couple arrested for theft for not paying a tip

[Vandalhart]

The American tipping system does seem odd to me.
I'm not sure if I understand it. You've made an agreement that you'll get X number of dollars in a week, and if you don't get that with tips your employer makes up the difference?

EDIT: Just saw Plow's post. That clearss it up for me a bit.


Here, you get min wage. Then anything on top if extra. I'm not talking about incl tips. I'm talking $8.25 without even serving a table.

My latest story:

My parents, my wife and myself went to Boston Pizza recently. We ordered and sat around for a bit. Then my wife's and my appetizers came out. The waitress let us know that they had no ham for my wife's Hawaiian pizza. She gave the option of changing it, but my wife isn't a huge fan of ham anyways so she just said it was fine. Then 10 minutes or so after my wife and my entree's came out. My parents were getting a little antsy because they still hadn't gotten any food. I'd say another 5-10 more minutes later they got their meals. Around when we were close to finished eating the waitress came over and said that she was going to have the manager come over and talk to us about the pizza and my dad's burger platter because it was so late coming out.

Apparently they were short staffed in the kitchen. The manager had said that he had to even jump in out there and help make food. Not something I bet a lot of managers would do.

In the end, we got the pizza for free, my father's entree for free, and a $30 credit for the next time we go. We totally didn't expect that much. I really only thought they'd take maybe the price of the ham off the pizza and maybe reduce my Dad's meal by half or something.

I typically tip around the tax and round to the nearest dollar after. It's a gratuity here and I treat it as such. I still typically give around the tax. I have to keep in mind that our tax has been going down in the last little while so I'll have to update how I tip.

My brother in law went to Italy with work recently and he said that some of the servers actually get REALLY pissy if you don't leave a big enough tip. He actually witnessed one give his boss shit for it. The service was terrible, and the food took forever but they still left a tip. Not sure how much. The boss left his wallet on the table and the waiter brought it to him before he left so he gave a little reward for returning it.

[Olo401]

No gratuity should be mandatory, nor should it be expected that someone receive any kind of minimum tip for horrible service. And I'm an insanely generous tipper - usually I give 20-25% as a rule, just because I've worked for tips before (pizza delivery & cab driving) and know how hard it is to make good money if you don't bust your ass to please the customer. But if I get bad service, I make sure it's known.

Gratuity is just a method used to let the business owners get away with giving their workers shitty wages.

It's the wage laws that are written that way. And it's legitimate because most people whose income is based on tips usually make far more than the minimum wage, if they're good at their jobs.

As a server in NJ my hourly wage was $2.38/hr

That sounds a little low, though it probably varies from state to state. The minimum wage for tipearners in CT is I believe $4/hr, and that's what casino dealers at Foxwoods and Mohegan Sun are paid. However they also receive a percentage of all the tips the casino takes in, which usually adds another $12-17/hr to their paychecks. So it works out in the end.

well shit i can't embed a video

http://www.youtube.com/v/Z-qV9wVGb38&hl=en_US&fs=1&

I gotcha.. fkin LOVE this scene.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z-qV9wVGb38

[Vandalhart]

Saying you get paid $#.## per hour is rather misleading. Because in the end you still get more than that as you're final rate of pay. Does that mean if you hit the min wage total for the week your employer doesn't have to pay you anything?

[Maaglin]

Three things:

1. If you can't afford to leave a 20% tip, don't go out to a restaurant. I'm not necessarily saying that that's what you should be leaving on the table, but that's what you give someone who gave you excellent service, so you better damn well be prepared to reward their efforts.

2. Don't fucking punish the server for food coming out wrong/late. Demand that it be comped off your bill, and hell, give the server a little extra. Not only does that have nothing to do with your server, it usually makes us just as angry as it does you, because we know that you're getting fucked over, and that its probably going to end in us getting fucked over.

