Minor Beastmen/Summoner Info/Dengenki Article

[Hyan]

What would it's name be in the Japanese version then?

[Lurking Badger]

Haha, I don't know japanese. But it seemed that "miracle worker" was acceptable for alchemist, no? My point is that you are claiming the system is rigid when in fact there are many exceptions already.

Thaumaturge basically means a "miracle maker", and if that's what the class does, then it fits the pattern nicely.

You can't say this, then say that Tamer doesn't describe the class.

[Hyan]

No, I am saying that "miracle worker" is acceptable for Thaumaturge, because if that's what the class will do, "work miracles", then it works out. Magic classes aren't named for their weapon type, but for their magic type. Illusionist creates illusions, Thaumaturge creates "miracles", Druid uses nature based magic... Summoner could fit in there.

Melee classes on the other hand are named by their weapons. While crafters are named by their professions.

[Lurking Badger]

That means that you'd accept it if manipulating beasts would be a magic type this time around. Charmer if you will.

[Hyan]

Well that'd be some unusual stuff for sure at least. If it's a magic type, then it works out.

I still don't see why there's a need to lock the whole pet using into just one class though.

[Firehawk]

Just imagine every single class could use a pet..







No, Just no man ._.

[Hyan]

Yeah, imagine if you could do that in XI as a /bst. There's just, no way!

[tsaroth816]

Just imagine every single class could use a pet..







No, Just no man ._.

Ever play Rappelz? Everyone could use & level up a pet, and set up the skills for the build they wanted. But only a special class could "charm" them and sell off the tamed pet.

Hyan needs to stop arguing. Quit pretending to know how the system of how FFXIV works, you don't. Even if you have beta knowledge, things will change or be added. This argument is like saying there will be no BLU or "enemy skills" class before FFXI beta came out.

[Hyan]

This argument is like saying there will be no BLU or "enemy skills" class before FFXI beta came out.

Wrong. The job system in XI never limited the introduction of new jobs unlike the class system in XIV which seems to do exactly that. Blue Mage was actually very possible in XI from the beginning because there's no reason to not have it there really, from a job standpoint. But when you limit the classes in a way that only a weapon or magic type is applicable to be a "class", you kinda limit the options as to what kind of "classes" you can make. That is a fact.

I'm also not pretending to know how this system works, but I'm just saying that I have a pretty damn good guess (and seems that other people have come to the same conclusion, pretty much). If you don't like it, tell me where it fails. Tell me what has SE said that would make my guess wrong. I am confident in my guess, but that doesn't mean that I *know* how it will work.

Don't take it the wrong way.

[miokomioko]

Wrong. The job system in XI never limited the introduction of new jobs unlike the class system in XIV which seems to do exactly that. Blue Mage was actually very possible in XI from the beginning because there's no reason to not have it there really, from a job standpoint. But when you limit the classes in a way that only a weapon or magic type is applicable to be a "class", you kinda limit the options as to what kind of "classes" you can make. That is a fact.

I'm also not pretending to know how this system works

You're pretending your guess is better than everyone else's, which is just as good as you acting like you know.

You're entire argument about pet classes never being a possibility in the future is based upon the way current (5 or so?) announced disciplines are titled and that current equipment might determine your current abilities. Until anyone knows how exactly the armory system will be executed, stop making assumptions and arguing with the people who respond with something along the lines of "you... don't even know yet..." Because, you don't... you are guessing and simultaneously shooting down other people for contradicting you.

[Spira]

Wrong. The job system in XI never limited the introduction of new jobs unlike the class system in XIV which seems to do exactly that. Blue Mage was actually very possible in XI from the beginning because there's no reason to not have it there really, from a job standpoint. But when you limit the classes in a way that only a weapon or magic type is applicable to be a "class", you kinda limit the options as to what kind of "classes" you can make. That is a fact.

I'm also not pretending to know how this system works, but I'm just saying that I have a pretty damn good guess (and seems that other people have come to the same conclusion, pretty much). If you don't like it, tell me where it fails. Tell me what has SE said that would make my guess wrong. I am confident in my guess, but that doesn't mean that I *know* how it will work.

Don't take it the wrong way.

Wrong, it seems your guess of the fact fails.

what mioko said. ever consider that you're being tiresome from the fact that you act all superior over something you know as much or as little as us?
If you were an alpha/beta tester, I'd give u that much, but meanwhile you should really get off other peoples asses with the whole 'i'm right you're wrong' bullshit

[Khamsin]

What would it's name be in the Japanese version then?

"pet-user"?

[Hyan]

"pet-user"?

If the class uses a whip, that makes no sense.

Wrong, it seems your guess of the fact fails.

what mioko said. ever consider that you're being tiresome from the fact that you act all superior over something you know as much or as little as us?
If you were an alpha/beta tester, I'd give u that much, but meanwhile you should really get off other peoples asses with the whole 'i'm right you're wrong' bullshit

Wrong, the fact is right. My guess from that point on may not be, but hey, I never said it would be. It doesn't make sense. They may or may not continue to use the class system the way it is set up, or they can choose to not to. The fact is, that implementing pet classes to the current system would go against the naming method of the current classes. There is no argument.

