Final Form Magian Weapons

[mdkuser]

No.

its a good approx for the first two digits if you ignore zanshin.

[Demosthenes11]

yet the problem with bow is you typically use rngs when you want DDs out of AOE but still doing a lot of damage. Ebow is right at the threshold of being too much hate, and I could see this bow needing rngs to not attack for periods at a time.

there is a reason relic bow and gun have their hateless tools

[mdkuser]

how would you come to this conclusion after it was just math'd that it's the best non relic gkt? lol

we are talking about 10 krab shells, not 20k currency. stop throwing a fit

Fitsuno is better and an excellent rindomaru equal. the reason its not impressing is that polearm are miles ahead with the rigth buffs ( acc and attack), you're looking at like +30-50% damage over hagun. this is a big GK improvement over hagun, but is still pale compared to what a war, polearm sam or mnk can output.

[Thorny]

yet the problem with bow is you typically use rngs when you want DDs out of AOE but still doing a lot of damage. Ebow is right at the threshold of being too much hate, and I could see this bow needing rngs to not attack for periods at a time.

If your RNGs are pulling hate, have them put on the following:
Novia Earring
Delta Earring
Scout's Braccae(+1)
Scout's Socks(+1)
Zha'Go's Barbut
Buccaneer's belt

Total of 24 enmity with next to no loss to actual damage. Still having problems?
Add:
Beguiling Collar or Benign Necklace
Tartaglia or Staff Strap

Still having hate problems?

Spoiler: show

Get tanks that don't suck. Swapping in -30 enmity is increasing your damage needed to pull hate by 42%. You're not losing anywhere near 42% damage swapping in enm- gear. Refusing to shoot is retarded.

there is a reason relic bow and gun have their hateless tools

I did specifically say '(and competitive with relic if the enm- isn't needed, but not sure if there are any places that applies really)'. I know hate is an issue for RNGs.

[pchan]

Edit: Ah-hah! Another option would be to just accuracy correct the Soboro distribution itself and use the new probabilities, which I could do in my spreadsheet right now if it wasn't for 0-hit cases.

Yes, but ajusting soboro probabilities can be tricky. If you add the DA it's even more complicated. If the inital distribution for 1/2/3 swing is [0.30,0.50,0.20] then with 95% acc and 0% DA rate the probabilities of 0hits/1hit/2hits/3hits is now

[0.0162750,.3339250,.4783250,.1714750]

The formula with p accuracy (p=0.95 for instance) and d (0.17 for instance) double attack would be

[.3*(1.-1.*a)*(1.-1.*d)+.2*(1.-1.*a)^3+.5*(1.-1.*a)^2 ,(.3*(1.-1.*a)*d+.3*a*(1.-1.*d)+1.0*(1.-1.*a)*a+.6*(1.-1.*a)^2*a),(.5*a^2+.3*a*d+.6*(1.-1.*a)*a^2),.2*a^3]

[Shadida]

If your RNGs are pulling hate, have them put on the following:
Novia Earring
Delta Earring
Scout's Braccae(+1)
Scout's Socks(+1)
Zha'Go's Barbut
Buccaneer's belt

Total of 24 enmity with next to no loss to actual damage. Still having problems?
Add:
Beguiling Collar or Benign Necklace
Tartaglia or Staff Strap

Still having hate problems?

Spoiler: show

Get tanks that don't suck. Swapping in -30 enmity is increasing your damage needed to pull hate by 42%. You're not losing anywhere near 42% damage swapping in enm- gear. Refusing to shoot is retarded.

I did specifically say '(and competitive with relic if the enm- isn't needed, but not sure if there are any places that applies really)'. I know hate is an issue for RNGs.

This a million times. Folks think I'm crazy for using my enmity minus build, yet I'm going all out on Odin and other longer fights without taking hate.

Don't forget:
Legion Scutum
Trooper's Ring

Also 4x Stealth Shot is awesome for non-relic RNGs, I highly recommend it.

