it properly. Part of endurance training is training your body to use fat preferentially as an energy source for long periods of time. Most endurance athletes have a nutrition strategy for during the race itself to keep glucose in the bloodstream so that your body doesn't freak out and start metabolizing protein. It's worth mentioning that poor nutrition habits can lead to the same effect in weightlifters, but they usually have a nutrition plan as well.

[Tristam]

Kinda late to the party on the caffeine thing, but it should be obvious that it is a diuretic. So it will adversely effect your body's absorption of nutrients and water. Just something to keep in mind. Not generally something that would necessarily bother weightlifters as much as endurance folk tho.

[Tristam]

Final thing about running "functionality", very off topic, but in all animals running exercises activate eustress responses in the brain (which is the good kind of stress). Animals allowed to run have more active brains, and perform better at memory-related tasks. Exercise in general is functional at many levels, and running is very well studied in that respect. Not saying the same sorts of things couldn't happen with weightlifting tho.

[Weiing]

Well I was just curious if your father tore it from lifting weights? I'm assuming yes, or else why would you bring it up?

Of course I believe people should have a balance of lifting heavy as well as doing low aerobic exercise. Not only does it keep your body active, but it's fun!

High intensity cardio is going as fast as you can for a certain amount of time and then going slower or even stopping to rest for a certain amount of time. Run really fast for 30 seconds, rest/walk/jog for 30 seconds. Sprinting is a form... biking really fast is another way. Usually this goes on for 6-8 cycles. So if you're doing 30 seconds on /30 seconds off, that's about 6-8 minutes. Obviously, "going as fast as you can" is subjective, as, like you noted, everyone is within a scale of fitness. So me sprinting really hard may be a breeze for someone else. But it's the fact that you're challenging yourself is what is most important.

Again, there's a difference between low level aerobic exercise and just constant chronic cardio at a pretty high pace (that "target heartrate zone" thing). That blog promotes low level aerobic exercises (walk/hike/bike/swim/row) and intervals (sprint/HIIT).

Obviously, it's great you're doing your own research. I hope you find something that makes most sense to you. Ultimately, although I find his logic most well-founded (in his research of science) and most logical to me, the only thing that really matters to me is that people are trying to make healthier lifestyle choices. It's just that I like to also try to open people up to something different, to something they might find they like more than what "common knowledge" tells us.

[Weiing]

Final thing about running "functionality", very off topic, but in all animals running exercises activate eustress responses in the brain (which is the good kind of stress). Animals allowed to run have more active brains, and perform better at memory-related tasks. Exercise in general is functional at many levels, and running is very well studied in that respect. Not saying the same sorts of things couldn't happen with weightlifting tho.

I'll get back to the other thing later as I have to go ...

But how often do you see animals run as compared to sprint/walk/lounge around?
They may run/gallop for a while, but do they run/gallop for 45 minutes to an hour? -- that's really the main question
Are you saying turtles don't have active brains? (kidding)

QUick edit--sorry:
I never said running was bad or not functional... Just not running for extended periods of time (45 minutes-1hr+).

[Norellicus]

Well I was just curious if your father tore it from lifting weights? I'm assuming yes, or else why would you bring it up?

It was some kind of exercise, I just don't know/remember exactly what. I'm presuming it was weights, but he also played baseball and tennis so it could have been one of those too.

It was just pointing out that any kind of exercise can potentially have lasting negative effects.

[Tristam]

I'll get back to the other thing later as I have to go ...

But how often do you see animals run as compared to sprint/walk/lounge around?
They may run/gallop for a while, but do they run/gallop for 45 minutes to an hour? -- that's really the main question
Are you saying turtles don't have active brains? (kidding)

QUick edit--sorry:
I never said running was bad or not functional... Just not running for extended periods of time (45 minutes-1hr+).

Small mammals, rats mice etc. Will run voluntarily for extended periods of time, well over 45 mins/day. Probably not all at once (that's an invention of human scheduling) but also not at "sprint" pace. Migratory animals will stay active for very long periods of time.

And true I should have said mammals, not all animals.

[Weiing]

Small mammals, rats mice etc. Will run voluntarily for extended periods of time, well over 45 mins/day. Probably not all at once (that's an invention of human scheduling) but also not at "sprint" pace. Migratory animals will stay active for very long periods of time.

And true I should have said mammals, not all animals.

That bolded part is the key.

I just wanted to add something that Zoo brought up about Tyche. I have great respect for him, despite my views on running for a long period of time. It takes great commitment/dedication to do that stuff. His goals (marathon?/health/fun) differ from mine (gain&maintan muscle/low body fat/health/fun. I'm curious what kind of discussion that was, but ultimately I believe it just comes down to "to each his/her own".

And I'll leave it at that. I don't want to shit this thread up anymore so if you want to talk, let's do it via PMs/AIM/MSN.

[promethius]

looking for a good protein mix, and i was recomended to take iso pure from my manager at work, anyone take it and have any opinion on it either negative or positive, thanks and if you have any ideas on what i should take let me know.

6' 3"
195lbs
medium build got a gut i can't get rid of and my arms are average so dont wanna take something to help get them bigger while increasing the stomach lol.

[Meat]

isopure is awesome, but it's an isolate not a concentrate. so it's going to be grainy and chalky that's just the nature of isolates.
You'd probably be better served with some optimum nutrition or bsn's syntha-6 the latter straight up tastes like an ice cream shake

[Shojin]

protein powder? i'd recommend optimum nutrition's natural whey protein powders, they can be expensive but it is good stuff.

[promethius]

protein powder? i'd recommend optimum nutrition's natural whey protein powders, they can be expensive but it is good stuff.

thanks well the isopure is $70 for a container how much is that stuff. i wanna lose the gut before i take anything to bulk up. i was told protein shakes whould be good as long as no carbs/fat is in it just for getting cut.

[Shojin]

thanks well the isopure is $70 for a container how much is that stuff. i wanna lose the gut before i take anything to bulk up. i was told protein shakes whould be good as long as no carbs/fat is in it just for getting cut.

http://www.optimumnutrition.com/prod...Whey-facts.jpg

there is the nutritional info if you need it, its called 'Optimum Nutrition 100% Whey Gold Standard'.

It usually runs about $70-75 for a 5lb tub. Might be able to find it cheaper if you shop around and maybe find a few deals.

[Weiing]

True Protein is pretty good. If you go to the forums, you can check anyone's signature to get an additional discount. It blends quite well... I get the whey protein concentrate, and it's pretty cheap and delicious. SO many flavors.

PS
Nothing wrong with fat in your diet!

quick edit:
http://www.trueprotein.com/Product_D...id=22&pid=6740
It's about $5 per lb...not including the additional discount you'd get.
That's ~$25 for 5 lbs!

Link to the protein I get.