And if some people actually ask me for more speculation and opinion, I am sorry for answering them. I am also sorry that if some people try to shoot down my theory I will try explaining myself further. If you take it as 'I'm right you're wrong' bullshit then come up with something better, or don't judge me. You had your own view as to what this system might be like, I'm only offering mine.

[Spira]

Firstly, the "Wrong, it seems your guess of the fact fails" statement was just me stringing together the absolutes and conditionals you were tossing around for the sake of it. just to show how annoying you are.
But it actually makes sense. You're guessing at 'facts'. Nothing given is a fact. Not even the word of the developers in past interviews, because the game is hardly finalized. Considering you've played FFXI, I'm surprised you're not aware of this. Not even beta content can be trusted all the way, and we haven't even gotten to that point yet.

That implementing pet classes to the current system would be against naming convention of current classes isn't fact either. It's assumption. In fact there really is no general pattern to it. Disciples of War are named by weapon, crafters are named by profession, mages are probably named by school of magic, and who knows what gatherers/Disciples of Land will even be. Guess at it, sure.. but pet classes (if they exist) could fall into any category (if they do at all), including the 2 we know nothing about. If you dont even know the nomenclature of those categories, there is NO fact involved in whether it defies it or not.

Secondly, i did offer my speculation, but I didn't judge you when your idea differed from it, or shoot it down. I offered probable statements, not absolutes, and quite clearly expressed that we're all pretty much in the dark until solid information is released. You however, speculate but still take the tone that you know better than all of us. And that is irritating.

[Gokulo]

Must've majored in FFXIV precognitive knowledge.

[Hyan]

That implementing pet classes to the current system would be against naming convention of current classes isn't fact either. It's assumption. In fact there really is no general pattern to it. Disciples of War are named by weapon, crafters are named by profession, mages are probably named by school of magic, and who knows what gatherers/Disciples of Land will even be. Guess at it, sure.. but pet classes (if they exist) could fall into any category (if they do at all), including the 2 we know nothing about. If you dont even know the nomenclature of those categories, there is NO fact involved in whether it defies it or not.

You are saying that there is no general pattern to it, and then list examples of why there is a pattern.

If you want me to wait until SE reveals all the classes before I'll say the same thing again, so be it. But as far as the Disciples of War go, with the current way they are named, it couldn't fall into that category.

Secondly, i did offer my speculation, but I didn't judge you when your idea differed from it, or shoot it down. I offered probable statements, not absolutes, and quite clearly expressed that we're all pretty much in the dark until solid information is released. You however, speculate but still take the tone that you know better than all of us. And that is irritating.

Please, shoot down my idea if you can. What's the whole point of this if bad ideas and assumptions aren't corrected? If someone says that "ffxiv classes will be exactly like the ones from xi only names are changed" I will tell him why I don't think so, and he might be able to look at things from a different perspective. Plus, that's the kind of thing that irritates me. People going around telling how it's "retarded" of SE to use different class names, why they didn't use the names from XI and so on. I will give them my opinion.

But really, if it came off as irritating, then I'm sorry about that. If someone tries to shoot down my idea, I will defend it. If someone asks for more in-depth opinion, then I will answer. If I think that someone else's opinion wouldn't really work in the system, I will say it (and why). Think of it as a bad thing if you want; I think it's just good. Maybe I should have used more "I think" and "IMO" words to not make me sound so high and mighty, but eh. I thought that was kinda given that it's my opinion.

[Sup3rB4d]

I don't think you get the point that it is abilities and spells that make something a "class" and that the generic names are in fact just generic names given based on weapons. As far as I know there has been a RDM in every final fantasy and they are a hybrid class that wield a small sword, yet they can still cast magic. What is stopping SE from creating an ability (charm) and making it available to whatever "small axe user" is in Japanese?

tl:dr "small-axe user"

[miokomioko]

You could simply use a little imagination and you could invent a pet class that fits with your apparently ABSOLUTE naming pattern (which is in another language).

physical: whip wielder, chair swinger, leash puller, fucking cupid's bow shooter, shit~

mage: enchanter, charmer, the pied fucking piper?!

Jesus Christburgers.

[Kaylia]

Please, shoot down my idea if you can

That's like asking "shoot down my beliefs". There is thing that can't possibly be done (unless you have contradictory beliefs).


The way I understand last two pages, no one said your ideas could not work in theory, the problem is that you used too many hypothesis to build it. We barely know anything about the "classes", or the "armory" system, so making any statement on the subject is a pure guess. Everything else is just semantics about the definition of "pet job" for a system we know nothing about.

Personally, I imagine the armory system being a mixture of FF9's ability system (can turn them on/off any time) with Diablos II skill tree. Each "job" listed would represent a tree, but anyone can pick skill from any tree, as long they have the matching weapon/armor and unlocked it previously.

[Hyan]

Doesn't make sense, but yes, it's a possibility.

Like SE deciding to release the game tomorrow. Hay, it's possible right?

That's like asking "shoot down my beliefs". There is thing that can't possibly be done unless you have contradictory beliefs).

Well, there are ideas that are more likely to be right than others. If there is something that contradicts my theory, I would really like to hear it, because then I can drop the idea because it can't be done. If it can be done, then good. That means it's a possibility.