Einherjar: To /NIN or to /DMG, that is the question

[Genrye]

Is this entire thread allergic to BLU's? 2 BLU's spamming stun pretty much takes care of dragons ands slimes :/

But what do i know, I'm usually pulling on pld.

[jammalamma]

Then why would the 40+ people stay? To split money between 40+ people? And why still do events involving rare/ex?

Unless this was a woosh...

Most =/= all. That and there's other nice benefits to being in the LS besides lotting a drop. Money is a big motivating factor sure, because even though somebody could farm all day for money this at least gives them a chance to do something more with the money they farmed other than farm more money. And there's a good chunk of the core who are motivated just by the idea of an LS alone.

As for the whole if you can win easily then why not just /NIN thing, I'd ask you what's the point? Do you get a bonus round for finishing Einherjer with X% of total cumulative MP? As far as I know, there is nothing to gain whatsoever from mages having full MP when you done besides not needing to wait for warps. But then I remember that BLM would still have to sleepga and stun and nothing would change.

Instead, I'd just flip the question. If you have support that isn't lazy or just doesn't suck, why wouldn't you just /DMG? It's really stupid to think that /DMG soaks up a bunch of MP, that's only true if half your DDs are AFK. /NIN doesn't prevent wipes unless you in some way fail at some aspect of the game, like organizing a stun order. Hell, there's people in my LS who will bitch and whine if somebody doesn't /NIN(I tell them to shut up), but they won't take the 5 minutes to explain the roles of each group or individual but instead will pull(aggro everything) and just expect everything to magically piece itself together. If you are going to wipe because you are overwhelmed with a pull, /NIN is not going to save you from that wipe. This is especially true on shit like bones. If you need /NIN to barely kill a boss, then something else is wrong with your run and support. If you want /NIN to just have full MP when the run is finished, which you should stop kidding yourself because your MP will still be depleted just the same, then there's no hope.

I get this same kind of shit when I do merits. I tell people I ride hasso full time and they immediately get turned off to the idea of healing me. Then they realize that they never get below half MP the entire party and how bored they are, so then they start doing shit like nuking instead of casting dia and that's when I tell them my cat just got hit by a truck brb.

And yeah, BLU I heard is pretty sick in the control department. Not just with stuns, but the ability to help sleep shit too. But we have more PUP than we do BLU for some reason.

But yeah, if you're losing when you /DMG to blinkable AoEs. Some aspect of your support sucks, or you're just not stunning like you should.

[Wrish]

Now what about the lag. I don't think I've ever been to stun the explosions from bombs on BLMs or DRK, simply due to lag. My log says I stuned before, but the move still goes off.

For bombs an early stun by anyone always kills ya. Practice on them outside event. Either know your chat filters or know the animation well, and stick to that method. Most people lose it to distractions, not lag. Or they assume they're network lagged when that is rarely true. You're lagged if you run at <5 fps or if you don't see the animation before everyone's dead.

Is this entire thread allergic to BLU's? 2 BLU's spamming stun pretty much takes care of dragons ands slimes

THIS. Many shell leaders default to the blm + drk stunners they use for ground, which is more efficiency impairing than forcing everyone to /nin.

But yeah, if you're losing when you /DMG to blinkable AoEs. Some aspect of your support sucks, or you're just not stunning like you should.

Window to stun fluid spread and body slam is very short, so you're encouraging many shells to hack or eat most the damage. It boils down to the win ratio. If they're at 95% wins, who am I to tell them what to sub?

If our goal was to eventually stop doing Einherjer then that would be fine. If windows didn't conflict with our events, that'd be fine too. If you're not into camping shit then the extra 10-15 minutes you save by taking in a full group of Einherjer probably doesn't mean shit to you.

Clearly that is the goal of many shells as they're not after massing ampoules, only Odin gear. And clearly if they could bring 36 people w/o buffer issues they'd tolerate a lot more /sam. If your primary goal is amassing ampoules for mules/revolving-door players/mythic upgraders before you're off to some camp, or you're really bottlenecked by player time instead of the 72hr entry restriction, you should be explicit. For most everyone else, using 36 players to shave 10-15 minutes off a 30-minute fixed-drop event you can only schedule twice a week is simply wasteful.

