People and their gearscore

[Onorgul]

What would constitute skill, exactly? The several items noted above are more complex than FFXI's model of "Just hit things until they die, unless you're the tank, then cast Utsusemi/Flash/Stun once in a while." Yeah, soloing Suzaku as a Red Mage requires a certain amount of skill (in terms of writing macros and having the necessary gear, mostly), but it's hardly the focus of the game and more analogous to 0-light Yogg-Saron than 10-man Lord Jaraxxus normal mode.

I played Warhammer: Age of Reckoning for a while and the only thing that could really be called skill was knowing when to dump boiling oil on the idiot Order forces sitting outside the front gate of your keep. I'm exaggerating a bit, of course, but even PvP becomes a predictable encounter once you're familiar with each class's abilities and counters.

I even played a text-based MUD for a while. I played a Monk and all of my various skills involved typing out commands of not just what to use on whom, but also indicating where on their body to hit them. I shocked a few people by how well I was able to fight because I actually did this. Then they introduced me to a client where I could set up keybound macros and I became a force unstoppable (used the number pad to indicate parts of the body, 8 for head, 5 for the torso, etc.).

What is skill in a video game? Even people who play fighting games or RTS on a semi-pro kind of level are essentially relying on muscle memory as much as anything else. The only time player skill has a chance to show itself (or not) is when shit goes wrong. I did Heroic Pit of Saron several weeks ago in which the tank was somehow able to be gibbed in the first 5 seconds of the fight, so the Hunter and I kited Tyrannus back and forth, using aggro dumps to bounce hate. We nearly had him, too, which is rather absurd if you think about it. It probably qualifies as skill, but is it important to be able to do that? It's only long hours of soloing things that I wasn't meant to solo which taught me how to do that.

I dunno. People get into such a huff when the word "skill" appears in relation to MMOs. It's a matter of relative skill. It's a game, of course no one is expected to have the dexterity of an Olympic gymnast or the finesse of a neurosurgeon.

[Plow]

Very, very simple.

Skill is in not making mistakes.

Less mistakes = more skill.

More mistakes = less skill.

It really, seriously is that simple.

[Knyghtmayre]

Mainly, to me, skill is knowing what to do and effectively doing it. It can be something as simple as gear or gem choices or something as huge as being able to avoid the environment during a boss fight.

[Kaylia]

I dunno. People get into such a huff when the word "skill" appears in relation to MMOs. It's a matter of relative skill. It's a game, of course no one is expected to have the dexterity of an Olympic gymnast or the finesse of a neurosurgeon.

Made me laugh, but it's true.



Personally, if I talk about "skill" in mmo, it's when a person is able to react properly when shit hit the fan, or adapt his strategy to match the situation. Someone skilled will be able to use every tools when the situation arise.

As an example, how many paladin uses "turn evil" in fights like faction champion or HoR (when your group is shitty and need a little help)? Use Divine shield/divine protection efficiently, save the right person with lay on hands, use hand of sacrifice/hands of protection, etc.

I can't say I'm a good paladin yet ( havent played that much), but I'm conscious of the tools I have, and I'm generally able to use them to make the fight go better. Most players I encounter in PUG shutdown their brain the moment something unexpected happens, and they have no global vision of the encounter. They tank, they heal or they dps...nothing else.

[rithridan]

huh, I didn't know the faction champions are considered Undead or Demon types. Did you mean Repetance instead? With all the "Hands of" spells I'm not very good myself, I have a huge lack of room to include all those spells. I should also really look into some target=mouseover (or something) macros for a lot of spells I cast. Right now I still need to select someone else before I could possible use Lay on Hands on them, which is a bitch if you are trying to tank something at the same time.

[Meresgi]

Skill in an MMO is just basically class knowledge. If you know the ins and outs of the class you're playing then you're skilled. I had a fun heroic Forge of Souls run on my Blood DK tank when all the dps took the directional beam to their faces and all died, then the healer died. I ended up having to solo the boss from 35% hp to 0%. Which really isnt that hard when you have self heals, interrupts, and magic defensive CDs.

[Kaylia]

Double post.

[Kaylia]

huh, I didn't know the faction champions are considered Undead or Demon types. Did you mean Repetance instead? With all the "Hands of" spells I'm not very good myself, I have a huge lack of room to include all those spells. I should also really look into some target=mouseover (or something) macros for a lot of spells I cast. Right now I still need to select someone else before I could possible use Lay on Hands on them, which is a bitch if you are trying to tank something at the same time.

I was talking about Turn Evil on the Warlock pet, sorry for not specifying. I know it's not much, but considering my classes isnt very useful in that fight, anything I can do help.



Concerning "hands of spell", you could give Grid + Clique a shot. Personally, it's the best combo I found for tanking. There might be better out there, but it's doing the job for me.


(my grid changed a bit since that picture, but it's essentially the same)
http://img24.imageshack.us/img24/5395/gridz.jpg


Middle click on the UI = Righteous defense (red dot tell me who have aggro, so I can mindlessly taunt monsters off people)
Shift + middle click = Hand of salvation (just make sure you know who is the other tank beforehand to not accidently fuck up)
Alt + middle click = Hand of sacrifice
Right click = holy light
Shift + Right = Hand of protection


It's relatively easy to setup, and everything situational are one click away. since the interface is very easy to read, I can react quickly enough most of the time.

