So Square might have trolled the world.

**Lebzile** · 2010-02-20 12:10

Revent Wings was a so-so game in my opinion, it was fun for a while but after you build up your army you can basically just sick them on the main guy you have to beat and go afk. Just not my style I guess, still was a good game none-the-less.

**Imitarate** · 2010-02-20 13:10

Character development in Revenant Wings was better than in the main game, and that's not really a glowing recommendation.

My problem with 12 was always that Vaan is a spectator. If they hadn't tried to go in two directions (political drama AND high fantasy save the world romp), it could have been a lot cleaner. Vaan does nothing in the -story- after the prologue. If Ashe had been the main character from the beginning, there could have been a more direct political story -- you, playing from the perspective of someone actually in a position to deal with the major forces at play. There could still have been the Fantasy elements, I thought the Occuria were an interesting idea (even the corrupted one; hell, that gave us possibly the best character, Evil Cid). If you're going to make a Luke Skywalker character, you have to give him a Darth Vader -- Vaan has nothing like that, nothing to keep him attatched to the story except tagging along (even Penelo has the little Arcadian prince as a friend to keep her involved). The game had its moments, but the focus was fucked from the get-go.

**Charismatic** · 2010-02-20 13:19

Originally Posted by TacoTaru

I'd be inclined to think you're just trolling, but you think FF12 is the best Final Fantasy so........

And why wouldn't it be?
No one can ever come up with a clear-cut argument that makes sense as to why it isn't a good game.
Everyone's arguments basically end up boiling down to "it was different so I didn't like it"

**Charismatic** · 2010-02-20 13:20

Originally Posted by Leb

Revent Wings was a so-so game in my opinion, it was fun for a while but after you build up your army you can basically just sick them on the main guy you have to beat and go afk. Just not my style I guess, still was a good game none-the-less.

lol, try that on Mydia... you'll get wrecked so fucking fast

**Xno Kappa** · 2010-02-20 13:26

How does anyone even praise FFXII's story-line? The majority of characters were cardboard cut-out builds of a stereotype that can be easily interchanged with one another. A plot fails horribly when you root for the antagonist more then you do your own characters in my opinion.

**Darus Grey** · 2010-02-20 13:36

Originally Posted by Exoduso

There is no reason to say that an icicle in the chest would kill someone in the world of FF8, much like you can raise someone with a phoenix down after they get hit with a meteor spell...

It's FF, everything goes I suppose. I do agree that shit goes crazy after CD1, but I still doubt they'd have us going through 3 CDs of Squall's imagination.
Although it WOULD explain the randomness that is Esthar.

Not that this changes anything, but there is no resurrection spells in the FF universe.

Raise raises you from unconsciousness, but once you're dead, you're dead.

Notice in every single game in the series it states either you went unconscious or that raise lifts you from unconscious/down status?

Just saying that when you die, you die, and in all strangeness it's one of the few things S/E has been really consistent about, there's a reason you didn't just throw a phoenix down on Aerith and move on.

**Elcura** · 2010-02-20 14:01

Originally Posted by Hirokei Kiaza

How does anyone even praise FFXII's story-line? The majority of characters were cardboard cut-out builds of a stereotype that can be easily interchanged with one another. A plot fails horribly when you root for the antagonist more then you do your own characters in my opinion.

All characters can be boiled down to stereotypes if you try.

**Lebzile** · 2010-02-20 14:03

Originally Posted by Domon Kasshu

lol, try that on Mydia... you'll get wrecked so fucking fast

I did and I beat her, maybe I just had a horribly overpowered/overleveled team? I haven't played it since it first came out.

**Exoduso** · 2010-02-20 14:40

Is there a reason this topic keeps referring back to that god-awful FF12?

And..

Originally Posted by Darus Grey

Not that this changes anything, but there is no resurrection spells in the FF universe.

Raise raises you from unconsciousness, but once you're dead, you're dead.

Notice in every single game in the series it states either you went unconscious or that raise lifts you from unconscious/down status?

