Relic Augments

[Vyvian]

Well, if I remember right, our tests were putting us at around 22% (at 80) give or take, which could have been a 2.5% increase at 80, then a 5% increase at 85, which is why it appeared nothing happened at 85, since we all kinda expected 80 was 10%. You current test for 90 supports that progression. 5 -> 7.5 -> 10 -> 12.5. It's hard to say without drawing up a much bigger test I'd think.

Although my first tests into them were kinda small sample sizes, CI's were over 2%.

[Appie]

While Byrnoth's math could swing me in the 25.5% direction pre-acc check, making 27% if rounded up. I actually don't believe I can go back to 25.5% at this point in the parse. Parser been showing a very slow, but steady increase towards the cap of 27.55% (which would make 29% without acc check). If I dip in the parse at this stage it doesn't get lower than 27.1, then it picks itself back up, this happened a few times once the parse went over 450 counters. I'll just continue the parse to 1k counters and see if I can get closer to the 14% on Spharai or that it goes swinging the other way.

As for the 5>7.5>10>12.5% thing. I don't believe the lv90 version to be just 12.5%, would make a max counter rate of 26.1% with acc check and 17.5% if the path continues to lv99 which would seem rather silly to me as a final number. I actually think, since we had such inconclusive data on the lv85 parse that maybe the increase per stage is 3%. Seeing how we all did rather low parses back then for all stages (150-300 counters) it could still support that. Going from 5%>8%>11%>14%>17%>20% for lv99 would make more sense to me and keeps the increases at the same rate instead of 5%>2%>2%


edit:
More parsing:

Melee Damage Taken
Player             Melee Dmg   Melee %   Hit/Miss   M.Low/Hi    M.Avg  #Crit  C.Low/Hi   C.Avg     Crit%
Appie                 195860   60,89 %  1823/1655      0/199   106,75     17    63/255  181,00    0,93 %
Atuo                       0    0,00 %        0/1        0/0     0,00      0       0/0    0,00    0,00 %
Sophitia                   0    0,00 %        0/3        0/0     0,00      0       0/0    0,00    0,00 %

(...)

Defenses

Passive Defenses
Player             Evasion  Evasion %   Parry  Parry %   Counter  Counter %   Intimidate  Intimidate %
Appie                  955    25,88 %       0   0,00 %       703    27,83 %            0        0,00 %
Atuo                     0     0,00 %       0   0,00 %         0     0,00 %            1        0,00 %
Sophitia                 0     0,00 %       0   0,00 %         0     0,00 %            3        0,00 %

acc @

Melee Damage
Player            Melee Dmg   Melee %   Hit/Miss   M.Acc %  M.Low/Hi    M.Avg  #Crit  C.Low/Hi   C.Avg     Crit%
Appie               2107656   69,55 %  11554/581   95,21 %     0/664   101,94   7071    0/1257  233,44   61,20 %

Since around the 625 counters mark it shot through the 27.50% mark and kept going to this number (even had 27.91 at one point), so maybe it does cap a little higher than I thought so far.

[Kirschy]

Sooo, I should have Lv90 Apoc by next week, and I wanted to measure if there was a relic proc increase. Easiest way to do that is to get some good test data in now, and re-run a similar test after and compare the results. Anyway, I was kinda surprised at how low the proc rate was =/.

-Lv85 Apoc.
-Piasa's birds @ Abyssea-Holla
-3 Crit Atma (RR/GH/DD).
-Only AF3+2 was the Helm
-Only included Crits for this, because their variance is much smaller and makes relic procs incredibly easy to parse.

103 Relic Critical Procs, 1610 Total Criticals = ~6.4% (~1/16)

Kinda low. Hoping to see an increase in the Lv90 version. (I'm posting the raw data and some other stuffs in that PDIF distribution thread if anyone is interested.)

[Nameless]

It seems like JP tested Spharai lvl 90 to be 12% counter rate as well, apparently they thought it should be higher. Oddly enough, they think the triple proc rate for left hand is 10%. I am not sure how accurate that is.

カウンター効果アップIVはカウンター +12%らしいです(；´ω`)

Counter effect from counter IV +12

[Taint]

Sooo, I should have Lv90 Apoc by next week, and I wanted to measure if there was a relic proc increase. Easiest way to do that is to get some good test data in now, and re-run a similar test after and compare the results. Anyway, I was kinda surprised at how low the proc rate was =/.

-Lv85 Apoc.


-Piasa's birds @ Abyssea-Holla
-3 Crit Atma (RR/GH/DD).
-Only AF3+2 was the Helm
-Only included Crits for this, because their variance is much smaller and makes relic procs incredibly easy to parse.

103 Relic Critical Procs, 1610 Total Criticals = ~6.4% (~1/16)

Kinda low. Hoping to see an increase in the Lv90 version. (I'm posting the raw data and some other stuffs in that PDIF distribution thread if anyone is interested.)

I haven't parsed it but im 99% sure there is no increase at 90. Even when playing around in 5/5 +2 the proc rate is very low.