[Lucavi]

Did my first ICC10 group the other day. Two healers, me(pally) and a priest. My gearscore at the time was 4300, the priest's was 5400. Priest had 2.9k SP where I had 2k SP. Overall healing by me, 53%. Gearscore is retarded.

Humans are always looking for the newest way to judge others. Some do it to ensure a smooth night, while others do it for the thrill of being able to oogle someone higher than them, while laughing at someone lower than them.

Gearscore has its uses, just like achievement searching and armorying had their uses. Gearscore is just the next rung up the ladder, that's all.

[Loziel]

All I pray is that the retarded 12 year old, ragequit after 1 death, gearscore hugging morons do not find there way to FFXIV. WoW is a great game but the community ruins that shit.

I truly hope that SE can maintain the Skill > Gear Ratio for their next attempt.

[Eaglestrike]

All I pray is that the retarded 12 year old, ragequit after 1 death, gearscore hugging morons do not find there way to FFXIV. WoW is a great game but the community ruins that shit.

I truly hope that SE can maintain the Skill > Gear Ratio for their next attempt.

It's a double edged sword really. The community is shit, but the hugeness of the community is also what makes the game so enjoyable. You don't have to seek for hours to get a mission done or find a BCNM group...

[Norellicus]

My experience with MMOs (and games in general) has taught me that there will always be a certain percent share of the populous that is, simply put, bad; if that can be mitigated by supersaturating the total populous so that the sum total of good players is high enough to allow wide exposure and flexibility, so be it.

[Keria]

so the other day i did pug ic10 on my moooooonkin, they wanted 5k GS and i was like GTFO, 4.8k is good enough. So they were like "lol u gonna be carried", get there and raid leader is fury war in blues apart from 2pc t9 and 0 gems/enchants

i was top dps because the rest were afk fapping to their gearscore or something, i stayed anyway for the lols/frost till saurfang.

best part: wiping to dark reckoning on deathwhisper trash because 9/10 members were drooling retards and the 10th never got marked (hi)

2nd best part: "I got 5.5k gs this is gonna b easy lol" prot pala trying to tank deathwhisper in phase 1 instead of picking up adds, then doing it again a 2nd time, then the 3rd time pulling deathwhisper out of range of healers in phase 2, then going straight over to the horde ship as soon as gunship event started, and wondering how he died

next reset, resto druid who began the exploding skull raid wiping shit on those high priests is all "lfm ic10, 5k+ GS". i asked a friend with the addon to check him for lols and his was 4.4k (not to mention he was a shit healer who was casting rank fucking 13 rejuvenation till i yelled at him)

i guess the moral of this tale is that gearscore is lazy man's aids, inb4 riveting tale chap.

ps gs is not a rung up any ladder, i can put on mp5/int trinkets as moonkin, or moonkin hat/cape/boots as tree, or lolNibelung on mage, and watch it go up, you are going to have to actually look at their gear anyway to determine if it is any good.

[seph32]

Few weeks back when it was Naxx weekly I saw someone in trade
[2] [Someguy] LF Naxx 10 2800++ GS only, link achievements.

lolwut, Naxx is really hard. Some people are retarded he was serious about it too

[Kaylia]

Few weeks back when it was Naxx weekly I saw someone in trade
[2] [Someguy] LF Naxx 10 2800++ GS only, link achievements.

lolwut, Naxx is really hard. Some people are retarded he was serious about it too

Can still wipe if people don't know the fight.


I havent been able to complete any Naxx in 6-7 attempt. People never lasted through the whole instance.

[Onorgul]

Few weeks back when it was Naxx weekly I saw someone in trade
[2] [Someguy] LF Naxx 10 2800++ GS only, link achievements.

lolwut, Naxx is really hard. Some people are retarded he was serious about it too

Um, unless he's using WoW-Heroes's version of gear scoring (at which point 2800 is what you need for ICC25), he's basically just asking for people to be decently geared. My brand-new, just-hit-80 Warrior has 3200 GearScore in a random assortment of blues, a couple crafted epics (Titansteel tank gear), and a couple green trinkets. If anything, I'd call that guy reasonable except that no one should have Naxx achievements with GS that low.

[Plow]

yeah I saw one the other day where the guy was asking for 4k gs for XT weekly

I wasn't sure if I should be impressed that he's not being completely retarded with gs, or disgusted that people would actually need to be concerned about gs for 10 man easy mode XT.

[solsirt]

Entire trade chat had fun with one guy yesterday:
"LFM ICC10 4.8k GS required"

His GS = 4.6k with only half of his stuff enchanted or gem'd

His response was "gs isn't everything, I'm a DK and can do the DPS of someone in 4.8k" At least most of the flaming was funny after that.

IMHO - if I'm going to PUG, then I'm sure some people will get carried. If a GS addon can in anyway limit the number of people carried then good. It has a purpose.

People who completely ignore and bash GS are normally just as retarded as the people who take it as the bible.

[Siniroth]

Except for the part where there's a difference between simply ignoring GS and ignoring GS but also seeing if people know what they're doing and if their gear isn't stupid (I can inflate my GS by throwing on PVP gear easily)

[seph32]

"[2] [Trade] LF1M tank H random!!! Fast Run, Be Geared pls, 2600+ gs!!!! PST"