Maintaining Strong LS Leadership

[kisada]

I don't want to leave my linkshell's success up to chance. My current linkshell had one of those selfless, intelligent, constantly-online leaders. Where is he now? Playing Aion. I haven't seen him in weeks. We have some great officers now, but they have real lives and I can't blame them for having limits. But there's shit that must get done on a consistent basis. How can we establish a linkshell foundation that guarantees stability for the long term?

My idea, as I mentioned, was to set strict requirements for linkshell officers. Then, award them substantial enough gil/dkp bonuses as incentive. I don't think there's anything unethical about that--it's simply rewarding them for what they're in a sense doing, a job. For me, I don't have the time to do any of that crap. But when I log in, it would be nice to see that shit's being taken care of--and if it's not, be able to say "look negro, I'm paying you, so do your job correctly or someone else can do it." It would be great to have someone to hold accountable, rather than look retarded asking your shellholder "where are our sea torques?" "where's my DKP from wednesday's event?" "why weren't we camping Khimmy?" only to have the "I'm not superman, would you like to do my job?" card thrown in your face. And if it means shit actually gets taken care of, the investment will pay off for everyone. However, I have the feeling that my idea is too naiive and simplistic.

I'm looking for real measures that LS members with a full-time job and RL, such as myself, can take towards actually improving their LS, even if they don't have the time to put in to managing the day-to-day tasks. What kind of measures can be made now--not next week or next month, without having to depend on a selfless benevolent individual to come out of thin air to guide the way.

you kind of said it yourself, even the most devoted of leaders have their limits and whether they hit that in a month, a year, or several, eventually things will come to an end for them. unexpected things happen, whether it's in-game social conflicts or out of game real life events, and no matter what, you will be forced to find and develop new leadership. as much as you would like there to be, there is no easy formula for long-term stability. i'd for sure say that there's no way to guarantee such a thing either.

obviously you feel that strong leadership contributes to that stability, and i don't think that's wrong (though i'd say it's flawed thinking to believe that that's all you need). but for the most part i think you're kinda looking at it the wrong way. being the best leader possible with a clear vision of progress requires an absolute desire to see the group succeed. and that absolute desire isn't gonna have anything to do with self-gain, interests in items, or anything like that: it's gonna be all about getting the shell to succeed and for it to keep reaching beyond whatever successes you've achieved up until that point.

the other option is to entice people to be leaders, but the premise that carrots are enough to maintain strong leadership is weak on several levels. first, when it comes to items, people eventually become satiated. if you are constantly rewarding someone and they are just eating it all up, there will come a time when that person has run out of things to work for and when that happens their motivation for leading will completely dissipate. furthermore, there will be no desire for that leader to do any extra work, which is the most important quality you need in constantly pushing your ls to move forward.

second, most people generally will disagree with certain members having extra privileges over other ones. one particular and obvious problem is that you'll be in a situation where one person will win an item with their points, enhanced by whatever bonuses you'll give them, over another person who has clearly spent far more time helping and contributing to getting that item drop. now, the points will dictate who won the item and that's that, but everyone who had been paying attention will feel as if the other person (or other persons) will have worked far harder for it than the winner. this can cause a lot of dissonance and these things always happen.

finally, leadership that works only towards self-interest eventually shows itself to be extremely transparent to the rest of the members, and no thinking person is going to be ok with that. eventually that leads to issues with bias and favoritism, and that leadership will be undermined in every decision that is made. and once your leadership is undermined, you will have an extremely hard time getting simple things done, let alone maintaining any semblance of ls unity.




i wish there was an easy way, but there isn't. the simplest thing i'd recommend doing is just finding a few people who truly care about keeping your group alive and active. it's not necessarily about finding one savior who can do everything for you, but finding a few people who care about your shell so much that they are willing to do whatever is in their power to keep it going. it might take some time but if you really want it to work, you'll have to search really hard and get into the heads of all your members to see where they're really at and what they are really willing to do. of course there's no set rules for this and for the most part i tried to use my best judgment in recognizing who was capable and who wasn't. but judge of character and personal qualities is all you really have.

i will say this one last thing: in my experience, i spent a lot of time scouring through the ranks looking for leadership and i noticed that there are primarily two categories of leaders. one is the kind that is fully competent, understands just about all the situations in the book, and is willing to help out and do whatever you need them to. the one thing that they don't want, however, is any part of overall responsibility or dealing with people. i'd classify this guy as the #2 guy. the other type encapsulates all the competence and knowledge of the first, but they ARE willing to handle and maintain large-scale responsibility, and they are constantly thinking of ways to push the ls forward. these people are your #1's.

the problem is that while you're looking, you encounter a lot of people who can play that role of lieutenant but they are so terrified of being top dog (which isn't what you should be asking of them anyway), it's extremely difficult to get them out of their hole. so look for #2 guys by letting them know you just need help in dealing with everyday activities and that they won't have to make big decisions. and in the meantime hunt for #1's who will make those decisions and whose main goals are progression.