[Appie]

It seems like JP tested Spharai lvl 90 to be 12% counter rate as well, apparently they thought it should be higher. Oddly enough, they think the triple proc rate for left hand is 10%. I am not sure how accurate that is.

カウンター効果アップIVはカウンター +12%らしいです(；´ω`)

Counter effect from counter IV +12

Test data to go with that? Because considering the damn thing is still going up instead of down, I don't see 12% happening anymore. Is that 12% with acc check or without? I can see how they got to 12% even after a good parse if it is with acc check.

As for the crit proc rate thing, didn't Kirshy test it once before the data she just placed here? Coming out at 6-10% too? Which with this new data and non crit triple dmg, still seems plausible to me to be 10%. I could go through my parse too to check for that.

[Kirschy]

Test data to go with that? Because considering the damn thing is still going up instead of down, I don't see 12% happening anymore. Is that 12% with acc check or without? I can see how they got to 12% even after a good parse if it is with acc check.

As for the crit proc rate thing, didn't Kirshy test it once before the data she just placed here? Coming out at 6-10% too? Which with this new data and non crit triple dmg, still seems plausible to me to be 10%. I could go through my parse too to check for that.

Previous data samples had it around ~8% so I was guessing 1/12. This latest sample size has 1/16 around ~6.25% and has a much larger data set. Some weapons have 2.75 ftp while other have 3.0, and some weapons have 2x, 2.5x, and 3x proc, so it's not crazy to think the proc rates might vary too. 10% seems high to me, but it's a lot harder to test proc rate on a 1H weapon while dualwielding or H2H. So *shrug. I'll leave that up to other relic holders

[Appie]

Considering you're getting 6.4% just on massive crits and not accounting for normal hits that get triple dmg which are harder to see, another 3-4% for that category seems doable to me?

[Kirschy]

Considering you're getting 6.4% just on massive crits and not accounting for normal hits that get triple dmg which are harder to see, another 3-4% for that category seems doable to me?

No, since we're under the assumption that relic proc check occurs separately from crits, we can just examine critical hits. So they occur around ~6.25% chance for a critical hit and 6.25% chance for a normal hit. It's like taking a sample size of 10,000 and then only looking at a 9,000 samples. You'll still get the same %. If H2H realli gets a 10% chance to proc, thats a huge increase over Apoc's rate. Not to mention H2H gets a 3x proc, and Apoc gets 2x =/

[Atoreis]

No, since we're under the assumption that relic proc check occurs separately from crits, we can just examine critical hits. So they occur around ~6.25% chance for a critical hit and 6.25% chance for a normal hit. It's like taking a sample size of 10,000 and then only looking at a 9,000 samples. You'll still get the same %. If H2H realli gets a 10% chance to proc, thats a huge increase over Apoc's rate. Not to mention H2H gets a 3x proc, and Apoc gets 2x =/

H2h only proc on one hand so realistic proc rate with 10% on one hand is 5% for all attacks. H2H can just have more chance on one hand exactly because its only for 1/2 of all attacks and that could be an exception among all relics.

[Kirschy]

H2h only proc on one hand so realistic proc rate with 10% on one hand is 5% for all attacks. H2H can just have more chance on one hand exactly because its only for 1/2 of all attacks and that could be an exception among all relics.

Yea it's possible that could be it too. Which reminds me I didn't include it in my data, but secondary attacks like those from DA and Zanshin can't relic proc, so I guess the actual proc rate is slightly higher.... But I was only using ~9% DA. So that makes it about 1477 crits which could have relic proc'd. Then I had 81 misses, 25% of them should have proc'd zanashin, which is about 20. 5% would miss, so 19 hits, and 5% wouldn't crit, so around ~18 hits from zana that didn't proc. Makes my total crits that could have relic proc'd 1459. 103/1459 = ~ 7%. (Up from the 6.4% I got earlier.) Not much change, but a bit higher. Late night math isn't my strong suit though, so I might have made a mistake. If anyone wants to play /w the numbers, feel free~ Still seems around a 6-7% proc rate though.

[Appie]

No, since we're under the assumption that relic proc check occurs separately from crits, we can just examine critical hits. So they occur around ~6.25% chance for a critical hit and 6.25% chance for a normal hit. It's like taking a sample size of 10,000 and then only looking at a 9,000 samples. You'll still get the same %. If H2H realli gets a 10% chance to proc, thats a huge increase over Apoc's rate. Not to mention H2H gets a 3x proc, and Apoc gets 2x =/

Oh yeah, of course. Going through my parse I just noticed it isn't really useful to pinpoint relic proc since I fought amoeban too, which don't take blunt damage as well as bunnies :/

I'll keep it in mind for the stance parse and pick a different camp and equip no DA.

[gilgam]

someJP's tests.
counter merits=+5
Lv85 (95%acc) (if100%acc)
1395/5293　＝　26.36%　→　27.74%
Lv90
1232/4517　＝　27.27%　→　28.71%

MNK gets counterxxxx@Lv81, it's 12%.
12+12+5=29%. I think Enhances Counter IV is 12%.

