Education in America?

[Nightplague]

Right, so I'm from Sweden and being in my early 20's I'm all over finding the right university etc etc. Currently aiming for International Bar Managment programme because going out and studying abroad is just that great.

Now, in Sweden, education is practically free. we have an organisation called CSN, from which we get additional.. allowances (bear with me, I don't recall all the proper terms so I'm just a bit creative). There is also funds to be aquired from social service branches and then on top of all this, student loans, which is used by most people who continues to study on university level. Those actual loans are the only thing you'll ever need to pay back (not taking taxes into the calculation).

Basically, if I sometime suddenly decide that I want to go back to the schoolbench, I can do so at a few months worth of notice.

Then you hear about american students and how parents save up for college even as the kids are infants. Is that just for really classy schools like Harvard or something, or is it just how it is, if you want higher education? And what does it cost, really?

[kuronosan]

Parents do that so that students can avoid having to get student loans or grants, or at least to reduce the amounts they borrow.

It's easy to save so that your children can go to the school they want to go to. I know I'd love to save so that I can send my kids to college but honestly unless you're sending them to an Ivy-League school (you know, one of those that doesn't have a basketball team but pays you $100,000 for your degree just because you have it on your resume) it doesn't really cost that much.

Most of the cost of universities over here comes from two things - out of state tuition (non-resident) or room and board. If you don't worry about either of those, you cut about 60% of the cost down immediately.

For example, it might cost $5000 a semester at the University of the United States. Room and board are an additional $8000. Out-of-state tuition fees tack on another $2000-3000. By the time you have your bill, you are paying almost $17000 a semester, or maybe even $34000 a year.

Fees add up quickly, so it's just smart to plan ahead and know where you can get a good education without selling the farm.

[Izzy]

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/03/13/ed...n/13texas.html - Texas Conservatives pass schoolbook reform

I'll just leave this here regarding education in America.

On topic: College is wicked expensive, but you can always get loans to pay for it at the time you get in. Florida, for example, paid for 75% of my tuition just because my GPA was above 3.2 or something. A lot of the loans are at no/very little interest rate as well.

[Mizango]

Must not rage...

[Izzy]

Must not rage...

[Woozie]

Around here, when we apply for government financial aid, we get something called "EFC", which stands for "expected family contribution". Basically it's the amount of money the government expects the family to pay out of pocket.

If the parents make a decent salary, the government expects the family to pay a decent amount of cash. We normally get a certain amount of loans and grants from the government based on income, scholarships to pay for some of the costs, and private loans or cash to offset the rest. Higher EFC means less government aid (meaning less grants, which is free college money, and less government loans, which are better than private loans).

I can't really say much about college funds and stuff because I grew up poor, never had a college fund, my EFC was $0, I was eligible for max grants and stuff, and I'm black, meaning scholarships are easy to come by.

From what I understand, parents save up so that when time comes for their kids to go to college they're not suddenly overwhelmed with bills and their kids don't have to take out too many private loans.

Edit: No, saving up for college isn't just for expensive schools like Harvard and such. Pretty much any parents can save up college money will do so.

[Pantimic]

It really is that way. Depending on the kind of university, you are looking at 3,000 to an upwards of 60,000 (though this is rarer) a year in tuition alone. State schools tend to be cheaper, however, private schools tend to offer more financial aid if they really want you. Most kids nowadays get through college through FAFSA. This gives out low interest loans to those who qualify. At least a few states have grant issuing branches, such as California's Cal Grant system.

I go to a state school in California. However, their system is a bit more complicated. There are both state schools called CSU (California State Universities) as well as UC schools (University of California). CSU's are much cheaper than UC's, however the caliber of education is considered to be less. As a CSU student, I pay slightly less than 6,000 a year for tuition. My girlfriend goes to a UC and is an out of state student, and she winds up paying somewhere around 52,000 a year with housing. Had she been an in-state student, her costs would have been halved.

Private schools are where the tuition costs can get a little insane. Schools like Stanford, Colombia, USD, and so forth can break most anyone's bank. Some have extensive programs to reach out to the less fortunate that are accepted, but most of the time they are filled with rich kids or kids whose parents go all out in making sure they can attend. I know Harvard has a new pro-rated tuition program in which families making a certain amount of money or less get in for free, while another bracket of family incomes above that pay a certain percentage of their income.

There are plenty of scholarship opportunities available across a gambit of qualifying factors. Anywhere from your participating religion to what gun club you are a member of can land you a pretty scholarship. Most schools have scholarship and grant offices that help students find and apply for what scholarships are most appropriate for individuals. Also, most schools have plenty of jobs available exclusively for students in order to help them pay for their costs. Sometimes this is called work study, however, not all schools participate in that particular program.

[gt_killa]

Is there like a max number for EFC ? Do you know what're the range of the EFC?

[Woozie]

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/03/13/ed...n/13texas.html - Texas Conservatives pass schoolbook reform

I don't understand Texas. Don't they have a huge hispanic population? I thought hispanics typically voted democratic? Or are they like black people (i.e. don't vote at all)?

[Mizango]

Most Mexicans vote Republican actually, I was there for the last elections and they were going HARD for McCain'd old ass. Guess it has something to do with him living in and representing Mexico Lite aka Arizona.

Now sure ifs its the religion thing or if it has to do with the thought that Republicans will not build a fence, but they generally don't like Dems.

[Olo401]

Right, so I'm from Sweden and being in my early 20's I'm all over finding the right university etc etc. Currently aiming for International Bar Managment programme because going out and studying abroad is just that great.