[Kerberoz]

Banking all loot for 1 person to get a relic is probably the biggest mistake any LS can make.

this x1000. I can't even begin to express how much failure it is to pool everything for the sacks and kiss-asses to get free relics off of the entire ls's work.

Also, giving loot based on who can use fails in XI, imo. You end up with dedicated mages getting jack shit and tanks getting 20 drops in their first week. Points systems and bank records are a must, unless everyone in the LS trusts each other, which is LOL if it's more than a few months old. Banks should only pay for dynamis/einherjar, and pay out regularly. Subjective looting only leads to pissing people off.

Single leader > multiple leaders. If a single leader sucks, people will leave. End of story. If some of the multiple leaders suck, people might stick around and be miserable, leading to cliques forming under each leader, leaders constantly arguing amongst themselves and not getting anything done while a single "dictator" could just do it and get it over with.

Leaders need to play more than most of the regular members, or have the dignity to relinquish their spot.

Rules need to be laid out in the open for everyone to see. You should always know who's getting what drop, what events you need to be at, etc. Favors should not happen and the rules should not allow for favors. Nothing should be subjective, because leaders will always pick favorites eventually, whether they realize it or not.

[Shinryuu]

Leaders need to wield the iron fist using proper logic, stuff's going to be fine.

[Spider-Dan]

Benevolent tyrant is always the best form of LS leadership, just as benevolent philosopher-king is the best form of government. Unfortunately, the supply of the aforementioned is too short to be practical in either case.

If you are actually able to find a good, trustworthy, warrior-poet leader, /point system is the best. Unfortunately, when that person inevitably quits, your LS will crumble and burn just like the empires of the ancient world. The faster you accept this, the better off you will be.

[Nevex]

Unless you clearly have corrupted leaders (which is very easy to notice), it makes no difference whether there is a bank or not or whether there's a strict point system or not: a good, active player will always be rewarded in every kind of system.

Multiple leaders is best, you have no clue what kind of pressure a single person can be put on.
If you were basically the only person leading an AV kill when it was zergable you'd know what I mean.

In the end, rules and systems are just a way to organize things, they're largely irrilevant when compared to what kind of members your LS has.
It doesn't matter which system a LS uses, if a player can't adapt him/herself to the rules, then endgame scenario is not for him/her.

Unfortunely this game is full of people who are not situated for the endgame(leaders or not), who are damaging for every LS with no exception. You can set all the kind of rules and systems you want, you can kick them, but once they get in your LS expect some kind of damage.

[jammalamma]

It doesn't matter if a good leader has an e-girlfriend, because a good leader will be able to say no. That simple. If somebody can easily be manipulated by their partner then they shouldn't be a leader. But this also works both ways, because guys aren't much different when they have a girl who holds a bit of power.

Anyway, coming from the stand point of a female leader, the hardest thing is actually getting a chance. Sure, my boyfriend is in leadership too, but it's not like I or anybody else simply gets their way and lots everything they want. People expect women to somehow try and weasel everything they can, which is really sad. A lot of the times people try not to include me in executive decisions and generally just try to discriminate. But a lot of the guys in my LS are very conservative when it comes to playing this game and brush off my ideas as insane, like something simple like tanking KS99 Wyrm with SAMs instead of PLD. Needless to say, I have yet to fail anything I've personally stepped up for. But I guess it goes with the whole thankless job thing, people tend not to notice that and continue to show their bias. I guess as long as everybody's happy to get their drops.

And while people may say a good LS doesn't need sacks, a successful LS does need some kind of leadership to create goals and means to accomplish them. Not everybody can participate and shoot off ideas, especially in large shells created solely to dominate a server by being able to have adequate forces at everything at any time. The leadership needs to be diverse, and cliques in the LS actually have to be recognized in council. If you don't have somebody from a specific clique in leadership, then you're destined to lose a bit of your core when unfavorable policy is enacted. People might say it shouldn't be that way, but LSes are political entities in the FF world.

DKP is great until you get to a point where DKP doesn't matter anymore. At that point there's not much motivation to keep up productivity unless your LS consists of simply just a core. I guess since my LS isn't structured like that the issue of productivity and rewards is a lot more important since killing mobs isn't intrinsically gratifying for the most of us.