I tell people I ride hasso full time and they immediately get turned off to the idea of healing me. Then they realize that they never get below half MP the entire party and how bored they are, so then they start doing shit like nuking instead of casting dia and that's when I tell them my cat just got hit by a truck brb

Well, by that logic, couldn't we all /SAM as soon as we see no slimes/dragons?

Can't we be more honest. If we roll a bad healer, I start using Seigan. Or if support just sucks, I tell them straight up instead of invoking my nonexistent RL pet.

[wop]

A little late, but

Barwatera says hi. Shit helps, even with tons of e-peen relic melee.

clearly reflects

http://www.ex-online.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=1008

Really, insinuating that he couldn't get into Ex when the only reason your gimpshit ass was accepted was because your boyfriend was in it is laughable at best and pathetic at worst. It's cute watching the progression of an average gimp on here, they get in their first endgame ls and gradually start to think they're competent, then great, then they start talking down to others who they have no idea about. Care to link me to the last useful thing you've posted on here, you know, to show that you don't just talk out your ass?

You may have had an idea what endgame was like before the bans, but you certainly don't know anywhere near as much as you'd like to think.

[IronPandemonium]

I'm actually rather amazed this thread was made in 2010, especially on BG.

Only things I fear (off the top of my head, and trust me I have a pretty damn good memory for the most part) in Einherjar as the literal meat shield assist of my shell is body slam (shadow dragons and dahaks), fluid spread (slimes), and voidsong (shadow dragons and dahaks again), third of which doesn't even do damage: It's just really fucking annoying to deal with. Sonic Boom use to be one as well, but Esuna takes care of that now.

Both of those damaging moves hurt, but are easily stunable, the latter of which isn't exactly able to be caught pre-use, but just stun-locking slimes as you mow through them should be more than enough if your melee don't suck balls and therefore take forever to kill something.

Skeletons, typically the only time malediction is omg-worthy is when it uses it right at 5%~ or so and jumps back up to 30%+ HP, but honestly, throw in a single stun directly after that, and he's fucking toast.

[wop]

I'm actually rather amazed this thread was made in 2010, especially on BG.

You must've missed http://www.bluegartr.com/forum/showthread.php?t=86155

5 pages on how to deal with slimes in Dynamis-Jeuno

[IronPandemonium]

.................................................. .........

[Neoex]

hahahahah /NIN is this one big whoosh? if someone showed up to our Einherjar /nin a sackholder would break their pearl..


All of our mellee go /DMG they all use hasso.

we go with 20-26 people. we have not lost an Einherjar since I have joined the shell. (14 monthes)

bottom line if you cant afford to go /SAM and hasso, your mages suck, either being your whm curing, your bard curing/sleeping. your blm sleeping/stunning

all of our parties are 4x DD BRD + WHM


Additional note: most Einherjars we dont even see a 10 minute warning(probably because are melee are putting out so muchd amage so fast, as opposed to casting shadows being pussies)

[IronPandemonium]

probably because are melee are putting out so muchd amage so fast

Elaborate troll?

Would you merit with one, or two bards (or a alternatively a brd and a cor).

Probably trolling.

[Neoex]

Elaborate troll?

Would you merit with one, or two bards (or a alternatively a brd and a cor).

Probably trolling.

brd + cor + rdm 3 DD or brd brd cor 3 DD (outside rdm)

[IronPandemonium]

I prefer BRD BRD/COR RDM DD DD WHM/DD in my einherjar, but that works too.

[Feedmenow]

Elaborate troll?

Probably not, most einherjar tier runs are 1/3 split between 1-3 if you have a good winning rate, and T1s and most T2s it's very possible for you to clear with time to spare.

Also, I saw whirl of rage mentioned a while back in this thread. Where the fuck are evil weapons in einharjar? If we're talking about general usage for /nin, then fine.