Now, in Sweden, education is practically free. we have an organisation called CSN, from which we get additional.. allowances (bear with me, I don't recall all the proper terms so I'm just a bit creative). There is also funds to be aquired from social service branches and then on top of all this, student loans, which is used by most people who continues to study on university level. Those actual loans are the only thing you'll ever need to pay back (not taking taxes into the calculation).

That's similar to how it's done here in public education actually - attending school is essentially free (funded via state & municipal property taxes) and higher education is pay-to-play (most people get a combo of loans & scholarships/grants).

Then you hear about american students and how parents save up for college even as the kids are infants. Is that just for really classy schools like Harvard or something, or is it just how it is, if you want higher education? And what does it cost, really?

It's pretty much everything. The cost of a four-year undergraduate degree here can run anywhere from $10k (state-run school on a commuter basis) to $250k (Yale or Harvard), with graduate school being an additional cost.

[Correction]

Most Mexicans vote Republican actually, I was there for the last elections and they were going HARD for McCain'd old ass. Guess it has something to do with him living in and representing Mexico Lite aka Arizona.

Now sure ifs its the religion thing or if it has to do with the thought that Republicans will not build a fence, but they generally don't like Dems.

Mexicans have a lot in common with poor whites, including religion, education level, income, etc. That pretty much tells you everything you need to.

[Mizango]

Mexicans have a lot in common with poor whites, including religion, education level, income, etc. That pretty much tells you everything you need to.

Good point.

[Nicholette]

The middle class generally has to save for their kids for college because they make too much to qualify for grants but not enough to pay for school outright. A loophole is that at the age of 23 financial aid is no longer based on your parents income but yours and if you've been living the "just get by" lifestyle for just the year before (year you are 22) college will pretty much be free from there till you feel like stopping. In your down years after high school take some cheap community college classes of the basics that will transfer to your university (Eng 101, 102, PSYCH Intro, First couple of Math Courses, etc.), work a shit job and save hard then travel for alot of your 22nd year, live it up, find yourself, whatever.

[ZarakiKujata]

I don't understand Texas. Don't they have a huge hispanic population? I thought hispanics typically voted democratic? Or are they like black people (i.e. don't vote at all)?

Texas has slowly been moving to the left specifically because of the growing hispanic population and influx of other liberals/liberal minded minority but there are still enough white bread hicks to tilt things towards the right. It will be maybe a decade until the real shift left happens in Texas probably. However, Hispanics are also huge social conservatives so its understandable why they wouldn't disagree with all of the Texas Board of Ed shit.

Most Mexicans vote Republican actually, I was there for the last elections and they were going HARD for McCain'd old ass. Guess it has something to do with him living in and representing Mexico Lite aka Arizona.

Now sure ifs its the religion thing or if it has to do with the thought that Republicans will not build a fence, but they generally don't like Dems.

Hispanics are just like evangelicals, they are usually very socially conservative but unless they are Cubans, are not that opposed to big government. In 2004 a big to do was made about the fact that Hispanics would not break to one party or the other but by 2008 because of Republican scaremongering they voted pretty heavily for Obama according to polls. Pockets of hispanic support for McCain are to be expected though since he was in favor of a more inclusive immigration policy for them.

[Woozie]

Most Mexicans vote Republican actually, I was there for the last elections and they were going HARD for McCain'd old ass. Guess it has something to do with him living in and representing Mexico Lite aka Arizona.

Now sure ifs its the religion thing or if it has to do with the thought that Republicans will not build a fence, but they generally don't like Dems.

Why do politicians decide what goes into our books anyways? This has always bothered me when the evolution/intelligent design debates came up in school systems. Politicians shouldn't be the ones discussing what goes in our books. An independent board of people who are actually in the fields should have the biggest say in what the students are taught. Afterall, they are the ones who know what information will be important once the kids enter the job market. Or have college professors decide since they'll know what students need to know to be successful in college. Or maybe some other system should be in place, but it shouldn't be politicians and courts having the largest say.

[Nightplague]

$25000, that's about as much as I'll pay back in total for loans on a 2year programme. And that's regardless of what school I'll be attending, as this just goes to housing costs, food and student wildlife. Since you're borrowing this from the CSN organisation, you get a low interest rate, and you're expected to have paid it off over a course of 10-30 years.

Fortunately, I get these benefits no matter where I study in europe, so I got the feeling I'll stay here until I've finished my education.

[Nightplague]

--- damn crappy internet connection

[Not not Mattaru]

If you are going totally off loan money, the 25000$ for two years seems fine. In general the best thing to consider is the money you are spending going to be likely recuperated by what job you are getting with your degree. What others have said mainly go.

I went to a state school, although CU Boulder is really poorly funded by the state and gets a lot of research money, and paid in state tuition, I am white, had a very small scholarship once, middle class. My college fund covered everything but the cost of my books, feeding myself, drinking etc. For comparison, my sister also went to CU, but applied to DU and received I think 10k scholarship for her freshman year alone that would have been extended to other years if performance continued. She would have still had to take out loans. This was when DU was around 30k a year, not whatever it is at now.

In general:
State school, in-state: around 5k a semester.
Private school, no scholarships: 30-40k a year.
Ivy: something retarded.
Public and out of state: depends, but generally analogous to a cheaper private school.

[Nightplague]

I went to a state school, although CU Boulder is really poorly funded by the state and gets a lot of research money, and paid in state tuition, I am white, had a very small scholarship once, middle class.

You're actually telling me your skin color will make a difference? If I even mentioned it over here, people would roll their eyes and think I was making a bad joke