3. Any party of eight or more needs to be have gratuity applied to the bill. If you don't agree, fine, don't bring eight or more people to a restaurant. Sure, it sucks that some people need to be penalized because of others, but you need to get over it, and have some understanding. I've personally experienced it twice, and I've watched many, many others go through the anguish of waiting on twenty people, only to have them leave you absolutely nothing, which is absolutely unacceptable and preventable.

EDIT:

4. You can accuse me of whatever manner of bigotry you please - minorities need to go to fucking McDonalds. You don't tip, and I don't want to serve you.

lol this is fucking hilarious

[Cream Soda]

EDIT:

4. You can accuse me of whatever manner of bigotry you please - minorities need to go to fucking McDonalds. You don't tip, and I don't want to serve you.

They won't fire you if you refuse to serve a customer?

[Cream Soda]

Also, there IS an occasion to where it will be VERY RARE for me to tip, which is a buffet. I'm getting up, serving my own food, ect. Why am I gonna give the server any extra money? They brought me the empty cup which I go fill on my own and give me a check.

[Maaglin]

Dont know if its been posted elsewhere in the thread, but im sorry i make 100-150+ bucks for 4-5 hours of work. Why would I want to get a "real" job and take a paycut as a working grad student?

Bartenders, second only to management, have discretion (or should if the restaurant/bar is worth a damn) whether to comp or offer free items to customers/guests due to nightly spill tabs and whatnot. Happy Hours are especially busy at bars for a reason, and it sounds like they ordered food during an extremely busy rush and we're angry their server was busy.

SOP is to offer their meal comped (since you can't legally offer free alcohol in some states, here being the case im assuming) since 99% of the time that fixes everything. So id imagine that did indeed happen, and the patron is just being a jerk about it because he got arrested.

Now, however, if the server cant manage what im guessing to be a 3-4 table station during a rush...they aren't a good server and that easily explains why the server never got back for refills/table maintenence. The bartender had no business calling the police over this though.

All parties are at fault. The server for not getting someone else to check on the table, the bartender for being a jerk and calling the police, and the patrons for being typical clueless patrons.

Everyone should work a minimum 6 months as a server through high school/college. Shit like this would never happen again because people would get the fact that if you tip anything below 15% (really, 18% now though) the server doesnt make jack off that table in the end. Mandatory tips (except on parties) are dumb...but if you cant afford 18-20% then you shouldnt be eating out.

i dont' give a fuck you took a shitty job for $2 an hour because you thought somehow customers should make it up in tips.

instead, i went to college and became an electrical engineer, so you know, i could get a decent job with a satisfactory wage and benefits so i coudld sit and laugh at all you plebs that continue to keep on keepin' on as a waitress.

as a bonus, it allows me time at my real job to laugh at all you losers while im on ovetime making $80 bucks an hour about how unfair it is some customer left you a $5 tip.

all the while i get paid gobs of extra cash to live aboard and still laugh at you, where by the way, im not expeced by some fucked soical norm to tip your uneducated ass because you happen to have to cognative energy to bring a fucking plate of food to me and bother yoruself to keep my drink full.

cry me a fucking river.

did i mention in japan, the server doesn't ever come to your table after your initial seat? you hit a button after that, and then they come to you. none of the bullshit and service when you need it.

only reason bitches in the US think this bad is because they think they are great and deserve to beat the system by making mad tips with their leet service skills. then they get all up in arms when people say "fuck you, you're a dumbass for taking this job for $2 an horu and blaming it on me when you cant meet your co-ed rent payment".