Favorite setup for einherjar parties specifically is WHM, RDM or DD, BRD, DDx3 and the BRD swaps with another party's BRD for double songs. I go /sam, and if the party is set up with a RDM, roll with rune chopper. On small and weak clusters of mobs I just run through with hasso+retaliation, on stuff that will do moderate damage I put up seigan and third eye before WSing. Slimes, Clots, and Dahaks do suck horribly, though.

[Neoex]

I prefer BRD BRD/COR RDM DD DD WHM/DD in my einherjar, but that works too.

For both Einherjar and Dynamis

we use 4x DD WHM and BRD in our melee parties..

We have been very succesful with somewhat low numbers. had 36 drops in dynamis bubrina last week, havent lost a Einherjar in well over 14 monthes.

Our numbers stay pretty consistent between 22-26 with dips/spikes 18-30


I would say the most stressful job to play for us is WHM, alot of pressure is put on our WHM but they usually meet the challenge.

[jammalamma]

Probably not, most einherjar tier runs are 1/3 split between 1-3 if you have a good winning rate, and T1s and most T2s it's very possible for you to clear with time to spare.

Also, I saw whirl of rage mentioned a while back in this thread. Where the fuck are weapons in Einherjar?

The guy was speaking about the benefit of utsusemi in general when he listed that. I mean, he even listed wild rage or whatever. Who /NINs to KV or Serket besides like pld? =(

As for PT setups, we usually keep a full BRD rotation going for the whole run unless we get something like skeles. Gives me the chance to make an official "Never Allowed to be Party Leader" list.

[ZhiGaruda]

The guy was speaking about the benefit of utsusemi in general when he listed that. I mean, he even listed wild rage or whatever. Who /NINs to KV or Serket besides like pld? =(

As for PT setups, we usually keep a full BRD rotation going for the whole run unless we get something like skeles. Gives me the chance to make an official "Never Allowed to be Party Leader" list.

First citing /NIN as being useless for DD's in end game, now bringing PLD's to KV..

Is this one big nightmare? Did I not wake up this morning? You have to be one of the true morons of this game.

[Feedmenow]

The guy was speaking about the benefit of utsusemi in general when he listed that. I mean, he even listed wild rage or whatever. Who /NINs to KV or Serket besides like pld? =(

/NIN is pretty badass for some areas, man. I can't imagine having /DMG subs to meleeburn Dynamis-Buburimu when you hit Tarasca, Barong, or Nightmare Rarabs. Might be nice for the Cockatrice when you get muted, but otherwise I'd much rather be /NIN than /SAM for that zone.

[Neoex]

/NIN is pretty badass for some areas, man. I can't imagine having /DMG subs to meleeburn Dynamis-Buburimu when you hit Tarasca, Barong, or Nightmare Rarabs. Might be nice for the Cockatrice when you get muted, but otherwise I'd much rather be /NIN than /SAM for that zone.

we do it every single time. its not bad at all. cant remember the last time we even had a wipe at Buburina, and we pull some massive pulls

[Feedmenow]

we do it every single time. its not bad at all. cant remember the last time we even had a wipe at Buburina, and we pull some massive pulls

How do you handle those specific mobs?

[Neoex]

How do you handle those specific mobs?

The general premise is, everything dies so fast it doesnt have time do use anything extremely painful more than once.

As a point of reference on Nightmare_Hippogryph's in Valkrum, we usually kill 20-30 and I probably will loose my food 1 time from the dispel AOE.

Have you ever noticed being a healer in a merit party if one of the melee goes afk you start burning through alot more MP as the kills are slower?

The NQ mobs pretty much get a stun thrown at 80% at that lasts till its dead,from playing BLM I would say 90% of the mobs die in less than 8 seconds. ( my tier4 nukes never go off)


The mobs that are MOST challenging in dynamis, are the Diremites in Qufim, and the Sabotenders in Valkrum(we ask blm to stun big needle moves instead of trying to nuke) but my previous linkshells got destroyed by those or just wouldnt even do them period.

[jammalamma]

First citing /NIN as being useless for DD's in end game, now bringing PLD's to KV..

Is this one big nightmare? Did I not wake up this morning? You have to be one of the true morons of this game.

I thought you gave up. You should have stayed down.