[Shinryuu]

Minus enmity gear is kinda meh since you'll cap hate anyway. The real solution is high jump.

[Shadida]

Hoping they add some sort of hate reduction tool for RNG, if all the hot air they were blowing at the Fan Fest is to believed. I've learned not to get my hopes up too high though.

[Viq]

Reraise Gorget is the real -enm for RNG. Pull hate, die, get up, and get back to doing more damage than the wimps.

[Leolai]

Minus enmity gear is kinda meh since you'll cap hate anyway. The real solution is high jump.

This.

RNG/DRG with -enmity build and high jump is brutal. Usually parse 24k-27k dmg on odin (depending on attendance) without pulling hate until sub 10% zerg.

I have tried the pull hate/RR for hate reset, but the downtime from doing just that is alot of lost damage. (not to mention risks of moving mobs, which isn't always wanted).

[Aevis]

400 plants and 300 ladybugs killed me. I got about a 30k buffer doing all of that. XD

yeah, those are brutal if you're solo without a kclub. i was lucky enough to have a ls buddy who was upgrading his bravura. we went to boyahade and i just kept nonstop pulling mandies for him while he smashed them. worked well and i saved tons of arrows. i solo'd around 40, bloodtanked as rng/sam while dboxing a rmd for pro4 phal2 and a cure3 every now and then. took ages and the quivers were gone way too fast.

ladybugs was a lot easier. biddybugs in jugner forest [S], near the east ronfaure zone. 6 there and 6 across the river, could just run up and down and they were always up. with subs, hasso and the gimp goshawk, i did sw's ranging from 1.5 to 1.7k, which is more than half their hp. add a barrage and you 2-shot them. duo'd first 150 ish with a pld/dnc friend who needed vermins under earthsday. another 160 with two random jps (sam + rdm) which were doing gkt and solo'd the last ones. capped exp on rng for the very first time :3

i'd advise every rng to get some melee and duo that shit, it's just quicker and cheaper. the only alternativ may be kclubing while dboxing some healer, especially the biddybugs since they are so squishy. i don't have access to one, so can't tell for sure.

[Allelujah]

yeah, luckily I have a Kclub, so it made things alot easier. I also teamed up w/ a Bravura in the tree for about 50 kills. The ladybugs kinda sucked. I also went to Jugner S for biddybugs RNG/DNC.

My LS killed 3 krabs today and 5 shells dropped putting me at 8/10. I'm so anxious to finish this.

[Shadida]

yeah, luckily I have a Kclub, so it made things alot easier. I also teamed up w/ a Bravura in the tree for about 50 kills. The ladybugs kinda sucked. I also went to Jugner S for biddybugs RNG/DNC.

My LS killed 3 krabs today and 5 shells dropped putting me at 8/10. I'm so anxious to finish this.

Go go go!! Sounds like you're furthest along, I'm just 1/10 on my gun with two Verthandi pops.

[Seol]

Slightly unrelated or not as awesome as OAT weapons and such, but yesterday there were 3 Teiwaz with +15% cure potency finished in Shiva, then:

(Can't post pics etc)
http://img231.imageshack.us/img231/5907/bubupixie.jpg

[Shadida]

Oh shit.

[Allelujah]

I'm confused. Pixie?

Gonna try to finish tomorrow. I'll post results when I get em.

[Jeryhn]

Showing a Pixie popping in present day areas due to spammage of Bottled Pixies to the spring.

[vagus]

Showing a Pixie popping in present day areas due to spammage of Bottled Pixies to the spring.

Neat. How long before some idiot kills it?

[Clerix]

Edit: nevermind

[BrayenMidgard]

So from what i am reading the new hierarchy now for weapons would be:

Magian OAT(excluding h2h) > Max DMG Magian alternative(Gk still beaten by Hagun) > Older options/ Other Magian Alternatives > bad choices?

Is this correct? and Am i missing any other exceptions? (excluding range since it hasnt been confirmed yet)