Ron Paul Owns CPAC 2010, FOX is not pleased

[Kuya]

The Dems just proposed a jobs bill full of tax cuts.

[ephel]

What is the normal tax rate for Canada?

edit: Was under the impression Dems said they had to raise taxes to accomplish their goals.

[guartz]

Allow me to summarize leif.

derp de durp derp.

[MF Perm tha Fineass]

What is the normal tax rate for Canada?

edit: Was under the impression Dems said they had to raise taxes to accomplish their goals.

a creationist trying to understand taxes and politics. holy shit lol

[Elvis]

How many of those guys regularly engage in genocide, constantly seek nuclear weapons, and try to launch attacks on US interests.

I'm pretty sure Iran and North Korea are the big ones. Last time I checked, those were named in the Axis of Evil.

There are plenty of countries that seek nuclear weapons. We don't care whether Israel has them or not, even tho it's against our own rules to send them aide if they possess them.

Oh and we supported the various military juntas in Guatemala, directly and by proxy (Israel), which carried out a genocide against the indigenous Mayans. There are other tyrants we've supported that have killed tons of people and who have been accused of genocide, like Suharto.

We even preferred Hitler as a 'moderate' at one point, because fascism used to be merely another form of social organization.

The only reason for the Iraq War, is that it's not in our interests to contend w/ an independent Middle East.

We supported Saddam previously. Blah blah blah you're full of shit as always.

[Olo401]

lol engage in genocide? Last time I looked, Iran & North Korea weren't involved in that kind of thing.

...but our best buddy Israel? They're doing something pretty damn close to it.

[Kerberoz]

Like we give a shit about genocide. Hi, Turkey!

[SwampdonkeyPLD]

there's a quite valid argument that, while the mainstream democratic leadership is not strongly enough representing their constituents' (and populace in general) interests, the GOP obstructionism is playing a large part in blocking it. Orginally, Obama was an advocate of at least some sort of public option; now we are left to support a caucus of congressmen who actually do advocate for what we want. the BG left generally recognizes that; I've seen multiple laments over no public option.

we're gonna see this come to a head soon because the GOP will not break the obstructionist behavior. at that point reconciliation is the only option for ANY reform, so we'll see if the Dems will nut up and ram a worthwhile bill through, and then get to take credit for it being successful (kinda like the stimulus; regardless of the specifics of how it worked and didn't work, the state of the economy speaks as it does- depression avoided, now on the path back to job growth, with a recovered stock market).

I suppose they need to realize that they will lose some ground in the midterm, but a finished Iraq, recovered and growing economy, DADT repeal, and successful healthcare reform should be cause for a resurgence in 12. And it will keep further-left liberals rightfully content with progress.

Also, I'm glad to hear you're past the "dems are bad too" stage you seemed to be on during the initial round of Obama disappointments.

You guys call leif an idiot, but at least he can do math.

Had 60 votes in senate, dem president, + majority in the house yet it's the GOP's obstructionism that prevented healthcare from passing. And even still, the Dem's can just use reconciliation.

[ephel]

a creationist trying to understand taxes and politics. holy shit lol

My religious beliefs have nothing to do with taxes or politics.

[Beckwin]

it's like you tried to miss the point.

I've stated quite clearly that the dems did not pursue strongly enough, and this was also compounded by blue dogs. However, it's pretty absurd in politics to require 100% party unity to pass a bill; logically there should be some dissent within parties, as not all democrats are the same all over the country and neither are republicans (for example, there are gay and religiously moderate republicans who want DADT repealed).

[Zilong]

that's bullshit, everything is in black and white!

[ephel]

it's like you tried to miss the point.

I've stated quite clearly that the dems did not pursue strongly enough, and this was also compounded by blue dogs. However, it's pretty absurd in politics to require 100% party unity to pass a bill; logically there should be some dissent within parties, as not all democrats are the same all over the country and neither are republicans (for example, there are gay and religiously moderate republicans who want DADT repealed).

Thats a valid point but before it was GOP blocking it and now its the Dems maybe didn't all agree.

[Zilong]

Thats a valid point but before it was GOP blocking it and now its the Dems maybe didn't all agree.

They had douchebags like lieberman, and those senators that wouldnt support the healthcare bill unless they get some blowjob package for their states.

[Acturus]

Thats a valid point but before it was GOP blocking it and now its the Dems maybe didn't all agree.

Except it's not a "then" and "now" situation. The dems weren't unified from the get-go.

For right or wrong, the Republican opposition was significantly less impactful than the lack of uniformity amongst the democrats as it pertained to the issue of early legislation pushed by Obama.

[willriker]

They had douchebags like lieberman, and those senators that wouldnt support the healthcare bill unless they get some blowjob package for their states.

Leiberman is the senator for Connecticut. The state that is also known as the insurance capital of the world. Having him be a dick was no suprize.

[Kyreth]

Originally Posted by Zealot View Post
Invading Iraq had nothing to do with 9/11 or WMDs or what have you. It destabilized the region and created a terrorist breeding ground for terrorists who would do something we could understand - attack our troops. That way they're not attacking civilian targets in America and we have a chance to fight them in a way our commanders understand.

Iraq is just a casualty in the process.

Wait, so by going in to a country, taking out its Al Quada-collaborating government, freeing its people, and killing terrorists we have...

"created a terrorist breeding ground!"

I'm sorry. What?

You seem to have mistaken Iraq for Afghanistan, Leif. Y'know, the country we went into, taking out it's Al-Quaeda collaborating government, freeing it's people and killing terrorists. That's a breeding ground for terrorists.

Iraq would be the country we went into, blew away it's petty tyrant, attracted tons of jihadists looking for easier American targets, and made plentiful numbers of angry Iraqis who decided we were the enemy and started making bombs. Destabilized the entire region.

It wasn't a breeding ground for terrorists seeking to use the USA for target practice. Till we invaded, anyway. NOW it is, at least until we GTFO again after spending billions in cash and thousands in dead Americans that would have been far better used crushing the Afghanistan problem.

You'd think we'd know better- strategically speaking, it's fucking stupid to fight a war on two fronts when you can destroy each opponent far easier one at a time. I think you and I agree that the most precious thing we lose out there are the men and women of our armed forces. Why the hell did we open a second conflict when the Afghanistan war was hot, active, and begging for the application of overwhelming force?

[Zilong]

oil

[Beckwin]

it's both, ephel. for one it's not even accurate to call what the dems had a supermajority when it all hinged on Lieberman, who has all but changed his affiliation to GOP (he fucking campaigned for McCain, for cryin out loud).

having a supermajority is one thing, requiring it is another.

[SwampdonkeyPLD]

it's both, ephel. for one it's not even accurate to call what the dems had a supermajority when it all hinged on Lieberman, who has all but changed his affiliation to GOP (he fucking campaigned for McCain, for cryin out loud).

having a supermajority is one thing, requiring it is another.

Doesn't matter, they still had/have reconciliation.

[ephel]

oil

I remember when gas was a dollar /cry