Just saying that when you die, you die, and in all strangeness it's one of the few things S/E has been really consistent about, there's a reason you didn't just throw a phoenix down on Aerith and move on.

Alright, but then why would an icicle kill you, but a meteor won't? I think people are reading too much into that attack..

**Mayareira** · 2010-02-20 14:43

Originally Posted by Lucavi

Just a correction: while I love Sakimoto and have since Chrono Trigger, I have to do justice. Masaharu Iwata was the composer for FFT, and tore that game to shreds with some of the best music to hit the PS1.

Actually, Sakimoto did the most of the work with FFT. Got to give credit to Iwata as well of course.
But either way, I agree. It had an incredible soundrack overall.

**Fereydoon** · 2010-02-20 17:00

Originally Posted by Exoduso

Is there a reason this topic keeps referring back to that god-awful FF12?

And..

Alright, but then why would an icicle kill you, but a meteor won't? I think people are reading too much into that attack..

Don't click link in spoiler if you like your free time.

Spoiler: show

**Exoduso** · 2010-02-20 17:07

Originally Posted by fereydoon

Don't click link in spoiler if you like your free time.

Spoiler: show

lol he didn't die though... the fact that someone is trying to connect dots to make it appear as if the story was originally designed by the writers so that Squall dies at the end of the first CD1 and everything else is his imagination, doesn't make it right. Neither is the Ultimecia=Rinoa theory (which, again, makes a lot more sense than Squall actually dying at the end of the first disc..)

**Elcura** · 2010-02-20 17:46

Squall has a vivid fucking imagination if the game past disc 1 was a dream. Besides that, dead people don't dream.

**Lucavi** · 2010-02-20 17:49

Originally Posted by Mayareira

Actually, Sakimoto did the most of the work with FFT. Got to give credit to Iwata as well of course.
But either way, I agree. It had an incredible soundrack overall.

Seriously? Damn, I hardly recognized his style with songs like "The Pervert" and "Backfire", but damn, that just reinforces his legacy as one hell of a composer even more.

**Lucavi** · 2010-02-20 17:49

Originally Posted by Elcura

Squall has a vivid fucking imagination if the game past disc 1 was a dream. Besides that, dead people don't dream.

Double post, but tell that to the Fayth of FFX. They did a shitload of dreaming for a bunch of corpses.

**Elcura** · 2010-02-20 17:51

Sure, but FFX isn't FFVIII, so that much doesn't really matter lol

**Lucavi** · 2010-02-20 17:53

A valid point. Curses.

**Darus Grey** · 2010-02-20 18:08

Originally Posted by Exoduso

lol he didn't die though... the fact that someone is trying to connect dots to make it appear as if the story was originally designed by the writers so that Squall dies at the end of the first CD1 and everything else is his imagination, doesn't make it right. Neither is the Ultimecia=Rinoa theory (which, again, makes a lot more sense than Squall actually dying at the end of the first disc..)

Squall dying makes perfect sense, the whole hypothesis is sound, the issue being you can't prove something as ethereal as "The writers intentions"...without...you know...asking them directly.

As for meteor vs icicle? Well, why would a sword thrust kill you then? You simply have to accept that justification for death cannot exist within the scope of the game's combat system...

Because every death in FF happens in a cutscene... Kinda like Squall..., just sayin.

**Kerberoz** · 2010-02-20 18:09

So a sword through the back causing permanent death isn't strange but an icicle through the front is? Death in FF is a plot device. It happens when it's supposed to happen, not when it's logical.

Originally Posted by Elcura

Squall has a vivid fucking imagination if the game past disc 1 was a dream. Besides that, dead people don't dream.

Dying people do. See:

Spoiler: show

**Exoduso** · 2010-02-20 18:12

It's a pretty damn long dream for a guy that just got an icicle go in and out of his chest, and is rapidly falling to the floor from pretty high up...

just saying..

edit: and yeah, talk about a vivid imagination... he dreams in his dream too, since he dreams about laguna as well.

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