[Acturus]

i dont' give a fuck you took a shitty job for $2 an hour because you thought somehow customers should make it up in tips.

instead, i went to college and became an electrical engineer, so you know, i could get a decent job with a satisfactory wage and benefits so i coudld sit and laugh at all you plebs that continue to keep on keepin' on as a waitress.

as a bonus, it allows me time at my real job to laugh at all you losers while im on ovetime making $80 bucks an hour about how unfair it is some customer left you a $5 tip.

all the while i get paid gobs of extra cash to live aboard and still laugh at you, where by the way, im not expeced by some fucked soical norm to tip your uneducated ass because you happen to have to cognative energy to bring a fucking plate of food to me and bother yoruself to keep my drink full.

cry me a fucking river.

did i mention in japan, the server doesn't ever come to your table after your initial seat? you hit a button after that, and then they come to you. none of the bullshit and service when you need it.

only reason bitches in the US think this bad is because they think they are great and deserve to beat the system by making mad tips with their leet service skills. then they get all up in arms when people say "fuck you, you're a dumbass for taking this job for $2 an horu and blaming it on me when you cant meet your co-ed rent payment".

Buscemi did it better, but you get points for trying.

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-

So, the story confused me a bit. The people who were arrested were part of a party of 7, and they were arrested for not paying 18% on top of the bill. That sounds like a mandatory fee on their bill. If that's the case, then yeah, story makes sense (see Kaparu's #3). If it was a true "tip" in appreciation for service, then the arrest is bullshit.

[Khalil]

i dont' give a fuck you took a shitty job for $2 an hour because you thought somehow customers should make it up in tips.

instead, i went to college and became an electrical engineer, so you know, i could get a decent job with a satisfactory wage and benefits so i coudld sit and laugh at all you plebs that continue to keep on keepin' on as a waitress.

as a bonus, it allows me time at my real job to laugh at all you losers while im on ovetime making $80 bucks an hour about how unfair it is some customer left you a $5 tip.

all the while i get paid gobs of extra cash to live aboard and still laugh at you, where by the way, im not expeced by some fucked soical norm to tip your uneducated ass because you happen to have to cognative energy to bring a fucking plate of food to me and bother yoruself to keep my drink full.

cry me a fucking river.

did i mention in japan, the server doesn't ever come to your table after your initial seat? you hit a button after that, and then they come to you. none of the bullshit and service when you need it.

only reason bitches in the US think this bad is because they think they are great and deserve to beat the system by making mad tips with their leet service skills. then they get all up in arms when people say "fuck you, you're a dumbass for taking this job for $2 an horu and blaming it on me when you cant meet your co-ed rent payment".

This.

Any fucking waiter or waitress who bitch and moan about getting a shitty tip or no tip should cry some more. Not our faults you're being paid below what you think is fair and have to make up the difference in gratuity. With that being said, I don't mind tipping a good waiter/waitress if she was polite and helpful but science help me if the douche will get anything from me if the service was horrible.

[Linliel]

that's such a screwed up system, lol. In AU and so far as I've discovered in Belgium, you only tip if you're feeling particularly generous and it was a good meal/service etc. Generally you round up to the nearest whatever, depending on how generous you feel. There's absolutely no requirement for it, and that's because the people make vaguely decent wages. I'll usually tip my pizza delivery guy though, if I have the change for it, cos they're usually pimply youths who could use a bit of pocket money, but in restaurants and stuff I won't tip unless it's been well beyond expected, or I couldn't be arsed waiting around for my $2.50 change lol.

[Necronus]

Saying you get paid $#.## per hour is rather misleading. Because in the end you still get more than that as you're final rate of pay. Does that mean if you hit the min wage total for the week your employer doesn't have to pay you anything?

No, your employer always pays you a base rate. Thats thing that varies from state to state and is usually if not always below minimum wage.

Now, as you said, a good server will generally make more than minimum wage after adding the base wage + tips, but should that sum be LOWER than minimum wage, the employer must make up the difference. Thus, no one can ever truly make less than minimum wage. If a server were to literally get NO tips in a pay period, the employer is obligated to pay minimum wage in full.

But don't mistake, even if you make more than minimum wage in tips alone, your employer must ALWAYS pay you the base wage.

