Final Form Magian Weapons

[Khajit]

I don't think any HNMLS has successfully beaten PW without PLD tanks pre abyssea? Even if ppl somehow manage to figure a way out to counter Meteor AV is probably still best tanked by PLD before level cap raise/abyssea.

Easy way to make PLD useful again - nerf emnity generated by physical damage. Since SE nerfed RDM tanks I don't see why they can't do the same to melee tanks. The more ppl brag about DD tanks being superior to PLD, the more likely SE are going to adjust it.

They were killing pw with DD tanks for at least 3 months pre abyssea.

[Tsuko_Asura]

Let's take a look at evolution of tank jobs over the past few years, shall we?
PLD/WAR -> NIN/RDK -> PLD/NIN, RDM/NIN -> melee tanks (including NIN)

Hate to break it to you, but this had nothing to do with the game, only our understanding of the game. 99% of what we've been doing in recent years could have been done in the game's infancy, we just weren't aware of it.

[Obsidian]

Should probably stop derailing the thread lol.


Do what SE did to RDM hate spells, drop physcial damage CE. It won't revive RDM tank (does not hold hate or survive better than PLD), physical damage hate nerf is going to affect BLU too, if you want to go with CE BLU spells why not just stick to PLD?


Replace PLD with another DD job and let melee bounce hate? If you worry about AOE damage, use a front line job capable of healing (DNC, BLU), either is better than a PLD.

You should probably stop posting since you've been banned twice on other accounts.

Nerfing physical damage enmity would let RDM hold hate over DDs since they could just spam nukes for hate, and still deal more damage over PLD, which is the entire problem. DDs are never in any danger of dying, so why dedicate a damage sponge that does no damage when you can use something that takes less damage and does more damage to the mob.

PLD survives better than RDM? You're out of your mind.

[StateofMind]

So how good is Torcleaver and is Caladbolg the new go-to weapon for DRK?

[Cursed]

Tiger oh lord wtf is that abomination of a sig you got!

[Valisk]

Hate to break it to you, but this had nothing to do with the game, only our understanding of the game. 99% of what we've been doing in recent years could have been done in the game's infancy, we just weren't aware of it.

I disagree. A lot of gear came out making some of these things feasible. i.e. Homam

[Tsuko_Asura]

Right, because any of the best DD tanks wear Homam?

[Nightfyre]

DRK wore Homam in the relevant era, yes.

[Tsuko_Asura]

Derp, DRK is so tragically behind at the moment, I forget it was ever relevant.

Still, the number of things a DRK could tank with damage that WAR or SAM couldn't wouldn't take more than a single hand to tally, and even then, nothing about Homam made DRK tanking material. Zilart-CoP gear and bards covered that just fine.

[hexagram23]

http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f4...208_132603.png

[Valisk]

Right, because any of the best DD tanks wear Homam?

Because you quoted the DD portion of his evolution post not the tank one huh?

[Tsuko_Asura]

Try reading his post? He was remarking about how tanks have evolved from traditional tanks to DD tanks. I said DD tanks were always preferable, we just weren't aware.

And thinking Homam made PLD better to any measurable degree is laughable.

[Valisk]

Try reading his post? He was remarking about how tanks have evolved from traditional tanks to DD tanks. I said DD tanks were always preferable, we just weren't aware.

And thinking Homam made PLD better to any measurable degree is laughable.

No, you said 99% of what we've done in recent years could have been done at the game's infancy. Unless you're now (i.e 3 posts later) including PLD/NIN as the 1%, I say you were wrong.

[Tsuko_Asura]

Waiting for the major addition that's emerged in recent years that made anything we were doing right before Abyssea possible.

[Yugl]

Try reading his post? He was remarking about how tanks have evolved from traditional tanks to DD tanks. I said DD tanks were always preferable, we just weren't aware.

And thinking Homam made PLD better to any measurable degree is laughable.

It's still an incorrect statement since most forms of DD were shit in the earliest of days. One important feature is the introduction of sushi. Furthermore, such a statement neglects the changes that emerged in other fields (BRD becoming more abundant, RDM gaining Refresh, the switch in focus from IT++ XP mobs to VT with chains).

[Tsuko_Asura]

It's still an incorrect statement since most forms of DD were shit in the earliest of days. One important feature is the introduction of sushi. Furthermore, such a statement neglects the changes that emerged in other fields (BRD becoming more abundant, RDM gaining Refresh, the switch in focus from IT++ XP mobs to VT with chains).

I must be misrepresenting what I mean by the game's infancy if sushi isn't being accounted for. I'm mostly referring to pre-TOAU.

Still, everything you're describing(with the exception of refresh, which is waaaay earlier than I'm talking about >_>) is a matter of strategy change, not game development.

[Nicholette]

Haste was important to tanking evolution. Capping shadow timers used to be a big deal. Now its so easy that we forgot how hard it once was to keep them up constantly.

Sent from my HERO200 using Tapatalk

[Valisk]

Roger that.

[Tsuko_Asura]

Also a change in strategy. Your BG average WAR or SAM could have gotten ~47% haste, before considering things like HQ Panther Mask(obv. SAM doesn't apply), HQ Dusk, or Speed Belt. That's practically capped recasts.

[Tsuko_Asura]

Roger that.

What the fuck are you talking about?

Edit: If you're still on about PLD/NIN, PLD could have gotten 41% haste with minimal effort, again, before considering Speed or HQ Dusk. The only real difference would be that they'd need to learn how to time Utusemi like everyone else, what with the lack of shield mastery.