An LS bank can be very helpful in directing the LS. Sure it's dumb to spend all the money on a single person, but if you get a few people with some financing skills then you can set up a fair system. Like for my LS, 45% of the bank is allotted for dkp to AH gear exchanges, 15% for operations, and 40% for future funds with pretty much translates to relics. I personally think doing direct payouts is dumb because there is no control over how the money is being spent then. Everybody can get a fish bot if they need to buy sushi, because the LS will buy pretty much everything else for you.

Every serious LS NEEDS a Botter's Union. Especially if your non-botting members become lazy and don't even attempt to claim. But, again we probably have such a union because we embrace the political nature of the linkshell.

You need somebody to drive your competition, and even your own members up the wall. A skilled antagonist is the driving force behind breaking competition. Somebody who can beat a dead horse into dust when your competition constantly fails will break their spirits. It will cause internal strife(usually on both fronts), but it's very effective in sapping the life out of rival LSes. It also allows people to scapegoat them, especially if you're working dirty deals with disgruntled members in another LS. But having everybody's attention focused on ONE person instead of what your LS as a whole is actually doing is invaluable. But I guess not everybody's goal is destroying their competition literally.

Also another thing on leadership, I really think it's best to have 2 head leaders. One who's so far on the extreme tyrant side, and somebody moderate to keep them in check. If you don't have that kind of power sharing then well, unless you have a very talented leader(rare) then the boat is going to sink ship.

[Shamaya]

I agree that an HNMls whose mission statement is to "control endgame" is one thing, and an elite low-man shell is another. I've been in both extremes and in the middle. Right now I'm in an HNMls, and to really capture the mission statement, it requires a lot of people. Low-manning requires more skill during play. HNM'ing requires more skill concerning overall LS management.

Competitive HNM'ing at a Minimum
My favorite kind are the kinds that don't sleep. Running 24 hours a day requires plenty of members, who also tend to play at different times. And enough people as well to greatly ease the otherwise major-burden that comes with mandatory camping. And then you need plenty of other events going to keep people happy; sticking to only HNM's is shite. Meanwhile, there are things that major LS's can't and shouldn't do, such as run salvage or nyzul as LS events. A free pass from mandatory camps should be given to members during static times, and this will only increase the amount of members needed for mandatory camp management. So those are base requirements, lots of people playing at different times, camping lots of NM's, and having plenty of other events. That's already a lot to handle.

Competitive HNM'ing at its Best
.....After that, then what? There are many ways to structure operations to best achieve both productivity and fairness. Each LS has its own flavor. I have a few beliefs on what I think best. I believe weighted DKP is best. There can be no griping about drop allocation, which in a way eases the minds of the LS managers, as they don't have to worry about much finger-pointing. My LS does average attendance/day for the past 8 weeks, and combines this with the length of time something has been on a members wishlist (max of 2 items); they're combined in a formula to spit out something similar to DKP. It's calculated automatically and viewable by all members. So a web applet is best.
.....I believe that minimalized, transparent bank is best. My LS has no bank. Sell/splits are great, but it would be more time efficient for us to buy pops. We could allocate a sort of tax for our sell/splits. Or perhaps better or in addition, I think a two-way item/gil <-> dkp conversion is best, but I've seen many people skeptical of this. You could set it up so that popsets are only bought at the going rate so long as there is a demand. I believe in selling r/ex items that people don't care enough for to wishlist; as well as selling them priority to LS members at a discount price.
.....I believe a clear LS stance should be taken on botting. Either it's allowed, or it "isn't." If it isn't, measures need to be taken to make sure people are putting in genuine efforts to claim. If it is, efforts need to be taken towards urging everyone to bot so that a few don't shoulder the burden/"risk," or at least incentives be offered to those that do. The stance should be clear to new members so that moral debates are avoided.
.....I believe that oftentimes few can do the work of many. Limbus, sea, sky, and other popsets can be solo'd, duo'd, or low-manned independently and should be to increase efficiency. They can be turned in for gil or DKP. KV, Khimaira, Sandworm, etc, can be claimed and held with minimal parties, and extra points should be awarded for these tasks.


All of these operations and further ideas require a lot of work. In my opinion, viewing a large HNMls for what it is, it starts to appear business-like.

How can we ensure that these valuable and necessary tasks get done with unflinching consistency, without having to hang on the nuts of a benevolent leader(s)--only leaving ourselves quite open to the risks of their inevitable burnout? And it's a 'game', so how can we accomplish these things while still allowing our members to have lives?