[Cream Soda]

Hell, my brother's GF worked at an Ihop in Cali 3-4. She got minimum wage as her base + tips. She was making well over 7 bucks/hr + tips lol. Even w/o tips she was making more than my min wage back in FL I was working at the time

[Bardlet]

Yes, they are, but if you go an entire shift and make less than minimum they will argue that you made minimum throughout the entire week. Stop kidding yourself, you're not screwing anyone over but your server when you decide to take a stand against tipping. Corporate america wins, not you, and not your server, but we all know you're a worthless piece of shit already.

WTF, I spent 6 years working at a Macaroni Grill in Northern NJ, and not once did they ever make up the difference if someone's tips +$3/hr came out to less than minimum wage! D: I would've worked way more lunch shifts and less stressful Friday and Saturday nights if that was the case! (I was smart though- 5 years as a hostess, 1 year as a server... as a host I made $10/hr plus tips if I was working to-go. )

When it comes to tipping, I'm prolly the exception. While I'm understanding of the shit that goes on in the back of the house to eff up orders and whatnot, if you're not there to refill my drink when it's low or asking me after 3 bites how my food is... your tip is dropping. I always sit down planning to tip 20%, it's what happens after I sit down that determines whether or not that's gonna wind up dropping down to 10% before I leave (and as a general rule, if it's somewhere I plan on coming back to at some point, I won't tip less than 10%. If I don't plan on coming back and service is wtfhorrible, then sorry, but you're gonna get boned).

[Cream Soda]

"WTF, I spent 6 years working at a Macaroni Grill in Northern NJ, and not once did they ever make up the difference if someone's tips +$3/hr came out to less than minimum wage!"

You should speak up

[Bardlet]

"WTF, I spent 6 years working at a Macaroni Grill in Northern NJ, and not once did they ever make up the difference if someone's tips +$3/hr came out to less than minimum wage!"

You should speak up

No point in doing it now, since the last date of my employment there was June 2004 XD. (Go go getting a state job that's salaried with tenure and benefits!)

The management at my old store is the same though, so I wouldn't mind putting a call into the department of labor and workforce development here reporting them. Hell, I used to put in anonymous calls to the town's board of health at the time about the ongoing cockroach problem (and yes, it's a problem when they're climbing out of the phone and running out from the table paper when you have customers sitting at the table...).

[Cream Soda]

I used to work at YaYa's Chicken and they let me work like 35hrs a week @15 years old and my saturday/sunday shifts would go up to 12hrs (8am-9 or 10pm subtract hour break) and would frrequently go over 4hrs w/o a break (often not getting one till 6 or 7 hrs. Though, I did love the hrs, as I just wanted money, but the second I got canned, I called Child Labor Laws on their ass, lol and they had 3-4 more 15 year olds working similar shifts, who all got cut down to the minimum child labor law's worth of hours and they had to hire new ppl and shit. The manager was pissed.

[Vandalhart]

No, your employer always pays you a base rate. Thats thing that varies from state to state and is usually if not always below minimum wage.

Now, as you said, a good server will generally make more than minimum wage after adding the base wage + tips, but should that sum be LOWER than minimum wage, the employer must make up the difference. Thus, no one can ever truly make less than minimum wage. If a server were to literally get NO tips in a pay period, the employer is obligated to pay minimum wage in full.

But don't mistake, even if you make more than minimum wage in tips alone, your employer must ALWAYS pay you the base wage.

Gotcha. So your wage is your tips, with a "bonus" from your employer. I can see why people would get uppity. Globally though, that doesn't seem like it's the norm.

To me, it seems like a broken system. Too bad it's not really a field where people can unionize and change how it works.