Lv75 with counter merits+5 95% 100%
　no weapon　：639/4843　＝　13.19%　→　13.89%
Lv85
　no weapon　：852/5281　＝　16.13%　→　16.98%
job trait got 3% boost.


off topic but it's new?
attack delay reduction about NIN.

They don't need 26% haste when they have haste/double March.
it's depends Dual Wield and gear Haste.
Delay Reduction:Haste (need to cap attack delay -80%)
40% from Haste/double march.
-25%=73.33333333
-30%=71.42857143
-35%=69.23076923
-40%=66.6666667
-45%=63.63636364
-50%=60
-55%=55.55555556
-60%=50

most of NIN uses AF3 head and suppanomimi,
-45%, so they need 24% haste　from gear etc.

if you have suppanomimi
full AF3+2 twilight belt and suppanomimi=cap.
if not 26% haste with AF3 head =cap, I guess.

I think 26% haste setup is better because of TP gain.
I don't have NIN..but just feel to post this :D

[Atoreis]

someJP's tests.
counter merits=+5
Lv85 (95%acc) (if100%acc)
1395/5293　＝　26.36%　→　27.74%
Lv90
1232/4517　＝　27.27%　→　28.71%

MNK gets counterxxxx@Lv81, it's 12%.
12+12+5=29%. I think Enhances Counter IV is 12%.

Lv75 with counter merits+5 95% 100%
　no weapon　：639/4843　＝　13.19%　→　13.89%
Lv85
　no weapon　：852/5281　＝　16.13%　→　16.98%
job trait got 3% boost.


off topic but it's new?
attack delay reduction about NIN.

They don't need 26% haste when they have haste/double March.
it's depends Dual Wield and gear Haste.
Delay Reduction:Haste (need to cap attack delay -80%)
40% from Haste/double march.
-25%=73.33333333
-30%=71.42857143
-35%=69.23076923
-40%=66.6666667
-45%=63.63636364
-50%=60
-55%=55.55555556
-60%=50

most of NIN uses AF3 head and suppanomimi,
-45%, so they need 24% haste　from gear etc.

if you have suppanomimi
full AF3+2 twilight belt and suppanomimi=cap.
if not 26% haste with AF3 head =cap, I guess.

I think 26% haste setup is better because of TP gain.
I don't have NIN..but just feel to post this :D

26% haste in gear with 40% dual wield wont cap you because 26% in gear is in real 25% haste so 0.6*0.35=0.21 so 1% off. Going from 21% to 20% is 5%faster(or something) so best setup is 24% haste with 45% dual wield. It's also nothing new http://www.bluegartr.com/threads/984...t=#post4337334 posts 1364,1370,1374

[Appie]

Hmmm, next time somebody gimme this info before I run a 12hour parse XD
They didn't happen to test for a "counter cap" also did they? Would like to know before I start running for that.

One thing I don't understand though, they come to the conclusion of 29% like me, but with a counter trait boost, which is 2% at first and then 3% in the test later? I think 3% for the job trait boost would make more sense to make each Spharai increase 2% to get 11% on lv90 instead of 2.3% to get to 12%. Also makes a nice round number of +15 at lv99 >.>

Well guess I'm done with this test. I didn't even get to 1k+ counters like the JP's lol

Melee Damage Taken
Player             Melee Dmg   Melee %   Hit/Miss   M.Low/Hi    M.Avg  #Crit  C.Low/Hi   C.Avg     Crit%
Appie                 246261   59,85 %  2375/2226      0/199   102,95     23    63/255  179,65    0,97 %

(...)

Defenses

Passive Defenses
Player             Evasion  Evasion %   Parry  Parry %   Counter  Counter %   Intimidate  Intimidate %
Appie                 1327    27,18 %       0   0,00 %       904    27,57 %            0        0,00 %

Melee Damage
Player            Melee Dmg   Melee %   Hit/Miss   M.Acc %  M.Low/Hi    M.Avg  #Crit  C.Low/Hi   C.Avg     Crit%
Appie               2815617   71,83 %  15139/767   95,18 %     0/664   104,90   9214    0/1257  238,13   60,86 %

[Darkmagi]

Yeah delay reduction info has been known for a while now.

[gilgam]

really..my bad lol

[Atomic Skull]

Makes me wonder if they had something similar planned for melee relics. I mean I can see the Spharai being defensive and Vereth offensive. RNG relic low hate/hate free and emp not, but for other relics?

Wildfire is also low hate.

[Appie]

Oh, good to know.

Btw anybody who can give me an estimate of how much counter % I should expect with popping Perfect Counter whenever it's ready? 5%? I'm just wondering what SE is thinking with a 3% boost to the job trait, assuming they don't have another job trait boost planned between 90 and 99. It just seems like such a weird number to boost it with yet there it is in the jp tests =D

[spz]

http://i111.photobucket.com/albums/n...ru/spz90-1.jpg

sauro raptor:
bash1: 283
bash2: 283
bash3: 279
bash4: 286
bash5: 279


o.o ...?

edit: added 2 more bashes