I think that a lot of what people are hinting at is that "chemistry" and "charisma" are important. However, there's neither a recipe nor formula for those--they simply happen. Is strong chemistry between members absolutely necessary for success? Will treating the LS as a carefully managed business be doomed to mortally remove the chemistry element and fail for certain? Or is good chemistry only icing on the cake?

[Dooom]

I think that a lot of what people are hinting at is that "chemistry" and "charisma" are important. However, there's neither a recipe nor formula for those--they simply happen. Is strong chemistry between members absolutely necessary for success? Will treating the LS as a carefully managed business be doomed mortally remove the chemistry element and fail for certain? Or is good chemistry only icing on the cake?

I don't think there's a definite answer to this, it will vary on the individual. Some people will need to be part of a successful linkshell even if they don't have too many friends there (just co-workers instead); others will trade claim/item/whatever "success" to be part of a group they feel are better friends, and the social aspect takes precedence over drops. For me, the social aspect matters a lot, and it's why I've stuck with my current shell for so long and the main reason I left others before, even though I could have achieved more item-based success in another shell. But, I respect and acknowledge people who might say "sorry, I want to be in a 24/7, dominating LS, you guys aren't for me even though I think you're all awesome people".

[Alibeemac]

Leading is difficult and stressful and not everyone seems to appreciate this. It is impossible to please every person in the LS no matter how hard you try. I have stepped up to lead our LS over the past couple of years since our LS leader has been very busy with RL/work etc and doesn't get online much so someone had to do the job or it wouldn't get done.

We have had many sackholders over the years, most of whom have now moved on to RL or other games or w/e. There is still a small number of us around and things in general get done and honestly you need a couple of SHs to be there supporting the leader or you would go crazy on your own. We have taken in a large number of members recently when another LS broke so we now have 50+ active members and one person being spammed in /tell constantly about it goes crazy so a couple of the other SH take responsibility for some events to give me the day off etc.

People when they join the LS are pretty much aware of what we do and don't do. We are a strict no botting LS therefore we don't do Kings and people know this. We do however do the past NMs very actively and go after other things like Cerb/Tiamat/Khim and even Hydra/Jorm for lulz sometimes and something different. We have a very active schedule of Einherjar/Sea/ZNM/Some Sky/Ouryu/B2/Some KS99 and occassional other events people request. I try to make the schedule and post it 2 months in advance so people know what T4 ZNM pop sets to work towards etc.

We have affiliated Salvage/Limbus/Dynamis LS's which run at set times all on their own reward systems whether it is DKP or wish list based. Einherjar has it's own system altogether based on a wish list of 1 item and loot is distributed to those with highest Einherjar attendance along with overall DKP. Drops are decided before Odin therefore there is no confusion when it drops.

People are excused from HNM camps for things like Dynamis/Limbus/Salvage as those are pre-planned events which has outside members in the group and we don't find it fair to ruin the event for others. We now introduced additional DKP for camping rather than just the kill since people tend to mysteriously 'unafk' when an HNM pops. This benefits people both when it comes to overall DKP and LS Bank distribution.

LS bank sells items that no one DKPs at the event. People are able to spend DKP on items they wish as long as they can use it and are not on trial. We don't believe in selling everything just to purely make money. Giving out gear off HNMs we kill benefits the members as it improves their characters and makes people happy they are receiving something. I can't tell you the amount of times I have received thank you tells from some people who are overjoyed at receiving a piece of gear and this makes the leading worth it, to see someone happy because of the way we do things.

LS Bank gil is split amongst the ls members on a Tier'd system based on attendance over the period the gil was collected. We give out gil on 1st of the month that we reach our target gil. We have a relic scheme in place where any gil above the LS members splits are put towards buying some currency for people on Stage 5 of a Relic and we allow upgraders to DKP a maximum of 2,000 currency from the LS bank. However, if we have low gil one month then the Relic upgraders get nothing in order that the LS members still get their split. We did fully fund a relic once and we won't do it again as it caused some discomfort because the person was not around as much as people would have liked.

Loot is distributed via DKP and unless one person has a huge amount of DKP over another then usually a couple of people lot on the item. We have rules for things like Sea torques where if you receive say a T1 torque then you are not permitted to receive a T2 or JoL torque in that rotation unless no one else wants. This is to try and avoid some loot whoring by people with multiple jobs and share the gear around. I personally feel uncomfortable when I lot something now as I don't want people thinking I am taking stuff for myself or w/e whenever I want and a lot of the time now I either pass or let others lot with me. I have received a lot of gear over the years, most of which before I was a leader and I find it more difficult to accept gear being a leader. Other gear via things like Limbus/Dynamis/Salvage is different because they are all on their own systems separate from the main LS DKP.