[Cream Soda]

I used to work at YaYa's Chicken and they let me work like 35hrs a week @15 years old and my saturday/sunday shifts would go up to 12hrs (8am-9 or 10pm subtract hour break) and would frrequently go over 4hrs w/o a break (often not getting one till 6 or 7 hrs. Though, I did love the hrs, as I just wanted money, but the second I got canned, I called Child Labor Laws on their ass, lol and they had 3-4 more 15 year olds working similar shifts, who all got cut down to the minimum child labor law's worth of hours and they had to hire new ppl and shit. The manager was pissed.

lol, just looked up the child labor laws. if they're the same as when I was that age 6 years ago, then I screwed the three 15 year olds MAJOR

Minors 14 and 15:
When public school is in session, minors may work a maximum of 3 hours per day on school days and up to 8 hours per day on Saturday, 8 hours on Sunday and 8 hours on non-school days, when a school day does not follow. Remember these daily times are options as this age group is able to work only 15 hours per week (seven day period). They may work between the hours of 7 a.m. and 7 p.m. but may not work during public school hours.

When school is not in session, June 1st through Labor Day, 14 and 15 year old minors may work up to 8 hours each day and 40 hours per week between the hours of 7 a.m. and 9 p.m.

Even my school day shifts were like from 3pm till 9-10pm (as well as theirs)

Minors 16 and 17:
When public school is in session, minors 16 & 17 may not work before 6:30 a.m. or after 11 p.m. or for more than 8 hours per day, when school is scheduled the following day, nor during the hours that school is in session. These hour limitations do not apply on non-school days when a school day does not follow, during non-school weeks, and during summer vacation.
When school does not follow the next day, such as Friday, Saturday, and other days that precede a holiday, minors 16 and 17 may work until their shift is completed. Example: A minor begins work on Saturday at 6:00 p.m. and the shift ends at 1:00 a.m. Sunday morning. This is not considered a violation of the regulation that minors may not work before 6:30 a.m. when school is scheduled the following day, because the minor is completing his Saturday shift, and not beginning a work shift before 6:30 a.m. on Sunday.

These teens may work no more than 30 hours per week when school is in session.

Also screwed the 16-17 group but not as hard. We all had over 30 hrs/week so they had to have been cut down to at least that much.

[Bardlet]

Gotcha. So your wage is your tips, with a "bonus" from your employer. I can see why people would get uppity. Globally though, that doesn't seem like it's the norm.

To me, it seems like a broken system. Too bad it's not really a field where people can unionize and change how it works.

There is actually a union for food service employees. You hear pretty much nothing about it though because of the nature of how people are employed in this country when it comes to food service jobs (by that I mean, it's 9 times out of 10 high school/college age people who hold the job for a few years before moving on). When I was working as a hostess/server, I actually looked into it at some point because I was tired of how the management in my store was jerking us around.

[SilverBreeze]

I don't remember ever being screwed out of a tip when I worked as a waitress. It's not the best job in the world but it's not exactly hard either (although girls always seem to get tipped more than guys do). There's not a lot of jobs you can take at 15 years old. I saved up a lot of money for college working as a waitress, there's nothing wrong with being one.

Seriously, seat the people, be cute, smile, take their drink orders and for fucks sake get it right. Nothing spells doom for a night out like the waiter not writing down the drink order and fucking up 2 minutes after seating someone...

Bring drinks, take appetizer orders, or if they are ready to order take entree orders. If someone's drink is halfway, bring them another one and come back later and take the empty glass so they're never waiting on a drink. When you're waiting another table, keep an eye on your other tables, you'd be surprised how often someone at another table is trying to catch your eye.

If shit is slow, fucking tell them shit is slow. "I'm sorry our cook exploded your chicken, it'll be a couple more minutes, can i bring you some more <insert whatever the fuck your restaurant gives for free here> and another drink?"

Serve the food, come back 2 minutes later to see if the food is okay, if not, get to work on getting it fixed. Keep drinks filled, take dessert order if needed, if not, thank them for coming and smile and be cute. NOT HARD.

I don't think gratuity should be required (unless it's a group of like 6-8+ but at that point it should be- and called- a "large group fee", not gratuity). Some people are lousy tippers, some people tip a lot. I have no control over that, but when you work as a Waitress you should make it your goal that whenever someone leaves a crap tip, its because they were going to in the first place, not because of something you did.