Overall, every LS is different and many different methods work. It is all about the group of people in the LS and what kind of atmosphere they wish to be in and what motivates them. There is no perfect system and no perfect leader no matter what some people may think.

[Despain]

I think what people need to understand is that being a leader of a linkshell can be extremely stressful, and sometimes these leaders will have their off days. Even then, it is a leader's responsibility to be mature, and handle these situations as best as they possibly can.

i.e, don't be stupid and take out your frustration on your members. That shit never solves anything.

[Dooom]

i.e, don't be stupid and take out your frustration on your members. That shit never solves anything.

By the same token, don't take out your frustrations on your leaders because you got stuck in traffic this morning/girlfriend dumped you/cat puked on your shoes/whatever. Coming onto LS and going "gfdi I hate this stupid event, why do I have to come on X job, why is Y such a gimp, blah blah blah" is just gonna make your leaders go "why do I do this?"

[Despain]

I completely agree. I hate people who constantly complain about coming a specific job to an event. So the fuck what if you have to come BRD to every event? You leveled the job, you have no right to complain.

[Oulanbator]

I don't think the answer is leadership.
I think the answer is members. Members are what make or break the shell. Productivity depends on their behavior, success as well.

You can have an awesome leader, if your members suck, your ls won't work. It's all about figuring the ls objectives, potential, and to recruit players according to this potential and objectives.
I think there are two categories of members you want to avoid:
- members that only join (specific) scheduled event
- members that spend all their time levelling jobs

The productivity of a shell usually comes from unscheduled events. All the scheduled stuff is basically getting the benefits from the work that have been done before, when collecting pop sets or camping.
So basically, you're looking at people that can create the ls progression outside of scheduled events, plus some people with less availability to help reaping the fruits of that progression.

The only thing a leader can do is to give real encouragements to players to do things outside ls events.

[Dooom]

You leveled the job, you have no right to complain.

Eh, disagreed to some extent. If you're forcing a member to constantly come on a job they don't like (anymore; you might love a job at first, but playing it every day at the expense of your other jobs can turn it into a chore), that member isn't gonna have fun, and will quit. As a leader, part of your job is ensuring people have fun, and while sometimes this means someone has to come on their least favourite job, it shouldn't always be the same person who gets stuck on brd/whm/whatever duty.

[Despain]

If there was a way to shuffle jobs, which there should be, then yes... however if you're in a linkshell where the only other person who has BRD so happens to be one of the few tanks in your LS (by few, lets say 2) and you as a BRD don't have a tank job, then more than likely it'd be best you come BRD.

[Vytiss]

It doesn't matter if a good leader has an e-girlfriend, because a good leader will be able to say no. That simple. If somebody can easily be manipulated by their partner then they shouldn't be a leader.

haha, easily said now that you've got all your shit....
hope your LS realizes that you're gonna jet soon after you get whatever you're currently after now.

[Despain]

I don't think the answer is leadership.
I think the answer is members. Members are what make or break the shell. Productivity depends on their behavior, success as well.

You can have an awesome leader, if your members suck, your ls won't work. It's all about figuring the ls objectives, potential, and to recruit players according to this potential and objectives.
I think there are two categories of members you want to avoid:
- members that only join (specific) scheduled event
- members that spend all their time levelling jobs

The productivity of a shell usually comes from unscheduled events. All the scheduled stuff is basically getting the benefits from the work that have been done before, when collecting pop sets or camping.
So basically, you're looking at people that can create the ls progression outside of scheduled events, plus some people with less availability to help reaping the fruits of that progression.

The only thing a leader can do is to give real encouragements to players to do things outside ls events.

You bring up good points. A linkshell is a burden shared by all members of a linkshell, sacks or not.

[Despain]

haha, easily said now that you've got all your shit....
hope your LS realizes that you're gonna jet soon after you get whatever you're currently after now.

Sup guy.

[barber2006]

If there was a way to shuffle jobs, which there should be, then yes... however if you're in a linkshell where the only other person who has BRD so happens to be one of the few tanks in your LS (by few, lets say 2) and you as a BRD don't have a tank job, then more than likely it'd be best you come BRD.

Or you could make one of the dozen ls members who only have mnk, sam, drk, drg, war, rng, and thf at 75 level a useful job instead of constantly leveling melee jobs. 6 years later there is really no excuse for everyone not having at least one melee, one mage, one tank, and one support job that are reasonably equipped.

[Crizto]

haha, easily said now that you've got all your shit....
hope your LS realizes that you're gonna jet soon after you get whatever you're currently after now.

And who is this guy here?